Hello,
I’d like to get some advice concerning the poor job my sub did on the foundation walls and floor. The sub left his crew to do the work and never checked on it. Well they screwed up. Excess concrete was left along the brick ledge, they never cut the expansion joints in the floor, they forgot 2 door ways in the garage and in general all the corners were sloppy.
The sub has come back and taken care of the expansion joints, and some of the sloppyness and excess along the outside of the walls but there is still numerous instances of concrete in corners along the brick ledge, here’s a few pictures. Can this be cut away, or am i just going to have to have my mason work around it?
Thanks,
DP.
Replies
If your mason is better than your forming sub, which isn't hard, he should be able to chip and sawcut the sloppy corners and ledges to make them acceptable.
I hope you held back enough money to pay the mason to do the remedial work on the concrete deficiencies.
Gabe
"I hope you held back enough money to pay the mason to do the remedial work on the concrete deficiencies."
I most certainly did.
-DP
This is why mason's are such grumps!
You will have to put up with some grief... but a good mason should be able to correct for you. You may want to have a partner saw with a diamond blade on standby at your local tool rental.
If you really want to get even, just find out where the concrete guys go for beer after work (maybe during work from those pics). Then tell your mason!
Edited 7/30/2004 8:57 pm ET by Rich from Columbus
it really not that bad, about a normal job
Yes it is bad, most of the corners are like that.
DP
Edited 7/30/2004 10:23 pm ET by dperfe
dperfe,
I'm having a hard time imagining just how thay managed to get so much mud on the ledge in any matter with out actually trying to do so.
However, the excess mud has a very poor bond to the existing 'crete, so a man with a 35lb electric jack hammer and a 2" chisel bit will knock it off about as fast as he could walk the machine around.
As for your basement doors, they can be cut out by a reputable conrete cutting outfit for a few hundred dollars. Hopefully you kept enough back from the concrete sub to pay for this, anyway, be sure to 'Backcharge' him, if not to get money from him, at least to document and CYA.
On another note, rubble is NOT an approved backfill material, get it out of there.
One more thing and I'll leave you to your beer, (for you to cry in.) See those little metal tabs sticking out of the footing, and maybe the walls, too? I hate those because they are a direct cause of concrete cracking later as they rust. Too late now, but you can delay the problem for several years by waiting a month, grinding them off just below the surface and spraying the ends with cold galvanizing paint, then vapor sealing the concrete for a 3" radius around each one.
Other issues like brick ledges that don't run to the ends of walls, you'll just have to live with, or spend $$$$$. Maybe a matching or contrasting color coat to detail them will work for you. The brick mason can work around them if they are small enough, giving you the appearance of columns.
Work like this is one of the reasons I am starting a footing and basement business. No competition for quality work. Most concrete contractors just know how to form and place mud. They just don't understand the underlying principles.
I am sorry for your bad experience,
SamT
I now have a new issue with the concrete guy. The foundation for the garage is out of whack. One end of the garage is 2.5" - 3" deeper then the other side. My framer says this will cause problems for him and said i should hold back money from the concrete guy. Above the garage is a gabled bonus space. Framer says he will not be able fabricate all the rafters, things will have to be cut specially to make it look correct.
The concrete guy in short, has been mostly belligerent. When he finally did agree to hold of suing and actually meet with me to check the dimensions on the garage, he and i came up with discrepancy of only 1". However, when i took measurements with one of the framing crew who has no idea of what is going on, i got a 2.5" discrepancy. And then checked it yet another time, this time with my nephew holding one end of the tape, i got exactly the same results as with the crew member, 2.5", and exact same measurement.
The concrete guy is in my estimation a jerk. In part of his belligerent diatribe, he insisted that the job was good that he was not obligated to fix the brick ledge nor put in control joints in the basement floor, which is absolutely absurd. Control joints are standard procedure, no one around here considers it an optional thing. Now he considers himself vindicated based on his measurements and is insisting on being paid tomorrow.
I'm planning to have a foundation survey done so there is no question as to the exact discrepancy. He will have to wait a few days. If he does sue, i am planning to still hold of payment until the survey results and until I'm able to quantify the additional work required of the framer, if any.
I would really appreciate getting some feedback on this situation and or some thoughts from other framers on just how extensive of an issue is a 2.5" discrepancy between sides of the garage.
Thanks for wading through all this, and for any help.
-David P.
Not to justify in any way what the concrete guy has done or how he has handled the job, but the framer should able to handle a 2 1/2 " discrepancy. Is this the discrepancy between the diagonals of the corners or of the length or width? The usual procedure is to make the building a little larger and hang the wall over the edge of the foundation. In the worst cases you might have to frame the wall with wider lumber (2x6or wider) to get sufficient bearing for the wall. Differences in height can be dealt with by shimming the sills or by cutting the studs using a transit to mark a level top line. The only concrete problem that the framer cannot readily fix is a floor that is not poured level. If that is 2 1/2" out of whack, you are really in trouble.
"Is this the discrepancy between the diagonals of the corners or of the length or width?"
This is the depth from front to back, not diagonal. There's atleast a 2.5" difference (I'm erring on the conservative side, I've had measurements of 3" aswell, but as i said i was able to get a consistent 2.5" for what it's worth.)The length from front to back along the outside wall is 2.5" longer then the length from front to back along the inside wall.
-David P.
You need to determine if it is too long toward the front or toward the back and shift to compensate on the short side. You have to check the diagonals to do this. It is possible that the entire foundation is worse than 2 1/2" if it is out of square as well. The framers will need to determine the extent of the problem but they can remedy the problem at a fairly reasonable cost ($100-200).
A few hundred for the framers.
A few hundred for the roofers.
A few hundred for the drywallers.
A few hundred for the floorers.
A few hundred for the cabinets.
The painter won't care.
SamT
You tell that pig you'll be happy to have him sue you; those two photos alone are so ugly that you'll probably make out better in front of a judge than if you and he dicker a discount for all the extra work he's caused you. Take lots of photos before any remedial work is done, and document every cent of extra work it costs to get the house built.
I hate slobs that work like that; gives the entire industry a bad name....Dinosaur
'Y-a-tu de la justice dans ce maudit monde?