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I MANAGED RETAIL LUMBERYARDS FOR ALMOST 20 YEARS BEFORE STARTING A Sped-home BUSINESS. WE SOLD PINE DOORS [ND108] TO FOLKS WHO WANTED TO PAINT THEIR DOORS BUT DINT WANT THE COMPOSITE/HARDBOARD TYPES. FOR THOSE WHO WANTED TO STAIN DOORS WE SUPPLIED FIR/HEMLOCK DOORS. {F66} THE WOOD GRAIN WAS MUCH FINER. A LITTLE TRICK TO USE ON PINE[EVEN ON YELLOW PINE CAR-SIDING] IS TO MIX A 4/1 RATIO OF DOWNY OR LIKE FABRIC SOFTENER WITH WATER AND COAT THE WOOD. AFTER THE MIXTURE DRIES THE STAIN TAKES MORE EVENLY.
$70. FOR A ND108 PINE SLAB IS REALLY CHEAP. I SOLD PER-HUNG UNITS WITH CASING AND 4-5/8 SPLIT JAMBS FOR AROUND $160.00 MAKING ABOUT A 20% MARGIN.
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Replies
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JUST NOTICED THE "SPELLING CHECK" CHANGED SPEC-HOME INTO A SPED-HOME AND A PRE-HUNG INTO A PER-HUNG DOOR. SHOULD HAVE LET MY 14 YEAR OLD PROOF READ.
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Hey Jim - do you know about the "West Coast Door" factory outlet on Pine Street in Tacoma? Great buys on all kinds of doors - interior, exterior, six panel, flat single panel, prehungs, you name it. You might give them a call, or swing down there for a look.
*Next time try using the CAPSLOCK checker as well.
*Bill and all - The sealer I mentioned was, in fact, the Minwax pre-stain wood conditioner. I never thought about trying Danish Oil, although I've tried it in the past on other woods. Maybe part of the problem is that I've always stained walnut, oak, and cherry before, but not pine. Maybe my expectations were just too high. I like the idea of the Fir doors - Maybe I'll check into that next time.Thanks for all the responses...........
*Yes, the VG fir panel doors I've been buying from the lumberyard DOG pile (Damaged or Obsolete Goods, it turns out to mean) for $30 ($150+ retail) are really pretty. The thing is, I need painted doors and now feel bad about covering them up.I was unhappy with the yellow-can conditioner stuff -- the results still look like dirty wood. I'll try some of the suggestions here soon, and throw in a vote for shellac. I finished a fir handrail with clear shellac + some orange shellac for color -- it has a very nice depth to it, goes on easily, dries fast (15 minutes to the touch!), and being alcohol-based is much more pleasant to work with.Pine is pine, and not oak, cherry, or some other wood ... but it sure is becoming the dominant wood ... great to have some ideas on natural finishes for it. I'm not so wild about the oxidize-to-brown rustic look, except in, well, rustic settings.
*Hi Jim, thanks for the info.I called West coast door, they dont handle 6-panel pine but pointed me to The Door Store in Seattle. They have pre-hung 6-panel pine for $139 in clear or knotty, perfect for my cabin. Thanks again. jim
*b Arrgh!!!> They're pine doors. All pine is going to look splotchy if you don't be careful. It's a soft wood. The absolute best way to do it is Anilinee. Then shoot sanding sealer over that. Then tone it, then shoot lacquer finish........ Or you could use wood conditioner and several light coats of stain. Cherry does this too, so sand down to 220 grit and that will also help immensly.
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I bought a couple of 6 panel pine doors recently, and got a couple of surprises.
First, I was surprised how much sanding was required. I assumed the doors would basically be ready to finish, but both doors required a good hour or more of sanding. Is this normal ?
Also - they were really difficult to stain, and I'm not really happy with the results. I tried using sanding sealer 1st, followed up with a brush on (liquid) stain. Then I tried a gel stain without the sanding sealer. Neither seemed to bring out the wood grain the way I'd hoped.
Do any of you have some "magic formula" for finishing these doors ?
*Ron,There may not really be much wood grain to "bring out". These are pine doors remember. Pine is not usually the first choice for beautiful grain lovers. The summer wood that is lighter in color in unstained wood is likely to absorb stain more readily than the winter wood, resulting in a reverse color effect after staining that I find really objectionable. Pine, varnished and left alone will eventually patinate and darken naturally going from pale to tan to brown evenly. Just give it 50 years exposure to the sun. If you are impatient then you will have to imitate the process by sealing the wood, which your post suggests that you tried. You don't say what sealer you used. There are numerous sealers you can use to prevent the stain from getting sucked into the soft wood. Minwax make a sealer that you apply, wait 10 minutes and stain. I have had some good luck with this on pine. On pine as well as other woods I have used glue-size (a diluted hide glue mixture) and diluted shelac with good results at preventing blotching althou both require light sanding after the sealer dries. Then apply your stain of choice, but I don't recommend going for a really dark color.Jeff Jewitt is a frequent contributor at the Fine Woodworking site and would have some sound advice for you. I would also recommend visiting the Techniques section of this site, there are a couple of articles on blotch free finishing that would be useful to read.
*Hi Ron, The last 2 houses I trimmed out had 6panel pine doors. These doors were quite smooth and required no sanding. The owners of both homes had the doors and woodwork finished professionally. In the one home the painters applied a wood stain to the doors first, and then applied a sanding sealer which When dry was lightly sanded with 220 grit sanding pads. the final step was to shoot lacquer over the sanding sealer. These doors showed no splotching; However, the stain used was quite light. In the other home, the painters applied a wipe on coat of WATCO Danish Oil in clear color. Several days later, 2 coats of a wiping varnish was applied over the danish oil. Personally, I like the way the second method turned out as it really highlited the grain. You say you applied a sealer first. Was it a sanding sealer or a pre-stain conditioner? The MinWax product Bill spoke of is a pre stain. Sanding sealer is applied after the stain. I usually don't do any finishing, but with as many pine doors and windows I've installed recently you can't help but to take notice. MDM
*i "coat of WATCO Danish Oil in clear color. Several days later, 2 coats of a wiping varnish was applied over the danish oil."They weren't six panel doors but...DH and I are doing most of the trim in our house in pine to match our floors. He found that the Danish oil method is the best to use, after trying several other staining methods. He did it first on a set of built in bookshelves he made for all my cookbooks. They are beautiful. We are going to replace all the hollow-core doors on our bedrooms with six-panel pine ones and this is the method we are going to use for those, as well.
*Ron -- we just got through doing all our 6-panel pine doors. Had same problems -- very splotchy, uneven. Found that using Minwax Wood Conditioner (comes in yellow cans, 1 qt) before staining really helped A LOT. We finished off with a coat of Velvit Oil (a pigmented oil that also hardens the wood as it cures, somewhat like Watco).We orbit sand with 120 grit before applying the conditioner. Our final look is somewhat rustic but lots of grain shows.
*I'm going to use 6-panel interior pine doors for a cabin I'm building. How much are you people paying for your doors? What brand?jim
*Don't know the brand, JimL, but I've priced them out at $70. each, pre-sanded, and pre-drilled for the lockset.
*The builder I installed the doors for purchased them from A local lumber yard that has it's own door plant. The doors themselves were from Stallion out of St Claire MN. A 2-8 door already pre hung in a wood jamb runs about $185.00. Hi CLS, did your doors come with jambs? If they did, you really got a bargain! BTW, that WATCO sure brings out the beauty of the wood doesn't it. MDM.
*Mind didn't come with jams - didn't price out those, although maybe I should. Yes, the Danish oil is wonderful. Especially because DH and I didn't go for a stain when we refinished the floors, so we try to keep the rest of the woodwork the same color.
*Pine.....grain.....near the stream,aj
*AJ, I want some of whatever you're smokin'.....sounds peaceful.......near that stream.....
*I MANAGED RETAIL LUMBERYARDS FOR ALMOST 20 YEARS BEFORE STARTING A Sped-home BUSINESS. WE SOLD PINE DOORS [ND108] TO FOLKS WHO WANTED TO PAINT THEIR DOORS BUT DINT WANT THE COMPOSITE/HARDBOARD TYPES. FOR THOSE WHO WANTED TO STAIN DOORS WE SUPPLIED FIR/HEMLOCK DOORS. {F66} THE WOOD GRAIN WAS MUCH FINER. A LITTLE TRICK TO USE ON PINE[EVEN ON YELLOW PINE CAR-SIDING] IS TO MIX A 4/1 RATIO OF DOWNY OR LIKE FABRIC SOFTENER WITH WATER AND COAT THE WOOD. AFTER THE MIXTURE DRIES THE STAIN TAKES MORE EVENLY.$70. FOR A ND108 PINE SLAB IS REALLY CHEAP. I SOLD PER-HUNG UNITS WITH CASING AND 4-5/8 SPLIT JAMBS FOR AROUND $160.00 MAKING ABOUT A 20% MARGIN.