I have a series of 6×6 PT supports that run from a deck to an overhanging room which I would like to wrap with 1x Azek trim boards. I would like to mitre the corners. Anyone have experience with the best way to fasten these? Of course, I will glue the joints with PVC glue, but I would like the fasteners to be as invisible as possible. I usually face nail and glue all of my Azek with 8D SS siding nails. In the past, I have tried exterior spackle and vinyl caulk, but the results have not been great. I want this job to look the best I can do.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Brian, Bayview Renovation
Replies
well, for starters... we've used all kinds of pvc glue..
guess which one we finally decided on ?
the Azek glue... hands down....
The Azek glue is actually made by Gorilla.At least that's what the Azek reps told us, so Gorilla pvc glue will do just fine.BTW, the old Azek glue would gradually eat your finger prints off with continued exposure, which is why they made the change.darcy
If at all posible, I would assemble a 3-sided column away from you 6x6 post. Make it on horses, or a table, or someplace convenient. Then you only have to worry about aligning 1 side piece when you install the PVC column.
And make the PVC column a bit bigger (inside) than the PT post. That way, when the PT moves, it won't crack the PVC.
here's some wrapped postsMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I did as shep posted with a 2 and 3 sided, oversized koma column. Glued and Pinned (18 ga.), filled with ext. white spackle. And like Mike says, even tho $, Azek glue. A bit more work time and good weld.
Took the first 45 rip and backed up the inside corner with it. These columns were either hollow, or covered a lally post. A winter and two summers and no separation on those corners.
whew.Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Looks like some place in Perrysville? Along the river?
Perrysburg is across the river from me here in Maumee.
This house is in Ottawa Hills, estate section. Nice place. Demanding woman.Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Demanding woman.
Aren't they all?
Mike that is an awesome looking front porch.The details look great.
thanks , butch.. we just muddle along from day to day to dayMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Yeah, pretty soon you'all be good enoughto do it for a living!!<gdr>
Mike-
love the porch. i think I'm gonna steal a few ideas for my own front porch, if ya don't mind. Been putting it off for too long now.
I especially like the detail of hiding the gutter end behind the rake. Very classy.
Hey cal (and Mike), how do you keep the glue off the show faces...can you tell, I'm a slob<G< "what's in a name?" d'oh!
The azek glue is pretty clear, moreso than reg. pvc cement. Otherwise, it sands off nice.Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
the azek is water base.. and sets slower.. it cleans up better than PVC glue
these columns got glue on them.. we let it harden and scraped it off witha very sharp chisel
that idea about the lock miter bit sounds great..
it doesn't show very well in my pics but the columns are all butted..no miters on the box.. i didn't trust our ability to make 9" x 9" x 9ft columns with miters Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
That really is a great looking porch. Did you mill all the various moldings from Azek stock?********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
yes.. some was built up some routed on a benchdog
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Thanks for info -- and especially the pics.One more question........ what do you use to fill the nail holes?********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
either DAP 35 year or Phenoseal CaulkMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Do you typically paint the stuff? Most caulk I've used (okay, all) has either gotten a tad yellowish, or seemed like a dirt magnet unless it was painted over. Is the DAP or Phenoseal different?And, how does the PVC hold paint? Anybody had any up for a while? "what's in a name?" d'oh!
this one was not painted.. but Azek does love paint.. makes a good surface
so.. a couple miniscule filled nail holes with slightly yellowing caulk... or paint the whole thing..
i'll take the yellowing and keep my options open
i was looking for a lock-miter bit at Quaker Lane Tools today.. but the only one i saw seemed to much cut for pvc...
anyone got a brand name for a not-so- deep lock -miter bit ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Hey Mike, I got one from Eagle America, dunno if it's what you're looking for, but it's great for drawers. Isn't that Phenoseal made in RI? They've got a great sanded grout selection...but, dang, that yellowing thing bugs me<G> "what's in a name?" d'oh!
Mike, only worked with Atez a couple of times. The stuff is so flexible I would think using a miterlock bit would be tough.I use this method for column wraps whether solid wood or man made boards. I rabbet the front and back boards so 3/16" is left. When the side pieces go in you only see 3/16". The rabbet is 1/16" wider than the boards, the 1/32" on each side is cleaned up after gluing by either sanding,hand plane or router with a bearing bit. The cleanup method depends on the stock being used. I think this would work on Atez too.
mike
i think matt said he had used a lock miter successfully..
can you do a dwg of your rabbet method ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Here's the drawing Mike, pretty simple. The 3/16" lip when glued to the full board appears to be a solid post, even when using hardwood or manmade boards. The rabbet is slightly (1/32") wider to accomadate sanding or trimming after glue up.
mike
great .. what was dark is suddenly light..
thanksMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike- I use a CMT lock miter bit in my router table. I think they make a couple of sizes.
I'm not sure how Azek compares to MDF when routing, but I sure need dust collection for the MDF. I haven't routed much Azek.
Isn't the Azek product a cellular vinyl pvc product? We installed cellular vinyl pvc brick mould and trim on some of our exterior doors and tonight I was trying to research what we should use to fill the set trim nail holes and to caulk. We want to use products for the filler and the caulk that will match well with the white since we will not be painting (although we want to use something compatible with paint so we can paint later if desired). We also want to use somthing that doesn't attract dirt like some caulks or fillers do. Thanks for your question. I hope we get some answers.
I almost hate to mention this,'cause its a bit of a PITA for set-up, but I've done some interior square columns with a lock miter bit. Once the joints are milled, the columns go together like a dream. Its an interlocking joint so, once set up right, your miters turn out perfect.
I haven't tried it on Azek, but I think it would mill OK.
Personally I'd butt them together and use SS 15 ga finish nails. My painter just uses regular painter's putty on the nail holes. Not sure about the longterm reliability of this method but it holds up well at least for a year. I've used the spackle method - per the Azek recommendations, only thing is you will 2 or 3 applications to make the nail holes disappear since spackle shrinks. Took several days too, since I let each coat dry for a day.
Even using a table saw, I'd bet you would have trouble getting miters to mate up perfectly.
Weather you butt em or miter them that Azek glue is extremely strong so, really you only need enough nails to hold it together until the glue dries. Other PVC glue discolors and dries quite fast so it is harder to work with. Not sure about the strength either.
I did a little experiment with the Azek glue. I took two 3' scraps of Azek 1x4 and glued the ends together in kind of an 'L' shape. So, I had a bond area of 3.5" x 3.5". Let it dry for a few days. Then tried to see if I could break them apart. Nada! Tried putting my full weight on the connection - held strong. I'm convinced. Maybe next time I'll try doing an edge glue up meaning that the contact area would be .75" x 3.5"...
BTW - probably just stating the obvious, but you are not going to make your Azek fit tight to your 6x6 posts - right?
Our painters used bondo to fill the holes, with great results.
has anyone tried biscuits? i had to make pork chops on a recent siding using 2 pieces of azek so i joined them with biscuits and glued with azek glue. seemed to work fine. but i really wont know till some time passes.
tyke
Just another day in paradise
I have used regular biscuts before with good results. Have also used Eb-Ties and cut off the tab. They are better but at $100 a box, they get expensive.
Brian, Bayview Renovations
I've messed with Azek corners alot and second what everyone here has said. Use the Azek glue. If you're set on mitered corners, I'd be sure to use some kind of holding jig because the glue can make the joints creep and ruin your accuracy.
The other thing I've used is pocket screws, but you could only make a three sided column with all of them hidden and the fourth side would have to show some fastener, unless the fourth side was just glued and clamped.