We’ll soon be replacing about 25 very old (possibly over 100 yrs), very large (as much as 50×96) DH windows. I noticed that much of the panes, maybe all, are the old wavy glass. Anyone have an idea if this stuff has any value, or is it dumpster bait?
PaulB
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Replies
Absolutly, at least around here, I'd buy all ya have in heart beat.
I just paid 45.00$ for 10pcs of double strength (1/8" thick) 10x18..or 4.50 each. I can't often get the wavy soda glass that I need and it would be double that if I could locate it (new).
Seed glass ( tiny bubbles) is readily available but plain wavy is getting hard to find.
Seriously, if it is packed for shipping, it is sellable.
I'll be using hundreds of sqft during the summer..I'm interested.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "
Me.
Really interesting Duane... thanks for the info. As we get ready to take out the sashes, I'll see how much agida is involved in removing the panes and shipping issues. Frankly, I'd much prefer to find a local buyer, but don't have a clue who to approach.
Hope summer's treating you well...PaulB
Go head and Craigs list it or local glass shop even, it is coveted by us that restore old sash. The removal is a bear, expect losses. A heat gun will increase those losses. I've not found a foolproof method , it all depends on the type/age/condition of the putty and points.
The glass is prone to breakage when re-cut, due to the varying thickness, so I have a lot of loss reusing it as well. It almost has to be spot less for shipping, no hunks of putty still attached, and each pane separated with cardboard or 1/8" ply, then crated, no boxing with cardbaord. I know this becuse I have ordered and had shipped this before.
I REALLY wish I was closer, but then again, all the sash I am doing are around here..LOL.
Yeah, work is steady this summer and looks like a full fall as well..winter I am planning on a slow Jan. and Feb. ( I may be getting a recurring lung issue fixed) and from there? who knows. A lot more work at home stuff right now, lots and lots and lots of glazing,and rebuilding some cool stuff.
You staying busy?Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
We're working, but that's about it. Things are reallyyyyyyyyyyy quiet. We tooka few jobs that I shouldn't have, have a decent one coming up (the window replacement) but it's gonna be a lean year I'm afraid...PaulB
Sad to hear, I was in SE Pa. this weekend and Cutler and Toll Bros. were at a standstill from what I could see, a new Lowes near my Mom's just breaking ground, but new houses looked spotty.
I'm lucky, if I run outta work, I just go and break some windows..LOLSpheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Need any rocks?PaulB
Only if they fit my slingshot (G)Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
> The removal is a bear, expect losses.
In a case like this, maybe a local buyer would be interested in it still in the old sash. He could let the buyer do that work and take that risk.
-- J.S.
True. Or possibly the sash are re-furbishable. I know that some I do are common size to many other homes of the same vintage, and often those sash on the South and West sides are more dilapidated than those on the East and North, being as they recieve the harsh sun and west winds in our storms. Possibly they could be swapped into new positions in a different house.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Stripped many an old sash for it's wavy glass-had a historic job, with a committed owner (plain glass would have been OK)Used a mini butane torch, a six inch drywall knife as a shield, and a very sharp Pro-prep stripper to pull the putty. Still broke a fair amount, and probably breathed in more lead paint than I should have.....BTW, the Prazzi glazing tool sucks......
BTW, the Prazzi glazing tool sucks......Best glazing tool I ever used is the most flexible 1-1/4" putty knife I own, and a little practice.--------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
I actually like the real, two sided traditional Hyde glazing tool....and interestingly enough, it's a stiff blade. To each his own, I guess!
Have you ever used a cal-rod or soldering iron?As long as GOD makes "bad builders" and rich people... I will have a job
Yeah - save it for sure. It's worth the time to take it out. If Duane doesn't buy it you ought to be able to find a buyer for the whole lot.
http://grantlogan.net
"I could have had Miss September...... I couuld have had Miss May. I could have had Miss November, but I waited for December....." ZZ Top.
I live outside Albany, NY. I know some people that might be able to p/u some of the glass. Let me know when you are ready and the cost.
"It is what it is."
I've had great luck with craigslist, although we do have half a million people nearby, which helps.
The glass is worth something if you're looking for it, but not worth keeping otherwise. You might call a few remodelers, we often have use for some old glass to replace broken pieces, either by our own hand or existing.
Having said all that, you might be better off to sell the window complete. Many people are starting to rebuild old windows, especially in moderate climates, and if it has any esthetic value it would be easy to sell for the price of pizza and a beer.
Best of luck.
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
I just did some math, I am paying 2.5 cents a square INCH for new float glass. I seem to recall the new "wavy glass" was closer to 15 cents a Sq.In. and there was a minimum order of 6 sqft ( not one pane, but accrued measure)..so yeah..it's plenty valuble.
Oh yeah, the old "soda" glass also has the greenish hue, vs the new greyer hues, they stand out if mixed in the same sash.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Edited 6/30/2008 7:20 pm ET by Sphere
Where are you? I might be interested. What is the lite pattern/size on the sash?Steve
I'm in CT, Steve. The windows vary but I'd say most are 6/6 or more...big uns.PaulB
I removed some panes last autumn to replace with thermal panes, and didn't want to break out the glass for fear of damaging the sash, so I remove almost all panes intact. It was work but not insurmountable.
What I did was use paint remover to soften the putty, then scraped with a 'pull' type scraper. It took 3 applications to get down to wood.
http://weblog.xanga.com/DIYGuy/606019193/removing-the-old-glazing-compound.html
Then on the inside I made sort of a duct tape handle to keep the glass from falling, as I gently and evenly sliced around the edges with a thin putty knive (very flexible type), and the panes just dropped out. A couple of them cracked, as was expected. But I think 15 of the 18 panes came out fully intact. And it didn't take that long at all.
And then there's how NOT to do it...
http://weblog.xanga.com/DIYGuy/520964053/removing-a-broken-window-pane-the-easy-way.html
--------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
I'm thinking about replacing some single light single pane in an existing door. What thickness insulated glass did you use, & what did you use for stop, if it's not to much trouble?
I tried the Hyde glazing putty tool and didn't care for it myself. But yeah, to each his own. I guess I just got good with the puttyknife early on so anything else is uncomfortable. Also, I use the knife to mash the putty in, which can't be done with the Hyde tool.
As for the panes, I used 1" thick thermal panes and puttied them in. Note that you cannot allow glazing putty to make contact with the seal between the panes. I used sealed them with silicone caulk and let it dry before applying the putty. Then I later found out your not suppose to use silicone either. The windows are still fine now a year later, but you may want to look into what is or isn't allowed to contact the seal.
I guess a wood stop is what most installers use, but that turned into a nightmare with another window I did - water seeping in, wood rotting, the works. I'll never use wood again. In fact I'm doing some more in a couple of weeks and they're all getting putty.
Another thing is that I had to build out the sash to accomodate the extra thickness. For that I ripped strips from some treated decking, glued and tacked them into place. This wouldn't work for a double hung unit, for obvious reason. If that were the case I would have routed them deeper to accomdate the extra thickness, and probably would have gone with thinner panes, like maybe 5/8" thick. --------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
Ted-Not much glazing anymore for me (was in glass for 25 yrs.), but my favorite for putty is a stiff 'bent' knife.BTW, you are correct about not having glazing putty in contact with IG seals. As far as silicone is concerned, you CAN use neutral-cure.
"Ted-Not much glazing anymore for me (was in glass for 25 yrs.), but my favorite for putty is a stiff 'bent' knife.BTW, you are correct about not having glazing putty in contact with IG seals. As far as silicone is concerned, you CAN use neutral-cure."
Thanks for the tip. Do you know of any brands which are neutral-cure? I'd really like to check it out for my upcoming project. --------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
Ted-It has been awhile, I don't remember a particular brand. Check with a glazing supplier and tell them your application- ask for the one-part neutral cure 'cause obviously it is more user friendly. Out West here I've used Colorado Sash: http://www.coloradosteelsash.com/Also CRL: http://www.crlaurence.com/
remember that in a door it has to be tempered
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It's not really a full light door...just one full pane in the top of the slab.
Still need to be tempered?
code calls for any door or glass within ( I think) 18" either side of the door to be tempered.I found that out twenty years ago when I took an old one into the glass shop for repair/reglazing. I guess there is a law that can make them subject to a ten thousand dollar fine for not doing it right.For all I know, that last part was blowing smoke or came from the insurance carrier.But I know that you absolutely cannot buy a door without tempered and if the glaziers know a piece of glass is for a door, they will not sell it to you.
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So these french doors from 1915 I am reglazing ( same old glass, reinstalled) at 2 wide x 7 high lites, is illegal?Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
YES, and I'm calling the cops righ now!
Doug
Go head, I don't wanna finish them any way..I got 2 sets of french and 2@ 3/0x8/0 to strip and redo. Boooooooorrrrrrrrriiiiinnnnngggggg...Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Shhh, don't tell and I won't.;)Grandfathered is one thing, but if you are replacing all that glass, you should be using tempered.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I was under the impression that code wanted tempered if you were too close to the floor.
I would hazard a guess that the requirement for doors was meant for full lights, where you might not realize the door was shut, and walk/run through it, and it was easiest just to make a blanket regulation Not much chance of not "seeing it" with the door I'd like to change out.
The glaziers aren't under that impression.It isn't just because you can walk through, but the action of a moving door makes it more likely to be broken.
If I had a lite on an old door of my own broken up high, I might replace with normal glass, but for a customer, I don't want the liability.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
"First we kill all the lawyers..."
I'm going to add, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong here, that if the door has multiple lites each lite can be regular annealed glass if said individual lite is under (something like) 14 sq. inches. Don't quite remember. Ran into this when I was doing leaded/stained glass.
Edited 7/3/2008 11:20 am by kenhill3
Another option if safety glass is required and tempered is not available is to use laminated glass.
Bendheim sells laminated restoration glass for just such applications that you mentioned.
Thanks. I had forgetten that.
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Laminated is also allowed and often prefered for it's theft deterrent. I also prefer laminated because they have it in stock and don't have to send it out to be tempered.
I'm going to be heading from upstateNY to the NJ just outside Manhattan i a couple of weeks and it wouldn't be too far out of my way to swing through CT. Any chance of a detail photo of the muntin profile and some sizes?Steve
I'll sure try...why don't you PM me your email address?PaulB
A coupe of months ago I attended a workshop on restoring old windows ( sponsored by the New Hampshire Preservation Alliance) and the recommended way to get rid of the old, rock-hard putty in window sash was to use steam, either from a hand held unit or using a steam cabinet. Potential steam sources include a wallpaper steamer or a turkey fryer. Here is a link to a video when using a steam cabinet. http://www.oldewindowrestorer.com/steamcabinet.htmlAl
Want me to look up the number for the Bendheim supplier? They will sell full 30x30 sheets or will cut it to size for your specs. The precut runs about ten times as much - you already know why.
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I see plenty of other interest in this stuffMain place is in NJ
S A Bendheim Co Inc
61 Willet St
Passaic, NJ 07055800-221-7379
973-471-1733
fax 471-3475NY showroom
122 Hudson St
NYNY
212-226-6370
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
No need. Thanks.
I've two window jobs at this time, on one house I am able to salvage the old fairly well, and group the old into same side sash for visual good looks.
On job #2 the Ho's were reluctantly ok with brand new glass, after a quote for the cost of new "old" glass. Being as the Mr.HO GLUED the inside of the glass to the muntins( with some kind of opaque caulk, not sillycone) to keep it from falling out..caused major headaches saving it. Those sash are not getting re-used, I am making all new from scratch. The state of disrepair was incredible, I don't know how they heated the house with the glass flopping around in the sash.
My local shop where I purchase new glass was curious why I was buying so much, and after a chat , they asked for a few cards..I left them and shortly there after, the phone was ringing pretty often..and a few of those calls led to other work, such as chasing flashing leaks and rotted sills. Never thought of it as a place to hook up for leads, but it has been fruitful. Many folks call the glass shop before thinking about total replacement, and some are just insul units that fogged or collapsed, and the sash frames rotted from lack of maintance, those I tell to get new insul units installed, I just focus on saving the TDL DoubleHungs.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
so your new cards will read,
"Sphere the Sashman",
You can see right through my work"I am in process of restoring an antique round one with curved muntins.
It was out of plane like a potatoe chip and rot in some joints.I have it back to within 1/6" of true plane and did the last of the repair laminations this morning. Tomorrow a fill coat, then sand it all again and off for glazing and paint to my painter. He volunteered to for the job of replacing two curved cut panes that were broken, Tee-Hee
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I'd take all that I could fit in my truck. That is if I was closer.
You might be surprised how much you could get for it!
Doug
definitely.
Buying what is made for that now costs approx three times as much as normal.
Bendheim is th ename of the supplier.
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Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Try these guys:
http://www.cttrust.org/202?highlight=salvage
Genuine "hand blown" glass is worth a small fortune to the right person.
I bought & sold some new blown glass for "open" tdl windows on a log house 6 years ago and sold it for $20/sf. If you are near a historic district you should be able to move it for a nice piece of change.