Replies

1. 
   Pro-Dek | Oct 02, 2001 03:18am | #1

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   Cedar treads are fine especially at 14" o.c. I would NOT route out your stair jacks because this makes a place to trap water and rot out the treads.Your stair jacks should be pressure treated because they are making contact with the ground.(another place to trap water.I know you don't want to use treated, but it is made for outdoor use. Happy stair building! Bob

1. 
   Luka_ | Oct 02, 2001 03:43am | #2

   *David,In a word, no.Steps/treads, yes. Stringers, no.As Bob said, it would be fine for the steps, because they are only 14 inches on center. But to route it and use it for stringers, no. I don't think it would hold up to use, especialy after you route it. And that center stringer... Cut from cedar... If it doesn't break the first time you look at it, I'll be very surprised.I wouldn't do it.

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   CaseyR_ | Oct 02, 2001 05:28am | #3

   *If want to avoid the pressure treated lumber because of the heavy metals (chromium, copper, and arsenic, typically), there are alternative wood treatments that don't use these components. If it is for esthetic reasons, I can't tell what the alternatives look like. One alternative is the ACQ treatment as described at http://www.built-e.com/shop.mv?CatCode=PRODUCT&ProdCode=ACQ_SILL_PLATES . A couple of companies that supply this product and have web pages are http://www.conradwp.com/acq.htm and http://www.bbslumber.com/acq.htmlThere are some other formulations, but most generally are not for severe exposure conditions. I have been trying to get some of this stuff locally to try it out but no one stocks it. It is a special order item at out local lumber yards as well as at Lowes and they are too happy about ordering just a couple of small sticks for me to try out and the closest place that carries it is over a hundred miles each way. Of course, the first guy that I talked to at Lowes was happy to tell me that CCA absolutely did not have any arsenic in it. After I asked him why they used the word "arsenic" in the label, he decided that may it had just a little arsenic in it...

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   Schelling_McKinley | Oct 02, 2001 11:19am | #4

   *David-For a 44" stringer, you can use cedar or just about any other wood you want. Needless to say it shouldn't have any big ugly spike knots but you ought to be able to pick out a few decent boards. You will eventually get rot but cedar is somewhat rot resistant and will last ten to twenty years. Then you can build another set.

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   David_Patrick | Oct 02, 2001 03:52pm | #5

   *Thanks for the reply. I think the key in my plan is that the stair stingers are only going to be 44" in length, and by not cutting the outer stringers for the stair treads, this would provide these stringers with greater strength. Your point about the water trap in the routed areas is a good one, but I thought that all areas would be pre-treated with Penofin prior to assembly is possible, thereby reducing any possible damage that might occur. Also, the areas of the stringers that contact the ground would be sealed with Gorilla glue or epoxy, thereby increasing their resistance to rot etc. Candidly, I know a lot of people still use pressure treated lumber, but there is a growing resistance to it. I for one don't want to use the stuff. The debate continues on the leaching of arsenic from the CCA treated wood, and both sides haven't worked it out yet. In the meantime, I don't want to contribute to any possible arsenic leaching etc. Perhaps my opinion is viewed as a bit strong, but I seriously think I would go ahead and make these stairs out of ipe if cedar isn't going to "cut it".Thanks again for your input and best of luck in the future.

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   piffin_ | Oct 03, 2001 06:33am | #6

   *I would use closer spacing and have two center stringers. Cedar splits extremely easily as Luka mentioned. By having two you have a little insurance for the fat lady. She likes to sing because of all the lawsuits she's won. ;>)Penofin will not stop wicking of water into the cells. anytime you trap water it will do damage. Take that to the bank. It's an iron bound gaurantee.Gorilla glue won't last that long as a sealer in exterior applications from exposure to UV rays. After it foams out it is porous too. Epoxy Maybe ? You can also dig down four inches and fill back with stone to let water drain away from the wood.The best waterproof, structural glue for exterior application is PL Premium, in my range of experience. If you glue your joint with a gap filling with body like this, you deny access to the water.

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   David_Patrick | Oct 03, 2001 06:33am | #7

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   I have to build a small three-step set of stairs with a stringer length of approx. 44". I DO NOT want to use pressure treated lumber, if at all possible (which is a loaded topic, I'm know). I intend to have three stringers, as the step width will be 42", and the outer stringers won't be cut for run/rise but routed to recess the steps. Will cedar be stong enough? I am hearing conflicting information. Please let me know and thanks