I am going to be building some cabinet- storage units and would appreciate any advice I can get! They will be in a garage and so they do not have to be perfect , but they have to be decent looking. I’m going for a rustic look. I will tell you how I am planning to build them and you can point out improvements or tips from there.
Two of them will be floor to ceiling with about 60″ wide upper cabinets in between. I plan to use the wall and ceiling (finished drywall) for the back wall and ceiling of the inside of storage cabinets to save wood and labor. I was thinking of framing them with 2 x 2’s(ripped 2 x 4’s) and attaching 1/2″ plywood to this to make the shell of the cabinet. The sides of the cabinets will be faced with 1/4″ T & G pine , 3 1/4″ wide. My main question is what to construct the face frame out of? I was thinking maybe 1 x 4 select pine or a 1×6 ripped to 2 3/4″ wide. I do not want it to be too narrow because of the size of the units. For the doors I was thinking of using 1×3’s for a border and putting the same T & G pine in the middle set in from the back. The tall cabinets are about 36″ wide and 28-30″ deep!
The main thing I’m going for is a rustic look, not fancy, but solid and neat-looking. Any tips that you experienced carpenters can give me will be greatly appreciated. Also in the same garage will be 5/8 pine siding with grooves on 4″ center used as a wainscot about 42″ high. What would make a good cap rail for such a thick wainscot? Also for attaching the wainscot I was hoping to use 15 gauge x 2 1/2″ finish nails in my air nailer, maybe in combination with some liquid nails(over painted drywall). Would this be sufficient?? Please tell me of any flaws you see with any of the things I’m planning to do as I am not an experienced cabinet builder! Thanks!
Duey
Replies
Also for attaching the wainscot I was hoping to use 15 gauge x 2 1/2" finish nails in my air nailer, maybe in combination with some liquid nails(over painted drywall). Would this be sufficient??
Depends on what's behind the drywall. Assuming that the studs are vertical, your 15 ga nails will go through the wainscot, and through the drywall, an end in the air in the stud bay. Not a good attachment method. The liquid nails will help, but the nails you shoot will be mostly useless.
I plan to use the wall and ceiling (finished drywall) for the back wall and ceiling of the inside of storage cabinets to save wood and labor.
How you gonna attach those ply-and-2by panels to the wall? The same situation exists as for the wainscotting. Unless the cabinets are mounted to the studs, they won't stay up. It really is that simple. That's why commercially made cabinets have plywood backs, and/or attachment strips -- so the screws can go into the framing, regardless of where the framing is.
By the way, if your cabinets are truly floor-to-ceiling in a garage, note that those cabinets, and those doors, will be REALLY heavy. You should plan to use mounting screws into the framing at multiple locations, and probably four or more hinges per door.
Having said all that........if you plan carefully, you can use a combination of screws going through the 2by, and pocket screws, provided all of the mounting screws go into framing. And yes, you can use the existing drywall for some of the cabinet interior surfaces.
Unless you're the lead dog, the view just never changes.
I am trying to figure out why you would think I would shoot nails into the stud bay. I would be nailing the wainscot directly to the studs,(through the drywall). My question is whether or not 15 gauge x 2 1/2" finish nails, in conjunction with liquid nails would be sufficient? As for attaching the cabinet framing to the wall, the same principle will apply. I will have cross pieces in between the framing upright pieces that will definitely be screwed to the studs.
As for the weight of the doors, I will have two sets of doors,an upper and a lower and the material I described is not excessively heavy as compared to mdf.
Thanks anyway for your input?
Duey
I am trying to figure out why you would think I would shoot nails into the stud bay. I would be nailing the wainscot directly to the studs,(through the drywall).
In your original post, you spoke of putting the wainscotting over the painted drywall. I assumed that you were speaking of the existing drywall. And if you put vertical wainscotting over existing drywall, then your nails would be going into stud bays instead of studs.
If you plan on removing the drywall to put in horizontal nailers, then replacing and painting the drywall before securing the wainscotting, then you'll be fine.
Unless you're the lead dog, the view just never changes.
I just realized that I was not specific enough about the material I am using for wainscot. It is a 5/8" thick pine siding with grooves on 4" centers, and it is 4' x8' sheets. I am going to cut it for the proper height and apply 4' at a time. I should have specified that I was not using actual wainscot material! My mistake!
So my question still remains as to whether I can use my 15 gauge x 2 1/2" finish nails if I also put some liquid nails on also? I am concerned about the small head size but am hoping that the liquid nails will offset this concern! Thanks for the help and I apologize for the misunderstanding!
Duey
I have done this using 5/16 ply panels on drywall using 18ga. and PL Premium. The 5/16 panels are, of course, much lighter than the ones you would be using.
I dry fitted the panels first, then goobered up the wall and the panel back with lots of PL. The "trick" for me was to give the PL around 25 minutes or so of drying time before sticking the panel to the wall. That allows you about a 5 minute window to move your panel around a little before the PL begins to really set. The 18ga. nails will not hold the panel to the wall even if driven directly into studs due to the small heads, so all they were used for was to "pin" (cross pin) the panel in place while the PL finished curing.
Wall was very wavey and uneven, so I had to shim the panels in a few places, and since you are doing only a single 4ft. or less section at a time, it is very slow going. I doubt I could have charged enough for the actual time involved, but since this was my sister's house, it was all free gratis anyway! My guess is that the combination of 5/8 and 15ga. would result in the same situation where the heads would not hold the panels tight to the wall by themselves, but a great many things are possible with enough PL and patience!
Realize that once this is done and the PL has set hard, the only way to remove the panels will be to take out the drywall along with them.
15 ga nails, 2 1/2" long, with the assistance of the adhesive, will do just fine. Try to shoot the nails at an angle, and use opposing angles for nearby nails. That will negate the effect of the small nailheads.
(Sorry that my reply didn't come quickly.....I was gone for a long weekend.)
(Edited to add the angled nail suggestion.)
Unless you're the lead dog, the view just never changes.
Edited 5/3/2005 4:40 am ET by YESMAAM27577
One important aspect is to get the cabinets up off the floor. particularly if you like to wash the floor with a hose and/or live in an area with snow and road-salt. Sometimes this is as simple as building a base from 4-by PT lumber, but concrete pads cast onto the floor are better, you even get level surfaces to work with, then a thin poly sheet between the base and the concrete (you don't want the wood touching the concrete no matter how you design this thing). Another option for the break/pad/base is to use something UHMW polyethylene and sit it into a thin layer of mastic on the floor.
Phill Giles
The Unionville Woodwright
Unionville, Ontario
Phill,
Thanks for the response. I appreciate the tip on keeping it up off the floor! I had thought about using a pressure treated base, but I suppose it would still wick moisture. Much obliged!
Duey
Yeah, I follow wher you are going.
I'd rough the carcasses in on the wall, then build the faceframes separately. In an ideal world, I'd blind pocket screw all the joints.
I'd be tempted to pick one frame dimension jsut to keep it simple. So, ripping a 1x6 would get you a relatively uniform face frame 'stick'.
That's look something like the attachement.
I like a nice 1/2" overlay door, it's not hard to find hardware for.
Cap,
Thanks for the response! I am going to use your suggestion about using a consistent width on the face-frame material. I'm going to rip 1x6's, giving me about a 2 3/4" width. It should look about right for both the vertical and horizontal sticks! Thanks again!
Duey
It should look about right for both the vertical and horizontal sticks!
Yes, it's not a "traditional" shop approach, where the stiles are wider than the rails--but that's also part of a rustic look too, to be slightly atraditional.
I drew a "Z" brace on the back of one door mentally ruminating on using vertical T&G for the cabinet doors to match your wainscot. A frame & panel door might be as simple, though.
Which reminds me of a slick detail I saw in a garage cabinet once. The doors were a flat panel construction using a rabbet in the front of the door rails & stiles. This made the front panel only about 1/16 from the door frame, but allowed asecond rabbet on the back to accept a pegboard for the inside of the door. It was a cool detail.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)