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Broken grout and creaking tile

yelkenli | Posted in Construction Techniques on November 3, 2013 08:30am

I have a master bathroom that has some tiles that move up and down when you step on them, and they creak.  The house is 14 years old.  The tiles are most likely original, and are 11.5 inches square, spaced on 12 inch centers. 

The 2 loose spots are generally in front of a sink, which would get the most use.  The floor makes a creaking sound, similar to flooring out in the hallways or stairs and areas with high traffic.  I believe this is subflooring that is no longer tightly nailed down. 

The grout has broken up in these areas.  I have removed grout from around ~ 9 tiles square.  Several tiles, especially those up against the cabinets are loose.  Others do not move.  The grout came up easily, by prying the pieces out.

Question is, “what is the recommended repair?”  Do I need to pull up the tile and renail the sub flooring?  Is there something missing on the subflooring to allow the movement and creaking?

I have never put down tile, and do not know what is under the tile.  I have put down pre-finished hardwood floor (not laminate), painted, and replaced windows.  Note that I am preparing the house for sale, and my goal is to repair the broken grout so it does not detract. 

Thanks,

Ted

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  1. DanH | Nov 03, 2013 08:44am | #1

    Sounds like the guy that put down that tile had never put down tile either.

    The subfloor/underlayment under ceramic tile must have essentially zero flex.  And the larger the tile, the closer to zero that needs to be.

    To do it right you'd need to tear it all up and put down a proper underlayment, sufficient to stiffen things.  Several guys here can give you advice on that -- there are a few different approaches, and how much you need to do depends on how bad it is.  Otherwise you can do a fairly decent "band-aid" by taking up the loose tiles, screwing down the underlayment as best you can, and reinstalling with a more flexible thinset and grout -- might last a year, might last another 15.

  2. florida | Nov 03, 2013 05:31pm | #2

    Pull several tiles up and see what's under them. You may even have to drill a hole through just to see how thick the plywood or underlayment is. If you have cement board it's pretty safe to assume you have an adequate subfloor. In that case the thinset hasn't held up and you'll need to pull up the loose tiles and re-set them. if you don't have an adequate subfloor then it's going to be your call. Stick them back down and kick the job down the road a few years or take them all up, install cement board and re-tile.

  3. User avater
    Mongo | Nov 04, 2013 12:46pm | #3

    ditto

    It's usually due to vertical movement in teh floor.

    If you find cement board under the subfloor, the movement is often caused by the cement board being set right on top of the subfloor instead of being set in a bed of thinset.

    If the tiles pop off something like hardibacker, the hardie can be very dusty/dirty, and that can interfere with the bond.

    If over wood, tile can be set over plywood, but only with certain considerations. Over particleboard? That's a bad move.

    So like the other have asked, what do you have (material and thicknesses) from the joists up to the tile?

    1. yelkenli | Nov 04, 2013 09:04pm | #4

      Thanks for the great recomendations.  I will post an update when I pull some tiles up. 

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