I was thinking of saving a hundred bucks and using some chain link fence in a concrete slab I am pouring instead of wire mesh. Anybody think of a reason I shouldn’t do this?
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fiber
fiber
Fiber is great for reducing microcracking, but it's no replacement for mesh. You need both, or at least the wire mesh or rebar.
Can't tell you how many "concrete experts" think fiber can be used instead of mesh. Really rather scary.
woodturner,Fiber does replace wire. This comes from tech bulletins from supplier and info online.Read here. http://www.concretenetwork.com/concrete/slabs/fibers.htmKK
If you read farther into the site you can find where they admit that it's an alternative the wire only in some applications.SamT
Sam,Didn't see that. Got a link?I have been using fiber instead of wire for a while and have not had any problems. I am very picky about pouring on a good base and slump.KK
If you get a good base and use good mud, you probably don't need WWM or FM. Those are the single two most important criteria for slabs. The next is proper curing. If you have all three, that's all you need.You might want soemthing around the edges or load bearing points.That link above, look on the bottom left for "new something something macro something something."SamT
In my area, the soil heaves quite a bit and is mostly clay. I am just a rook at concrete, but have found that a good, solid, and deep base is the best solution for a good finished product. The base needs to be at least 8" deep such as berm. If possible, adding another4-6" of larger stone below this will be even better. It seems to me that people think that they need to beef up the thickness of the concrete to get better results.
I completed a new install sidewalk this past fall with using no rebar or mesh. I did use fiber. We had record rain and I have poor drainage. Some water managed to get under my sidewalk, caused it to heave about 1" and later settled back to normal. I thought for sure the sidewalk would buckle under the pressure, but it moved as a unit, and still no cracks, not even in the joints.
Fiber does replace wire. This comes from tech bulletins from supplier and info online.
Both of whom want to sell you THEIR product.
Fiber does not replace mesh. As an engineer, I assure you that the fiber you will find at your local readymix shop will NOT be a replacement for mesh (The right kind of mesh, in the proper lengths and quantity can approximate the performance of mesh, but it is impractical to use - 6" to 12" fibers don't mix well).
Sorry to be so dogmatic about this, but I can't tell you how many times I have been called in to do failure analysis where fiber was used instead of mesh. There is a reason code does not allow it, DOT does not allow it, and commercial buildings don't use it.
Edited 8/10/2007 8:28 am ET by woodturner9
For a small pad on stable soil, with a good base course, maybe I would go with just fibermesh, but that sure is a lot of caveats and a small light use item.
As a structural engineer, I have to agree with woodturner9. Fibermesh is a nice product and will keep regular concrete from microcracking in the surface, which keeps moisture and salt intrusion to a minimum.
On DOT jobs, the concrete usually has a high microsilica content which provides increased workability, high early strength gain, and a reduction in microcracking.
Fibermesh is used in shotcrete tunnel linings, but to compare that mesh with the readily available stuff is like apples and oranges....that's not a mistake, it's rustic
Local PTA paid for a full size basketball court that only had plastic mesh.... Bad...Bad...Bad
The soil was black clay. Concrete contractor did nothing else to the soil. It lasted 2 years before cracking began. Then the cracks opened wider. Finally, it was broken up and hauled away.
I had a driveway poured and happen to have some 1/2" telephone pole anchor cable. Rebar was used, but I wired and weaved the cable into the rebar grid. No cracks so far.
If you use chainlink, I'd say to run a few 1/2" rebars along the stuff and wire it to it to keep any wild corners or bent places from poking up as the concrete is poured.
Bill
i don't know if it helps or not (adding the chain link fence) but i'm guilty of doing it more than once... concrete is still there no cracks so... might have helped or nothing was needed...
p
Seen old bed springs.
Worked, SOB to break up.
Joe H
BTDT
SamT
And anything else metal that's skinney enuff to fit. Metal fence posts, gates, bumpers...
I broke up my "unreinforced" foundation to "save" some money on a remodel and found drive shafts, bumpers etc... Mike
Trust in God, but row away from the rocks.
Wire mesh is there to keep the concrete from separating when it eventually cracks. Hopefully, it will crack at the expansion joints, but it will crack sooner or later.
To do it's job, the wire mesh needs to be up in the slab and not laying on the ground under it. Wire mesh can be set on pillows and/or lifted into the mix during the pour.
How would you get your chain link fencing up in the slab?
This pour is only 12' x 12' I figure I could just pull it up a bit into the mix as I fill the form. Same as I would do for wire mesh.
$100 for 144 sq ft of wire mesh!!?? You gotta be kidding!! - lol
A few weeks ago, my buddy got a 300' roll of 4' high hog wire for around $300.
Where should I start?
First of all I only need 144 sf but last I checked you can't buy just 144 sf. Smallest I can get is 5' x 150 ft. That's 750 sf at 91 bucks a roll. That is about 12 cents a sf. Granted if I could buy just what I need I wouldn't have even raised the question. But I have the roll of fencing and it won't cost me a dime to use it. But I want the job to last so I asked opinions. I didn't think I would get laughed at by a guy who thinks you can buy 144 sf of wire mesh.
And by the way Your friend should have bought the mesh where I would have got mine. He paid .25 cents a square foot. I wonder how much of it he needed?
Just get a couple pieces of flat stock remesh
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Our local supplier has both 4x4 and 6x6 mesh in sheets that measure 7 1/2' x 20'. That's 150 square feet...... pretty close to what you need. Check with the real steel suppliers, not just with a general building products place. The mesh that is sold in sheets is also a lot easier to work with then the rolled stuff.
Using Chain Link fence in concrete
Have you had any issues with using the chain link fence in concrete? I have a project in crawspace that there is a wall (non load bearing) but within a 3 sided wall contains a footing for the home which wasn't really being supported properly.
I am looking at using the chain link fence within the wall to help reinforce it and prevent cracking and wanted to know if you were successful???
Thank you in advance
Chain-link fence wire is not resistant to stretch in the long direction, and will do a relatively poor job of preventing cracks.