My wife and I are in the planning stages on our retirement home near Grand Lake in Oklahoma. We are planning on putting a bathroom in the basement. Because of the grade of the septic tank I will need a lift for the waste.
I’ve explored two methods, a sump with sewage sump pump and a maserator tank pump. The problem I see with the maserator is I have to build the shower on a 6″ sub base to get proper drainage, which leaves no head room for someone over 6 ft. My wife is concerned that a sump might start stinking over time, even though the sump is sealed and vented..
Has anyone here had any experience with either system? Thanks for any input.
Replies
I'm not sure I understand the distinction between the two systems. The ones I've seen are what we call sewer ejectors and are basically a big, heavy-duty trash barrel buried in the ground with a pump and a 'blender' to grind up the solids. There's a float valve that kicks it on and a 2" line up and out to gravity. The pump and the macerator are part of the same unit.
You would need to get your unit low enough so that the fixtures in your bathroom can all drain into it without being built on risers. It should be no problem for a good plumber. Also, I don't get the part about a 6" riser and 6' of headroom... sounds like a 6'-6" basement which is too low to start with... go for 7'-6" or higher, which may be code where you are anyway.
The main problem with these units is getting someone to service them when they need it. Yuk.
There is a unit that sets behind the toliet and the toilet has a rear discharge. Will take a sink also. But for a shower you need to rasie the shower so that you have the discharge at or above floor level.I see them advertised in FHB. But AFAIK, the only different between that system and the inground tanks is busting up concrete. You still have a holding tank, pump, discharage and vents system.
Since you are planning for new construction, plan for 8' clear to the joists from the basement slab; that will solve a lot of problems right off the bat. An extra yard or three of concrete won't cost that much and will make the basement so much more pleasant and un-basement-like that it will be worth every cent.
Second, for your basement drains: Your two choices for new construction are either an exterior pumping station or an interior pumping station. Unit-based 'built-in' pumps such as 'self-pumping toilets' and so forth are remedial solutions to enable installation of a below-grade wet room where the house designer did not predicate one.
(1) An exterior pumping station is located down-slope from the main waste line coming out of the house. This is what we use when there is adequate excavatable depth outside the house to install the septic tank low enough to gravity-drain all waste from the basement, but the weeping field must be located uphill from the house. The pumping station is a separate concrete tank about 8x8x6 and is equipped with a ½-¾HP sump pump on a float-switch. It does not have to be equipped with a solids macerator, as solids are settled out in the septic tank itself before the effluent drains off into the pumping station. We also install high-level alarms in these tanks. All electrical supply lines and fittings to these systems has to be watertight; glued pvc conduit with WT boxes and compression fittings are usually used for this.
(2) Your second choice is an interior pumping station, which consists of a plastic tank about the size and shape of a large garbage can and a ½hp trash pump with a macerator. The tank is installed at the same time as the under-slab DWV piping is, ie: before the slab is poured. Once your pour your floor, the flange on the top rim of the tank is flush with the slab. Mechanically it works much the same way as the exterior set up except that it accepts raw sewage containing solids, and thus requires a grinder pump. Electrical supply is usually by factory-sealed power cords which are simply routed out of the tank and plugged into dedicated dry outlets. The float switch is equipped with a piggy-back plug. Hi-level alarms are less necessary here, because the tank is in a visible place and usually the pump can be heard running--or not, as the case may be. Thus any fault is usually discerned quickly.
There are generally no odor problems with interior systems.
Properly installed and with a modicum of good luck, maintenance on these types of systems is fairly low. It's worth investing in the best quality pump you can afford, obviously. And the owners should be careful not to throw tampons, sanitary napkins, or other compactable solids down the toilet so as to avoid packing up the macerator and jamming the pump.
Other considerations are that in both interior and exterior systems, the installer must place a high-quality anti-back-flow flapper valve at the bottom of the discharge line, just above the pump in an exterior station and just above the tank cover for an interior system. A 1/8" hole should be bored in the discharge pipe about 4-6" above the pump itself to relieve back pressure on the pump by allowing the section between it and the flapper valve to drain once the pump cycles off. The flapper valve must not be a glue-in type, but rather have compression nut fittings on both ends so that the pipe going down to the pump can be disconnected below it. A retrieval rope on the pump itself should also be installed and tie-wrapped above the high-liquid level on the discharge line, so that in the event of a pump or switch failure no one has to go fishing or swimming in that sh!t....
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
There are other combinations.For example where the sewer main (or possible even the septic system) is too high (hill side) for even the first floor.Large outside tank with macerators. Don't know what HP they are.I have a little different system. The main is called a force main. I think that it is 2 or 3" and two of them serve about 350 homes.Have about an 100 gal fiberglass tank in the ground (Only about 60-80 usable). With a macerator pump. I think about 1.5 or 2 hp. It pushes it up to the force main and pushes every thing in the down line a little. No gravity feed until it get to the end of the line and hits a major sewer trunk line.
There are other combinations.
For example where the sewer main (or possible even the septic system) is too high (hill side) for even the first floor.
Large outside tank with macerators. Don't know what HP they are.
That's what I described under option 1. Doesn't matter what is uphill, whether it's a sewer connection or a weeping field, you need to install a pumping station (tank w/pump) that your lowest drain can gravity feed to. In the case where for some reason a settling tank cannot be placed ahead of the pumping station, then yes, we would install a grinder pump instead of just a liquid sewage pump. But this is unusual unless there is simply no room for two tanks downslope of the main drain coming out of the house.
I've never seen the force main system you describe, but that's not too surprising as 95% of my clients are on proprietary septic systems. (City sewers only exist in the village core.) What kind of HP would be required for the last/lowest house on that line of 350 houses? That's a lotta sh!t to push uphill....
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
I want to thank you all for your replies. I'm going to go with the interior sump and maserator sump pump. I've found a couple of sources on the internet, I've seen the sump tanks at Home Depot.
We're going to go with a erobic septic system that discharges the effluent through a sprinkler and drip system. Have any of you had any experience with these systems?
Thank you for your help. This is a very knowledgible bunch.
Don't let the kids and dog play in the sprinkler! ;-)Gene Davis, Davis Housewrights, Inc., Lake Placid, NY