Replies

1. 
   SHGLaw | Jan 30, 2002 11:08pm | #1

   *
   Call them. If there was a problem, find out and see if it can be fixed. They are already saying bad things about you, so you can't make it worse.

   And I would think it shows you are a pretty stand up person to call and tell them that if they were unhappy, you want to know and to fix the problem.-+

   SHG

1. 
   Cloud_Hidden | Jan 30, 2002 11:25pm | #2

   *Had you asked them to be on a referral list? Could they be tired of getting unexpected calls?SHG, when I look at it from the other party's perspective, I know I'd _hate_ to be put on the spot by someone asking why I'm not giving good referrals. Not challenging your advice--just saying the thought of it creeps me out.

1. 
   Scott_R | Jan 31, 2002 12:03am | #3

   *Could be just a case of mis-communication. I agree with SHG do a follow up inspection of your work, something may have gone south recently. No need to mention the bad referral, unless they bring it up. Scott R.

1. 
   SHGLaw | Jan 31, 2002 12:07am | #4

   *Cloud,I agree. But I wasn't thinking about calling and saying, "why did you tell people I suck." That would be offensive. I was thinking that the call should be: "I'm very concerned that you were unhappy with my work, and I would like to find out what the problem is so that I can make it right." I don't think any customer would have a problem with that call.SHG

1. 
   Mr._Pita | Jan 31, 2002 01:20am | #5

   *FYI - I'm not a contractor.I would say to call back and check up. Your wife may be right, but even if you can't/won't resolve their current problem, it could be a troubleshooting or prevention exercise. If they're unhappy with X, and that's the way you've always done it, is there a better/different method? Maybe it was your body odor, your construction methods, your billing schedule, who knows. But upon discovery of something "wrong", you can at least revisit that within your business plan, and see if a change needs to be made, or not. It can only make your business stronger, and if that client can be made satisfied, it would just be icing.(Just kidding about the BO.)

2. 
   Mark_McDonnell | Jan 31, 2002 02:24am | #6

   *Mr. Pita,I once refered my SIL to the best divorce lawyer around. She didn't hire him.She said he farted.She hired some smoothy who did a lousy job, but he looked good!Back to the subject.Call them, call them, call them. They may just have a little defect that has just raised it's ugly little head..........or they may have become wacky.......in any event, you should know.......This is another example of yearly "check-ups" on anyone you value, be it a reference or someone with a big mouth.

3. 
   Keith_C | Jan 31, 2002 03:11am | #7

   *I'd put them on the spot and make them feel uncomfortable in a heartbeat! If they can make a bad reference then you can return the favor to find out what's wrong. DUH. Homeowner GC's..GGrrrrrr.

4. 
   Tommy_B. | Jan 31, 2002 05:59am | #8

   *There's the catch 22 in a business where referrals are the best way to get more profitable work.I would call them with one of the softer approaches that has been mentioned.Referrals can have a way of going stale through no falt of the contractor and for any number of reasons. I generally give recent referrals when asked for them.If it already was a referral, I generally don't give out more unless they ask. Why take a chance. Even your best customers are not always in the frame of mind to give a glowing review months or years down the road.I would mostly call them out of curiosity.

5. 
   James_DuHamel | Jan 31, 2002 08:29am | #9

   *Well, you know me... I gotta step up and say something here.Cloud, I can understand your reluctance to ask a client about a bad referal, but with all due respect (and I do mean RESPECT), you are not a contractor. As a homeowner, you do not have to deal with referals as a way of life. As contractors, we do. Good referals are our bread and butter. We do everything we can to insure that a client is happy, and pleased with our work. Their referal is worth it's weight in gold to us. If, for some reason, we get a bad referal, we owe it to ourselves, our company, our employees, and our clients (both former and current) to find out why. Here is where it gets tricky, and where you need to pull out all the professionalism you can possibly muster to get the answer you need, without causing any trouble, hard feelings, or angst with the former client. How you handle the situation is going to vary widely from region to region, and from person to person. How I would handle a client here in rural Southeast Texas is gonna be a whole different ballgame than how a contractor handles an upper end client in Boston. The key is tact, soft spoken words, real concern for their problem (whether a real problem or just a perceived problem), and a showing of real concern for a way to rectify the problem. If at all possible, we need to find a solution, or at the very least, find out the cause of their discontent. Just a thought...James DuHamel

6. 
   Schelling_McKinley | Jan 31, 2002 03:33pm | #10

   *We don't usually give references since our work is pretty well known in the area, but we have had a few discontented customers. Often they do not directly express their discontent directly so that we could deal with the problems but are perfectly willing to bad mouth us to their friends. Should we chase down these people and ask them what went wrong? Maybe, but I have a lot of other things to do that are a much higher priority. One possibility is that these people are just very hard to make happy and that their only pleasure in life is to complain about it. We all know people like this and I, for one, don't really want to spend too much time with them. Forget about it.

7. 
   The_Tennis_Court_Builder_...on_t | Jan 31, 2002 03:44pm | #11

   *I always ask my customers first if they may be contacted just before giving name to a prospect. All know that the call is OK to make ahead of time.I would never want people contacting my past customers with out their consent. The key here too, is all my references are people I can and do call, or stop in to hang out with at cocktail hour, or swim time.near the stream,ajOf late I am asking all customers to write a reference letter at the end of their project as part of accepting the satisfactory finish of the project. It's now in my contract.... Upon satisfactory substantial completion...final payment is due and a written...

8. 
   Boss_Hog | Jan 31, 2002 03:48pm | #12

   *I tend to shy away from conflicts, and I'm not a contractor. But I've worked a long time to get a good reputation at what I do, and it's important to me. Consider that "Mr Jones" might have just had a bad day when the prospective customer called him. Or your prospective customer might have been wrong about which previous customer didn't have anything good to say about you. Or the prospective customer might have exaggerated what "Mr Jones" said. I wouldn't be against contacting them, but I wouldn't mention the bad referral. Maybe just "bump into them" sometime and ask them if they're happy with their house.

9. 
   Dan-O | Jan 31, 2002 03:48pm | #13

   *Great post James...I reckon your method would work anywhere. Genuine concern for meeting other's needs is the cornerstone of beig well reputed. Everyone can sense this.Civility costs nothing and buys everything.Dan-O

10. 
    josh | Jan 31, 2002 05:37pm | #14

    *1st, I alwasy ask to see if I can use someone as a referral because sometimes people might be thrilled with your work and who you are but not want an invasion of privacy..well I did call,about 20 minutes after the post and was polite and calm, but left a message"jones" called back and asked what was upI explained why I called and was there anything I could do or answer for him ( of course it was a few scentences longer then that)he was surpised, his responce was also very polite until he got to this "that dingy broad, I was complaining about one of the subs who did the finih work, she must have thought I was talking about you"anyway that is what he said and then said I could still use him as a reference. And I prefer to believe him, he was always nice and fair to us in the past. I then told him that the only reason I used him as such an old reference now is that the person wanted almost the same kind of job a two story addition, bedrooms, baths and garage and lived in his areaI think Ill shorten my list anyway to only list jobs in the past year or sousually I do not need it anywayanyway guys thanks for all the advicebuilder I is spellar I aint

11. 
    Cloud_Hidden | Jan 31, 2002 06:09pm | #15

    *>...but with all due respect, you are not a contractor...Absolutely true, James (though literally less true today than yesterday--story for another time), and that's why I didn't cast it as advice. Ron, aka, Boss Hog pretty much said how I feel...I don't like conflict or confrontational situations. I'd be more inclined to find a way to accidentally encounter the person than to call. Different people, different temperments, different strokes. For historical accuracy, I did own a business where referrals made a big difference. Published product reviews were more important, granted, but referrals brought in all the big contracts. Have encountered quite similar situations. It wasn't construction, of course, and different methods can apply. No problem with that caveat being attached to my comments.>Here is where it gets tricky, and where you need to pull out all the professionalism you can possibly muster...Completely agree.And good job by you, josh. Glad it worked out.

12. 
    The_Tennis_Court_Builder_...on_t | Jan 31, 2002 06:21pm | #16

    *Peoples ears work fairy poorly...Who you callin a fairy?!near the stream,aj

13. 
    bungalow_jeff | Feb 01, 2002 03:54pm | #17

    *Josh, I personally, would want to see older jobs. Lot's of jobs look great for the first few months. I want to see a job after a few seasons of use (or at least a party) has gone by.

14. 
    Keith_C | Feb 01, 2002 04:28pm | #18

    *Seeing old jobs is sometimes a double edged sword. I got to go through a house we completed in Feb. of 2001. I got a call that they had a floor squeak. I went out and before getting out of the truck about puked. It's on a wooded lot, and had saplings growing out of the gutters in multiple places. They had made no attempt to put in a lawn, and all the topsoil had ruts 6-12" deep heading over the hill(walkout). The garage (24 x 40) was stuffed with all kinds of broken crap, cars parked outside, floor was greasy and gross. The inside was worse. Crap everywhere, smelled, piles of dirty cloths everywhere. This is a couple, no kids, good jobs. I found the floor squeak, which was actually a duct support rubbing on the side of the supply when someone walked directly over it. As I started out the door, we had a downpour. The water was just GUSHING over the gutters and going down the fronts of the windows and siding puddling around the brick. I looked back at the homeowner and said" I think you better clean the gutters, or that water will soon be finding it's way into your basement eventually" to which he replied, " I need to get a ladder, I'll get it in the spring when I do my outside cleanup" I went around, took some picture with the date stamp on, took a swig of malox and left. This place is only 11 months old....would pass for 15 years easy.

15. 
    RonTeti | Feb 02, 2002 02:12am | #19

    *Keith, That would break my heart to see my work end up like that.