A current job requires me to mount kitchen cabinets on concrete block walls. Does anyone have any experience (sucessful or failures) with mounting techniques. The cabinets have 3″ x 1/2″ particle board mounting rails top and bottom and the blocks are not filled. I have plenty of ideas but wonder how they will work out:
1.ledger at bottom, and combo cement screws and molly bolts into hollow block at top. (Screws if can find mortor joints – all walls are plastered over – hence the surprise.
2.additional long screws up through top to ceiling joists, and maybe to top plate – but with particle board cases ???
3. Say sorry – I don’t hang on concrete block walls.
Chileab
the difference between stumbling blocks and stepping stones is the way you use them.
Replies
Are you sure it is block and not brick, since you mentioned plaster? If it is brick, you will probably find that some brick is softer than others, and you shouldn't count on being able to put a fastener where you want.
If it is really block it will probably be more consistent than brick, so you might have more options. I did a kitchen in my Great Aunt's house using tapcon screws to hold the cabinets, and that was block.
If you have a layer of plaster, then my suggestion is that you cut a channel out of the plaster to hold a nailing board, and put one in for both the top and bottom. You can even let it stick out a bit, but you might have to add some trim. Secure the nailer really well with lead anchors and lag screws. Then you can screw the cabinets to the nailer.
If there are any cabinets going in perpendicular to this wall, be sure to account for the additional depth of the nailer.
And whatever you do, don't do what someone did in my house which is put the upper cabinet right up against the side wall, where the door can't open fully because of the window trim.
Now I don't do this for a living, so I'm sure that people with more experience than me can probably come up with a bunch of other ways.
I'd use generous numbers of Tapcons through the hanging rails. Block holds Tapcons pretty well, but share the load among enough of them to give yourself a safety margin.
If you end up applying a wooden rail to the wall, set it in PL Premium to augment the screws to the block.
Bill
The 'ideal' thing would to use a Frech rail (nailer on cab has a bevel; nailer on wall has the same bevel inverted), so you could just Tapcon the wallnailer up and hang from that.
Your cabs have PB nailers, though. I suppose you could take a dovetail bit to the cabinets' nailers--but that's a ton of effort for the (already weighs a ton, each, boxes).
Ok, now that my shoulders ache from imagining hauling around PB cabinet carcasses . . . might not be a bad deal to rib some french hanger stock for both cabinets and walls.
You're close Cap'n. Use a square edge continuous cleat and let it carry the vertical load. Then use a few tapcons to keep the cabs tight to the walls.
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
Tapcons work ok but the heads are so big and Blue.
I just finished the same and I found a ???? You gonna make me go out in the trailer and find the boxes? It's a masonry screw with a standard ? maybe #8 Phillips head. The boxes has all the strength specs and they are plenty strong. they come in 1.5 2, 2.5, and 3" so it'll cover any need. I'm typing and trying to remember??? OK out to the trailer.
Ahh I wanted to say Spax but ya that's what they are. Says 300lb pull out and 150lb shear. Called a wood and masonry interior use.
You need to do a couple test to get the feel of the screw. The head seems a little soft so you have to pay attention to keep from stripping it with Phillips but it does have a combo with sq dr#2, but you have to do the same cause it's just a bit shallow.
I was losing sleep over how to hang them and this worked out nice. I didn't want to have to additionally trim out a hanging rail offset.
The picture is from the same place but the bthrm. But you can see it's block and plaster.
Try these concrete screwshttp://www.grkfasteners.com/
Wow hows that for a nice web site. I wish all of the sites I went to were so nice.
Those are some nice screws. Looking around I couldn't find any thing smaller then 1/4" in the conrete screws. I personally don't like big screws showing in cabinets, if I have the choice.
These in the picture have a smaller head and you need to use the small 1/8" concrete bit which is a bit of a pain cause you want to make sure you have the correct depth. But it gives a good finish appearance.
thanks for reminding me about GRK - I used to use them alot - I forgot they had these cement screws.
I currently use McFeely square drive screws for case joining (Promax) and the washer head type for case mounting. I like having one drive type (square) and not having to change bits - But the GRK screws are incredible - before I got my impact driver, they were the only screws I could drive into 2x4s without bracing my self with both legs and forcing the bit into a philips slot with all my might- the GRKs I could sink with one hand outstretched.
On this job - the client didn't want any more expense (he even tried to get me to move electrical at my expense cause he changed the initial cab design) so I ended up leaving off the crown and pushing the full overlay cabinets right up to the ceiling and getting a good bite into the double top plate on one wall and using Tapcons along the bottom. It held my 185 lb monkey test.
#What I still can't believe is that the client didn't think it relevant to tell anyone that the walls were hollow concrete block.
Chileab
the difference between stumbling blocks and stepping stones is the way you use them.
I've arrived at kitchen cabinet installs before with block walls that nobody told me about...a pita especially if you didn't see it coming.