Attactment of freestanding railing to slab
Ledebuhr1
| Posted in Construction Techniques on
I need to build a freestanding railing for the front of our chuch santuatury. The floor is a slab, and the steps and platform are made of wood. I would like to make the railing out of 2×6 oak to go with the rest of the woodwook. There is no access from underneith. I need a fastening method to attach wood so it can be removed if the carpet is replaced. It also needs to be somewhat attractive.
see pic
Replies
Are you asking for:
The railing design and/or the method to make it stay put?
Will it see people using it as a hand rail? you know, some huge behemoth of a parisioner lugging themselves up the steps?
Railings should be able to withstand 350 lbs pressure from the side.
I've yet to see any railing connected to concrete that was solid. The posts have to go into the concrete....
Yes people will use it, though no one 350lb person. Its only two steps but many members are seniors and they need support when going down steps.
I can design and build the railing system and post, I just need a fastening method that is removable and sturdy.
One method.
Get a square steel tube welded to a base with holes at the perimeter. Epoxy all thread or use drop in anchors at those hole locations.
Slip your hollow post over that tube and fasten to the tube.
Tube could be 2x2" or 3x3" if you wish.
It will go nowhere with 4 anchors.
The post will cover the plate or use a base detail that does.
I wouild cut the carpet around that plate-the cushion effect won't help.
>>Yes people will use it,
>>Yes people will use it, though no one 350lb person
It doesn't ake a 350 lb person to exert 350 lbs of laeral force
(like several 200 pounders leaning agains it, or some one tripping and falling ino it or falling away and grabbing the railing.).
I suggest you keep potenial liability in mind
Our church, in a similar situation, has movable/removable handrails. They're just mounted to "feet" (black painted strips of steel about 2" wide, bent in a slight "bowl" shape) that span about 18" at right angles to the railings. These seem quite stable, and we've never had any trouble with them.
But if you're after something a tad more secure, make the "feet" only 6-8" wide but bolt them down.
I wouldn't use tapcons but I suppose you could.
Good shear and all, but the strain of possibly wiggling around might loosen them up. Maybe not and it wouldn't be catasrophic.
By epoxy, I meant to epoxy the all thread into drilled holes in the concrete. Place base and tube over threaded rod sticking up out of the concrete and nut/washer it down. To rid yourself of the allthread later-when not using post anymore-cut 'em off.
Or drill holes in concrete and use drop in anchors-then bolt down the thing.
I'd recommend drop in anchors epoxied into the concrete.
I'd recommend a drop in female threaded anchor, epoxied in about an 1/8-inch below the concrete surface. That way when you need to do too much if you need to change things later on.
Thanks, Is there anywhere that I can buy a section of 2x2 steel tubing with a flange already welded on ? or is this something I will have to have made at a welding shop?
will have to have made at a welding shop?
You might get lucky and a welder will have that stock at his shop.
or
Call a steel supply, they may put that together for you and burn the holes in the plate too.
Beware
I don't think a 2" length of square tube is going to solve your problem. It isn't beefy enough for what you want and there's no reason to not make it larger. This is a church but it falls within commercial rules. This means it better be stout and conform to all the code regulations regarding height and extension beyond the upper riser and lower toe. Get some local advice from someone knowledgeable... perhaps there's an architect in the congregation who will help out.
Regarding the steel post on flat plate. One of the pitfalls of this is during the welding process the plate will cup toward the post. This means it is convex against the floor. It will want to rock and roll. You can wedge under it but use steel or better yet be prepared to use some non shrink grout.
Personally, I'd think about making some sizable newal posts to anchor both ends. They could be 8" square which would allow for a big interior post. Better to bolt down and bigger steel will distort less when welded. But perhaps the will look cramped with such a handrail.
By the way... I've done small interior posts inside newals. They can work fine in homes but I would be very cautious in a commercial venue. People will over-use and abuse anything they can get their hands on.
sapwood
I don't agree that he needs anything as big as 6" sq. tube to make this either comply or allow him to sleep at night. 2'' welded to a plate securely fastened to concrete isn't going to fail in the 350 lateral force test (I thought it was 250, but in a place of assembly-maybe it is.)
Not having any engineering numbers in my mind nor from a book I can only qualify it with nothing. Using that as a basis, I would go with tube that conformed to my post dimension hollow.
There is no way you're going to attach anything to the plywood that will give you the strength you need. You need to get into the concrete with some 2 inch square tube or somebody is going to pull your rail right over.