Greetings from the Great White North. As I’m brand new here the question I’m asking might have been asked and answered before so bare with me. The question is to do with installing baseboards.. I’ve installed lots of baseboards and to be quite honest I’ve never been happy with the results but thank god paintable silicone was invented. I read all the articles about installing baseboards and they never seem to apply to my problem or at least the guys doing the installing don’t have the wall that I have that twist and torque.
Anyways……..my problem is: what happens with the baseboard when there is an elevation change such as going from say vinyl floor to carpeting or hardwood. In my particular case the baseboard turns a corner into a doorway and halfway across the threshhold the floor goes from ceramic to vinyl. The ones I have seen was where the baseboard was put down BEFORE the ceramic was done so there was in fact no elevation change.
Any help would be appreciated. I’ve done lots of reno’s but like everyone there are always some things out there that stump you.
roger
Replies
Assuming I understand you correctly, how difficult would it be for you:
1) mark on the BB the point where the floor changes heights,
2) rip the BB narrower by the height difference for that section of the floor that is higher than the other. when you reach your first cut, the little narrower sliver will be free.
makes sense or am i missing the picture?
BTW, first post? welcome. where in the GWN?
We always raise the baseboard up off the floor when installing in new homes. Typically we raise the baseboard about 1/2".
In areas where there are "hard floors" ie. wood / vinyl / cermic tile / laminate, we install shoemold or 3/4" x 3/4" quarter round, after the flooring is installed. This quarter round effectively covers the gap and adds good looking detail.
In areas where there is carpet, the baseboard is also raised and the carpet layers tucks the carpet into this gap. They like it that way, telling me it conceals the carpet edge and helps the carpet to hold the tack strip.
This method helps keep all baseboard elevations the same, and assures that the whole baseboard profile is exposed and not burired in the floor covering.
i did the same in our house, kept the baseboards about 1/2" off the floor and my carpet guys wanted to KILL me. they said they don't tuck it under, and all kinds of BS, now i have these crappy "dark spaces" in some areas where the carpet falls just a little under the base. with out light carpet, it looks pretty crummy in some places, but w/ over 2600 sqft of carpeted rooms, i'm not going to be redoing the base just yet.as for the height change, rip down the base for the higher finished floors so that the tops of the base all line up.
Hate to say it but your carpet guys are telling you what every guy I've worked around has said. They don't want to tuck under, they want to tuck against the base so the carpet pushes itself back into the tackless strip. The nail points in the tackless are angled towards the baseboard or wall and the pressure from being tucked tight against the base pushes back to help hold it in place....Buic
Funny how things are different. I have been raising baseboards in hard floor and carpet areas throught a new home since the early 80s and never had complaints or problems with looks or function.
Before the early 80s I wuz a framer....loved it, no worries about baseboards and had long ponytail and a great tan.....won the arm wrestling matches at local bars in Memphis, 5'11" 130 lbs, but swung a 32oz framing hammer all day....no nailguns.
I'm curious. If you put in hardwood flooring you have to raise the baseboard in that area. How do you do your baseboard when you hit vinyl when they both meet along the same wall or a corner. There is a 3/4 inch elevation change.
roger
Rarely (well never) do any of our homes have vinyl with real hardwood. It would be like a Porsche with an AM radio. Clients with a budget for hardwood, install ceramic tile or like flooring at areas which would be vinyl in a lesser budget.
When we do real hardwood we recess the floor to account for the hardwood floor and sleepers, and other floor covering products.
When we have clients opt for pre-finished glue down or glueless hardwood or laminate there are no transition problems when going to ceramic tile or like products.
Well where I live and have lived (3000 miles apart) I see lots of vinyl flooring in fact I've recently installed vinyl in both my residences. I don't see vinyl as being less than anything. I view it as just another option. I wouldn't want hardwood in my kitchen or bathroom or laundry room yet I have seen it. I like ceramic flooring only in some places. When we used to winter in south Texas I used to see complete house tiled in ceramic. I didn't like it I don't mind vinyl siding in some instances.
As I said I view it as an option neither negative or positive.
thanks
roger
Yea, I understand about your view of vinyl. Good looking vinyl now days.
Ever seen or used vinyl plank. Looks like hardwood floor and is as think as commercial vinyl tile.
Right, most clients want ceramic or like product in baths / kitchens / laundry etc.
If you're not using a shoe molding you're going to have to scribe the base over any hard surfaces.
Start where the flooring is at the lowest point, then scribe and cut as needed as you work around the walls.... Hope this helps... Buic
Edited 11/16/2005 10:28 pm ET by BUIC
Keeping the baseboard high works if you are doing a complete house but I do a lot of renos. I have put ceramic tiles in the front entrance that is about half inch higher than the vinyl floor. If I had put in hardwood floor then it would be three quaters of an inch higher than the existing floor. As far as marking the low baseboard and tapering the higher one to match would work IF the tapered piece is a long piece and the taper wouldn't be noticed. How would it look if the tapered piece is short. It would look wierd. I guess too, now that I think of it, it would depend on how hich the profile was and by tapering it how much of the profile have I cut off and would it be noticeable.In my case the elevation change is in the middle of a doorway, The doorway is 4 1/2 inches deep and the ceramic tile stops halfway in the doorway. So in effect I have just over 2 inches of vinyl in the doorway and just over 2 inches ceramic also in the doorway. The baseboard would be just over 2 inches of low baseboard and just over 2 inches of high baseboard. Tricky huh! I could of course not put any baseboard in that area though in another area I still have the same problem but not in a doorway but small pieces.
Now that I'm thinking of it, rather than trying to blend in the difference maybe I could incorporate some sort of an accent piece and have the different height baseboards butt up against the accent piece at their own height. You know.......... I think that might just work. If I can figure what to use as an accent piece. What do you think
PS what is a shoe molding. quarter round maybe?
roger
Shoe mould is ¼ round. Some use carpet strip which looks like ¼ round but is thinner.
I take it you are using narrow base and not 4" or 5" or 6" baseboard where a ½" cut would not be noticable.
A transition piece may be too busy. Distract attention not attract attention.
Try mitering the baseboard together. Think of having a continuous baseboard running down each step of a set of stairs. The only difference is the step you are dealing with is only ½" high.
Thanks guys. I have seen that mitred cut Gord and I'm not sure I like it though when I think about it it's odd that with the many different thickness of floors that are available I haven't seen how the baseboard problem is solved. Just for my own curiosity I'm going to start looking hard.
I've seen that "shoe" mold and never knew it was called that.
"Someone always knows something I don't."
thanks again
roger
Shoe mould and quarter round are close cousins. Quarter round is one quarter of a circle, and can be used either side up. Shoe mould is only part of a quarter. Kinda like if you took a piece of quarter round and ran it through the table saw. usually 5/8" high x 1/2" wide. Not much difference unless you cut one piece upside down. Actually, it does look quite a bit different on the wall ... not quite as hefty.
Using some type of corner blocks could be an easy solution, and add a little detail. If your base is 3" high and 5/8" thick, just add blocks about 3-1/2" x 3/4" ... bigger enough for the base to die into, but not so big that they stand out.
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
Haha, roger u just answered yourself while writing. Thats great! Your idea sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
Matt
am I missing something, did you say that one of your transitions is in a doorway? if so, why would that be a problem? your baseboard runs into the casing on either side of the door....right? In fact the door right behind me has that exact detail! unless there's something I'm missing.
as for your other areas. It's always nice if you can plan floor changes so that they happen at doorways ( see above). also one could also lay down an underlay to get the floors to be the same heaight. just an idea.
another idea would be to build an archway ( post on either side with a header style - not sure the term ) that way you can case it, and run your base into that on the 2 sides. (just like with doors) unfortunately an arch has to fit in the spot where you want to put it. But if the spot is right, it can be a great feature to divide up a room.
you are probably dealing with floors already in place and can't change floor heights, and chances are, there is a window or somehting where one side of the arch would be, or it wouldn't suit the room. In that case I'd be up for any of the ideas suggested.
EDIT: was just thinking. was it suggested that the rip be tapered? I think it is just a straight rip. You will have a small jog in you baseboard but you can hide that with a piece of threshold. if you have a change in height you will want a threshold, will you not?
Edited 11/17/2005 11:24 am ET by alrightythen
I remember taking a course in communications and we had to describe something to a class and they had to draw what they heard. It was disaster.
The doorway in question is a drywalled opening. Now that I think of it, I should have said entrance way and the baseboard from one room goes through the entrance way into the other room. Because one floor is now higher than the other in that narrow opening (halfway in that opening) the baseboard heights change. I have a rubber transition between the two floors so that isn't a problem. the baseboard was or is.
I remember doing a small foyer in ceramic and had to build up the sub floor and then put thick tile on top. I had a real elevation change. It was about an inch or a little more. The local flooring companies suggested that I raise THE REST of the surrounding floors!!!!!!! WHAAAAAAAT!!!! There was nothing wrong with the rest of the floors. This is reno work NOT new construction. I ended making my own transition piece, lonnnnnnnggggg and narrowwwwwwwww.
As someone mentioned earlier I do have real narrow chintzy baseboard and I really can't afford to shave any more than a hair without it being noticed. You have given me some ideas though.
I like doing reno's because you have to think all the time and try to adapt. New construction is a breeze in most cases. I do reno's for ordinary people who don't have money to throw around. I have to save as much material as I can and when I do a room they expect the damage and dust and cost to only be in that room. Most times when a situation crops up you do what's best at the time, taking everything into consideration but other times when I have the time it's nice to bounce some situation off other people. It makes my day when I say "dammit, I never thought of that".
roger
ok...your entranceway is an ideal spot to make and hide the transition. it seems the problem is budget. what would be nice would be wider baseboard, trim out the entranceway.with side and head jams then case it. then your baseboard will meet easily on either side. This sort of detail looks best with wider stock for base as well as casing - I like an arts and crafts or craftsman style. But I would think that you could still make work with your smaller stock. I think it would look better than just putting a lone plinth style block to hide the difference. I then would lose the rubber strip and and replace it with a wooden piece like you've'e done before. It won't cost that much you can fabricate it yourself and take credit for something that will look great as a whole.
also what are you dealing with again, exactly? carpet to vinyl or something else. is the rubber strip make it quite flat? In my home I have carpet in the family room and vinyl kitchen ( not a house I built) with a rubber strip like you mention. the strip is quite flat and where the baseboard is the carpet is pushed down tight so close enough to same height as vinyl.
It's ceramic to vinyl and I embedded a fitting into the floor which holds the flat piece of rubber. It looks good.
This is an entrance way which doesn't have any casing or molding around it. It is only drywall.
I actually just finished doing it and I left that piece of baseboad out so there is no piece of baseboard 4 1/2 inches long trying to change elevations. Of course if I did put frame and put casing like a doorway then I wouldn[t have the problem and I like the effect you describe. Carpeting usually isn't a problem because as you said you can push it down.
roger
I was just thinking the same thing Roger. Rather than trying to rip the base and making it match on both sides. Just rip out that small section of base and replace it with some other doorway detail...or just eliminate it altogether in that spot by boxing out the door jamb and bringing the jambs right down to the floor.
Add in a transition strip to bridge the gap between different flooring, and you're golden.
Let me attach a pic to make this more clear...Justin Fink - FHB Editorial
The piece isn't tapered from one end to the other. The top of the baseboard is level, the bottom is scribed to the floor. If your base is 5" tall and you start over the vinyl, it'll be 4 1/2" over the ceramic and 4 1/4" over the wood, but the top edge stays level so that it always looks right, ( in relation to a vertical line like a corner or door ) Hope that makes more sense.
Shoe molding is any small molding installed at the bottom of the baseboard where it meets the floor. Usually used over any hard surface floor , but not with carpeting. It will often eliminate the need for scribing as it has enough give to follow the irregularities of the floor. It's also used with wood floors so that it can be removed and replaced when the floor gets refinished... Buic
That makes sense but I guess it would depend on the profile in that maybe the bottom of the profile is fancy and by cutting that off ar some of it, it might look odd. But it has given me some good ideas though. I was just in my local lumber supplier and noticed baseboards of differnt heights yet the same profile (somewhat) and I'm thinking that I could use these differences in some situations.
Of course in 50 years when I'm in the same situation I would have forgotten all this.
roger
I would come from the kitchen vinyl and then scribe the transition piece and taper that six inch piece about 1/4" on the bottom.
From that corner then taper you next piece of base the remaining 1/4" over about 4 feet and no one will ever tell.
Quarterround is technically a quarter of a round cylinder. Goes for @$0.95 at HD for oak. Base shoe is a similar profile but is 3/4' tall, (goes for $0.65 ) but only 1/2" thick, so they look alike but the QR covers more of the floor. QR is usually 3/4" when put on a floor, but we also sell 1/2" as well as 1/4". These are usually used for bookcases or as a glass retainer in doors.
I don't know if you've already figured it out but here's something I did once on a sheetrock opening (about 5') that was pretty discreet for the situation. I was transitioning between a new tile floor and existing hardwoods.
I basically made plinth blocks to handle the transition but instead of setting them on the surface of the door facing's sheetrock, I cut away the sheetrock and set the plinth against the framing. This left only 1/4" of the plinth standing proud of the sheetrock on the frame area. Then I ran my base to the plinth block and did a return on the edge of the plinth. The blocks were about 1/4" taller than the base and I kept the reveal on the returns to the same 1/4". The only other detail I accounted for was to rabbet the back side of the top of the plinth to make the sheetrock joint to plinth block hide behind the block itself. The rabbet itself was 1/2" x 1/2" so the seam fell below the point where the base met against the edge of the plinth block. I don't know if this is a viable option for you but the one I did wasn't an eye grabber saying, "handy hack did this"...
You could do a mitre at the transition. Mitre up then Mitre over.
That would work if it was a bigger jog but a 1/2 inch jog would look strange, at least to me.
thanks roger