I’m replacing some light switches in my home. I have a light that is operated by 4 different switches. Is this a 5 Way switch? Do they make 5 Way switches?
I know if I go to Home Depot and ask I will get nothing but a blank stare.
Thanks!
Mike – Aurora, IL
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Replies
There are 2 ea (3 screw) 3 way switches and 3 ea (4 screw) 4 way switches in your switch configuration.
The 3 ways are at the ends of the circut and the 4 ways are in between. Power in one end and the light off of the other end...
Pay close attention when you remove the wires. Which wire came off of which screw... Mess up the sequence and yur in for a night mare...
Power off if you will when you work on it please.
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
<Mess up the sequence and yur in for a night mare...>
Oh yeah...haw haw haw haw!
Sequence is a 3-way switch followed by any number of 4-way switches and another 3-way switch bringing up the rear. In your case two 3-ways and two 4-way switched will get you there.
My mistake on the count....
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
I ain't a very good Arteest, but this might help.
Edit - see corrected illustration two posts or so to the South
Edited 2/7/2004 5:37:22 PM ET by Jim
Nice sketch. I especially like the black tape on the ends of the white wire. I don't think the schematic of the 4-way switches is quite right, though. Your sketch suggests that either the blacks are connected and the reds are open, or the reds are connected and the blacks are open. What really happens is that the switch connects black to black and red to red, or black to red and red to black, either straight across or in an X. All four terminals are always connected to something.
I think this is more accurate for the 4 way's
And, while the line drawing shows the "input" blacks and reds on one side of the switch and the "output" on the other, read the instructions on your switches. They may be set up with inputs on top and outputs on bottom.
Edited 2/8/2004 9:28:02 AM ET by Jim
Alright!
HOW did this guy get a straight forward answer!!!
Somebody, A lot of somebodys, Dropped the ball here.
The correct response should have been:
(Repeat after me)
Sure your can get 5-way and 6-way switches.
Try your local electrical supply.
Lowes and Home Depot don't carry them.
Be sure you wire them in the right order.
They will come in a box packed in the order they should be installed.
Do not mix them up or they will not work properly and you may burnout the delicate internal electronics.
C'mon People this was good for at least one trip to the Electrical supply house.
Mr T
Do not try this at home!
I am an Experienced Professional!
Remodeling Lead Carpenter w/ 20 years exp.
+ A Construction Engineering Degree
Or six if you get your way....
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
forget the elemental toggle logic, go with 1960's GE/bryant type relays (what my house has) , or go with newer parallel port computer based controls.
I agree.
There are a bunch of X-10 and some "add a switch" products that will do this.
And 4-way switches are not cheap.
And if this is a retro fit fishing 4 conductor cable is fun. Along with finding big enough boxes for the box fill.
http://www.smarthome.com
Liked your diagram of the 3/4 way switches you provided. One minor technical point is that the white wire should be the supply to the series of switches to comply with 200.7 C (2) of the 2002 NEC code. At least that's the way that I read the code. It's the same thing when feeding a switch with Romex out of the fixture where power is at the light fixture. Connect the switch leg white lead to the other black (feed) and run to the switch. That way the black lead from the switch connects to the fixture black lead. This makes sense as you will know what's going on in the ceiling box when you see a white wire connected directly to a black feed wire-a switch leg!
To show this in your sketch might have confused the issue but I believe it should be wired as above!
Your knowledge of the code is probably much better than mine. I am just a DIY-er, a careful one, but still not a pro.
I always try and be as clear as I can when wiring. That was why I marked the white "switched" lead from the chain of switches with black "tape" in the dwg. . . Just to point out that it was not a neutral. I'd probably do the same in the other switch boxes, too. I don't ever mix the colors any worse than that though.
Sometimes I draw a little diagram of how I wired something and stuff it in the box. I know what it is like to be the second person to the scene. . . .(or even when I have to look at my own work again at a much later date). Same goes for instructions on little timers and such - fold up instruction sheet (or copy onto thin paper and reduce in size) and put it in the box.
Thanks for the advice, though.
Jim, You are way ahead of the game!!! Your marking the white wire with tape is not only a good idea but is required by code where ever a white or gray wire or a wire with 3 continuous white stripes is used as other than a grounded conductor (a neutral, etc.) The wire must be permanently reidentified to indicate its use by painting or other effective means at its terminations and at each location where the conductor is visible and accessible. The code paragraph 200.7 C covers this and the fact that the reidentified white wire should only be used as the supply to the switch and not as the return from the switch to the device it controls. As I mentioned, your diagram would have been more confusing if you had drawn it with the white wire as the supply. There are so many thousands of rules in the NEC code book that even experienced journeymen electricians have a hard time keeping up with the changes that come out or just remembering all the "old rules". Here in Oregon, we have to take classes and pass exams to keep licenses valid. One of the tests covers the new code whenever it comes out and must be completed within the next 12 months or out you go!!!! The 2002 code is 711 pages long but the tests are "open book." They are usually timed and there is never enough time for every question!!!
Your idea to make diagrams is excellent and don't let anyone laugh at it. I sometimes write notes on the underside of device covers so that I can go back later and not have to trace things out all over again. Another trick I picked up from an old timer is to always run wires into the same holes like into the main panel for a home. If the home run for a specific circuit such as a microwave outlet, etc. comes into the panel in a standard place everytime, then it is much easier for you to identify whats, what later when the drywall is up and the memory has faded. The more organized your installations are, the easier it is to make it all work later or trouble shoot it if something goes wrong. I also use a tone generator/locator designed for telephone work to trace out circuits but only if de-energized!!! These can help spot bad connections in boxes such as wires slipping partway out of wirenuts where 3 or more wires are joined or someone is in a big hurry and forgets to strip the insulation off a wire before putting on the nut!!!!
Well, good luck with your projects and work safely!!!!
Dave R.
Thanks! Nice Graphic.
I'm putting the old fashioned pushbutton switches (UL Approved of course)Mike K
Amateur Home Remodeler in Aurora, Illinois
Just make it a a 3 way or a 4 switch if you will please. Mind the cabling...
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....