Several month’s ago there was a good discussion on which types of line to use for phone, cable or internet. The archive isn’t helping me so I was hoping someone could quote the best current specs. I’ll be trenching in the wire utilities and losing the overhead. Any recommendations on conduit and spacing would be most appreciated.
Look closely at these common locations for hazardous materials in older homes.
"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.
Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.
Start Free Trial NowGet instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.
Start Free Trial Now
Replies
Just been pulling wire, so a couple of thoughts:
CAT5e Plenum -- higher speed ratings (I'm, vs I'm of the "old" CAT5).This is the computer cable wire. Four twisted pairs. The Plenum rating is just a "low smoke" jacket if burned. It is but it is designed for running in walls, over rafters, etc. About $150/1000ft vs the plain jacketed indoor/outdoor that runs $50/1000ft.
RG6 for the Cable TV connections. Best is to have EACH outlet for the TV coming back to a Central location. Previous homeowners did a daisy chain, no fun for upgrading and "end of the line" was quite noisy.
PHONE Cable -- CAT5e will also work (four twisted pair). My biggest concern is cross talk of noise from the computers running next to the phone lines as the cable is not shielded.
Anyone have a pro/con about the Leviton Gang Blocks? Figure might as well run computer/TV/phone connectors too all the rooms while I am at for future expansion.
Tom
The Leviton gang blocks go to the question of spacing. The discussion month's ago mentioned not paralleling phone and cable lines to avoid "noise". But if all the lines are going to the same block what distance makes for parallel or does it count as a "cross"? No problems, only opportunities.
I don't think you should worry about cross talk between phone and data. I would run them in separate cables, but no need to worry about running the cables in parallel. Basically, twisted pair ethernet was designed to be run near voice phone lines
If you are running DSL over the voice line, then you might want to keep that routed separately from the Ethernet. This concern is mostly theoretical and depends on what type of DSL you are using, and mostly depends on where you put the filters and DSL "modem". I connect my DSL shortly after entering the house and put filters on the voice lines downstream from that, so that it is not an issue.)
DonH
Sounds like you have the categories in hand (Standard phone cable is Cat 3, as I know it) Don't forget, for computers and phones, use solid core cable, as opposed to braided. Some people make the mistake of using what is referred to as patch cable wire as opposed to solid core for their runs and vica-versa. This is a very bad practice, as the braided cable should only be used to go from the jack to the device and the solid core for the runs from jack to jack or wiring block in the case of phones. The reasons for this are that the braided cable is not as well shielded, if at all, and is made to accept the teeth in the modular connector that is pushed down into it. The solid core cable is made to be pushed down into the "V like" connectors of the jacks and terminators, or twisted under screws.
My advice is that you invest in some tools with whatever you do.
Get a decent modular crimper, and BNC crimper, expect to spend a little over $100 for both. The Modular crimper can be purchased at almost any large home improvement store, or computer center, and will be usable for RJ11 through RJ45 connectors. The BNC or coaxial crimper you may want to consider is also a professional level one that will allow you to use the connectors which squeezes on. Get the one that ratchets down, so that you will not have to spend all day going at it. (Using the twist on connectors for the BNC can be a frustrating and nasty experience.) Also get a good BNC stripper, for about $10. A few times when I have tried to cheap it out, and still make a "perfect connection." I have found myself working for as much as 45 minutes to an hour per connection, fouling it up, whereas with the right tools it took less then five minutes, and worked the first time.
If you are really going for broke, then you will also want to get what is called a toner, or tone generator. This allows you to trace connections with telephone, computer, and cable connections. It will set you back about $120+, but is well worth it, if you have a lot of runs to work with, or many cables in each location. In addition, pull at least one extra cable, of each type for each location, because cable is very cheap, your time is not, even if you are a DIY'er. I leave the extra sitting in the wall, taped an inch or so down on the good cable. This lets you put in multiple connections, add extra band width, add in other devices, and if a line goes bad, which sometimes happens, you can switch to another one easily. On top of that, if you have to pull anything new, feed the extra cable back, with a new line attached, or a pulling line attached, attach your new lines, pull back, and presto! You have a new run with minimal effort, and no disruption of the existing connections. Don’t forget, also to leave about an extra six inches in the wall or hidden area for slack.
Tom,
Why plenum vs. the cheap stuff?
Pete
Why plenum vs. the cheap stuff?
Pete,
Case of Monkey see, Monkey do! The Plenum rated cable can supersede the other communication cable requirements. I was under the impression the FEP insulation, as opposed to PVC, had a much longer life and better electrical spec's over time... (ie wrt moisture, age, etc). Now that I go looking for a reference, I can not find it!
Good old PVC is fine for dwellings, but wouldn't be surprised to see Plenum rated to become a spec for dwelling due to fire (low combustible) and smoke (low smoke) issues a few years down the road.
Good infor: http://www.dupont.com/teflon/cablingmaterials/faq.html
Tom
Even during small house fires considerable amounts of dioxin can form because PVC is present in interior furnishings and products such as floorings and wallpapers, and electrical equipment such as cables. The hydrochloric acid which forms when PVC is burned can lead to life threatening lung damage and causes serious corrosion to buildings as well.
If it is within the walls you're pretty safe unless you sniffing for the fire location but if you install it in areas that share a common air space then you might consider plenum cable. This rule is mainly for office buildings that have false celings where smoke can travel easily from one occupied space to another. If Greenpeace has its way, it will be mandatory and PVC will be banned.
The bad part is that you already have a ton of PVC items in your home. This little bit of cable isn't going to be a significant addition. I know a litle less in this case is probably better than a little more. I won't argue that so the choice is his.
Steve - in Northern California
Edited 7/25/2002 4:31:49 PM ET by Steve Schefer
Do you have or are you planning on using digital phones? Do you have a computer network with a router or switch and hub(s). Is your cable TV digital, do you have a digital audio system and will it be distrubted. Do you have an intercom system or a burglar alarm.
Pull the highest grade cable you can get. Sooner or later you will need it if you stay up on technology with your terminal devices. Cat 5(E) is rated at 100mbs for runs of approximately 365'. If you are running a switch and have a full duplex 100mbs network interface card in your computer, you can usually run in full duplex mode and get speeds of up to 200 mbs but thats only on your internal network.
If you have internet access via a dsl connection your internet access speed maximum (downstream) is 1.5mbs, upstream is usually 128k but can be 384k. Unless you are transferring large data files back and forth on your internal network, you'll might not need anything more than CAT5(E). You do not need to spend the extra money for plennum grade wire unless you run it in your attic or anyplace else where access to more than one habitable room is possible through a common air space.
RG6 is a must for digital cable TV. Don't skimp here and make every run a home run back to a main splitter. Use RG6 rated connectors and splitter.
Put mulit access drops everywhere you can - Places like the Kitchen, Bathrooms, Garage, Patio, etc. Anyplace you might want to someday have a TV, computer, phone, etc.
Here's another thing you might want to consider.. Fiber Optic cable.... Many of the cable companies have run it to the poles just not into the houses yet. When they offer it you will surely want it so why not run it now. Computer network connectifvity is moving towards fiber also and phone systems with video will most certainly require it.
There are sources for multi purpose cable. This is a single wrapper with multiple types of cable. It can include phone, cat5, rg6, audio and fiber. I cant remember who makes it off hand but it is available.
Steve - in Northern California
"Here's another thing you might want to consider.. Fiber Optic cable.... Many of the cable companies have run it to the poles just not into the houses yet. When they offer it you will surely want it so why not run it now. Computer network connectivity is moving towards fiber also and phone systems with video will most certainly require it."
Steve,
Although this is very common advice, IMHO I would not bother with fiber. Generally, by the time a technology makes it to the point that it is affordable for the home (for non-geeks anyway) it is usually based on Cat5 twisted pair. Today, you can run 1 gigiabit/sec links on the same Cat5 installed 10 years ago for 10 megabits/sec. I have seen some indication that 10 G/sec is possible over Cat 5.
For example, I believe it is likely that next generation entertainment streams will be based on digital transmission within the home. (It is almost there today. E.g., DirecTV and most new cable systems deliver the content to the home in a digital format. Only a small step to use digital to distribute within the home to the final consumer device.) And HTDV video only takes about 12 megabits/sec. Well within standard 100 megabit/sec technology available today (that runs fine over Cat5).
As as far as that goes, I have stopped running any networking cable around my house other than to select places. Current 802.11a wireless networks can support data rates well over 50 megabits/sec. Plenty even for video. (And in fact, this what is behind some recent Microsoft activity in this area, I believe).
I pretty much agree with the other recommendations.
DonH
Edited 7/25/2002 12:14:55 AM ET by DonH
Edited 7/25/2002 12:16:37 AM ET by DonH
Don't remember if anyone said this.
put in a pull line in those conduits. will make life easier laterbobl Volo Non Voleo Joe's cheat sheet
I agree, we're running gigabit data on cat5e between our NAS devices here. Fiber is available but cost prohibitive in the current IT money crunch. The nicest aspect of Fiber is that there is no way to interfere with it except physical damage. If you want crystal clear communications then fiber is the only way to go. He could run a single multi-fiber line with converters and not have to worry about how close it is to anything. Steve - in Northern California
From a practical standpoint, it is highly unlikely that there is anything in a residential installation that can interfere with Ethernet over Cat5e. The differential signaling used over most twisted pair is pretty robust to that.
The main place to screw up an install is by bending the cable too sharply, or untwisting too much of the wire at the terminations. Parallel runs with power and other signaling cable can, in theory, cause difficulty. But in practice, just a little bit of common sense is needed to avoid obvious pitfalls and occasional parallel routing rarely causes problem. (Even really serious parallel routing rarely causes problems, but no reason to tempt fate that way.)
About the only place I would use fiber is for the digital interconnects between stereo components.
DonH
> And HTDV video only takes about 12 megabits/sec
The ATSC broadcast stream is about 19.38 Mbit/sec., and that has the holy crap compressed out of it. Although I've seen it survive a trip thru 6' of coax with pre-molded RCA connectors, we'll probably be using fiber more and more. For home originated HD, we're not likely to see ATSC compression, the compressors are just to complex and costly. It will be more cost effective to compress less where we don't have the problem of cramming it thru a 6 MHz broadcast channel. While we might not be routing SMPTE 292M around the house at 1.485 Gbit/sec, something like 100 - 200+ Mbit/sec home DV could be what finally shakes out in 5 - 10 years.
HDTV is still very new. The A.C. Nielsen company was asked about doing ratings for HD, and their response was that out of 30,000 Nielsen families, only four have it. So this is still very much the wild west. To really see the detail in an HD signal, you need a big picture. No way will glass picture tubes ever be adequate for HD. In fact, one problem we have today is that even the best DILA and DLP front projectors aren't up to a full 1920 x 1080 pixels. So nobody *really* knows what we're putting on tape. HD will take off when the public has a mindset change, and front projection TV becomes the norm rather than being only for ultra high end home theater.
-- J.S.
Generally, with the the cost of MPEG chipsets going down, most consumer DVB gear will be based on compressed video stream distribution within the home, not uncompressed PCM video, IMHO. Also, a technology that requires the mass market to retrofit existing structures with fiber will never get past the infancy/niche phase. For interconnects of a few feet, I do see it (and it is a natural follow-on to the TOSLink stuff used in audio today).
DirecTiVo and related products are an existence proof for this.
You are probably one one of those golden-eye videophile sorts :-). I worked with one of those at Sun while working on DVB stuff. He was always pointing out the MPEG compression artifacts during the football games on my digital cable.
BTW, my point in mentioning HDTV was to look out a few years, since the question was about future-proofing. With current source material into the home being under 6-12 Mbit/sec (even off DVD), certainly fiber is not needed to meet today's requirements.
Folks have been recommending fiber for high-end residential and commercial "future-proofed" installations for over a decade, and in my experience (I work professionally in the networking industry, including work in the past on FDDI and ATM) I have only seen the pre-installed fiber to the desk used in very rare cases. (and never in the residential context.) The technology waterfall keeps making it obsolete by the time the application makes it way to the desktop or home.
DonH
> Generally, with the the cost of MPEG chipsets going down, most consumer DVB gear will be based on compressed video stream distribution within the home, not uncompressed PCM video, IMHO.
I agree, MPEG or Motion JPEG will make sense in consumer applications, depending on whether or not you need to edit. But certainly not compressed as severely as ATSC. Last time I looked, DVB was the acronym for a European digital broadcast system that used COFDM instead of the ATSC's 8-VSB for channel coding. Has it become a generic for digital video stuff?
>You are probably one one of those golden-eye videophile sorts :-).
Actually, I work at Paramount Television, Director of Technology. I see enough video at work, at home I might watch the news. All the time I can muster goes into fixing up the house instead.
> The technology waterfall keeps making it obsolete by the time the application makes it way to the desktop or home.
Yup. It's such a crapshoot now that the only thing that makes any sense to me is to put in conduit and boxes, and just pull in whatever it is whenever it gets here.
-- J.S.
I'm doing a similar job right now. The best location for a conduit from an installation point of view would come in about 8" from the conduit that carries the service into the house. Is there a way to shield this? Would steel conduit do it?
I'm in a performance-sensitive computing field, so I'd like to be able to run 1000baseT.
Pete
> Would steel conduit do it?
Probably, but before you commit to a full installation, see if you can put a temporary approximation together and test it.
-- J.S.
This addresses a few things posted in several messages.
It is impossible to forsee the future. In every case where
I have seen people run fancy new services in anticipation
of them being used later, they have not been well used.
Technology changes too fast. Fiber is particularly troublesome.
1000Base-T is faster than many older fiber systems. The
phone company outside plant is in many cases decades old.
They develop high-speed technology that works over the old
wires. Fiber is difficult to terminate, requires special equipment,
and is not really popular except for special circumstances.
It is immune to interference and eliminates ground problems.
Some stereo equipment now uses it for short connections.
I would not bury it in a wall unless a customer actually had
equipment that needs it right now.
You can't attempt to provide every type of connection. Some
are not simply run and have severe distance limits (firewire).
Some are too limited in scope (Appletalk). Some are expensive
and of little real use in the home (fiber). If you run CAT-5E
and coax, you will cover 99% of the residential applications.
I grew up in a house that had a total of 20 feet of phone wire
and one black dial telephone. I just finished wiring a high-end
home with 9000 feet of assorted cables. They'll look back in
30 years and marvel at how they got along with such stone-age
technology.
As far as running data in close proximity to service feeds,
I have never actually seen a problem with this. Even when
you run data through the same holes as the power. Not a good
idea, but I still have not actually seen a problem. I have
seen many problems related to bad grounding on long runs.
If you stay 8" away from a service feed, there should be no
problem. As far as steel conduit, I would recommend against it.
You get induced currents, have to worry about proper grounding,
worry about cutting the cable on sharp edges, install plastic
bushings, etc. Unless you need it for mechanical protection
of the cable, I would stick to plastic conduit.
For security cameras, most cameras today can be powered directly
off the coax. Some claim good performance using twisted pair,
but I would still go with coax. Some cameras now include ####passive infrared sensor. So, they need twisted pair for that
in addition to the video. I run one coax and one 4-pair cable
for each camera. Unless you have exotic stuff like pan/tilt heads
and such, this will be sufficient. For security systems, it is
a very good idea to pick the system first and then install the
wiring. You won't have any surprises that way. Some recommend
heavier wire than CAT-5.
A whole-house UPS is fantasy. The first thing that will happen
is somebody will plug in a couple laser printers and a space
heater and blow it up. While you're at it, why not install
T-1, OC3, twinax, token ring, and go for Tempest certification?
The bottom line is: install what you need - ignore the rest.
Two coax, a CAT-5E and a 4-pair phone line to each wall plate.
You will leave 90% of that unused anyway. Stereo and fancy
TV systems need specific wiring that is compatible with the
system. The same goes for alarm systems. If you know what
they need, put it in. If not, put in some 4-pair for PIR
sensors and a couple alarm pads. It will all change in
5 years, or maybe one year.
"A whole-house UPS is fantasy."
How so? Aren't UPSs installed in most computer lab settings?
Are they considerably more expensive than purchasing one for each individual computer/AV set up in the house?
Just curios.
"Two coax, a CAT-5E and a 4-pair phone line to each wall plate."
Can you not use Cat-5 for phones as well?
Yes, you can (and should) use CAT-5 for phones.
Gives you more flexibility about how you use the wires
later. 10, 100, or 100BASE-T only actually use 4 wires
out of the eight. In a pinch, I've wired phone and
network or security stuff in the same cable. I run
white CAT-5 for phones and blue for network. CAT-3
is a little cheaper for phones, but not usually ####significant savings.
In a large computer installation, you may use a facility
UPS. They're very expensive. Starting at a couple thousand
for a little thing suitable for a couple servers. Going
all the way to many tens of $ thousands for a big unit for
a mainframe. Smaller units are cheaper on a dollars/per Watt
basis. Big units have ferro-resonant preconditioners and
all sorts of fancy features. Automatic generator starting,
multiple redundancy, hot swap. Not necessary in a small unit.
They're used in a very controlled environment. You can't walk
up and plug in your radio or hair dryer. Laser printers use
thousands of watts when the fuser comes on. A definite no-no
on a UPS unless you really need to be printing during a power
outage.
Say you want to put in a central UPS for a residence. You run
the power wire down to a UPS in the basement. Consumer-type
UPS systems have a line cord and some outlets. A real bad
idea to run an extension cord buried in the wall and
permanently wired to an oulet. Got to buy a UPS designed
for permanent installation. A whole different class of animal
than a simple plug-in type. Probably $3000 minimum. A residence
would need maybe a 600 Watt unit for an average system.
Maybe $150. The batteries in a UPS have a limited life. They're
sealed lead-acid batteries. 3 years to maybe 6 at the outside.
Then they need replacement. A little UPS will cost you $50 to
$100 for batteries, plus installation. Often not an easy install.
Often cheaper to trash it and buy another one. A big UPS can cost
many hundreds (or thousands) for batteries. In residential use
people may plug anything into the UPS. Power goes out and you need
to do your hair. Lets plug the hair dryer into the UPS! In
commercial settings, I find the most frequent cause of failure
is because secretaries plug in their little fan/heater to keep
their feet warm. 1.5 to 5 kW of power. They don't know the UPS
is only good for 300 to a couple kW. An outlet is an outlet.
Kaboom.
So, the short answer is that it is less expensive and a more
reasonable choice to just get a properly sized individual UPS
for each home application. I have a real big setup at home.
Four 1.5 kW units and a 5 kW industrial unit. But, this is
what I do for a living primarily. I still would not be tempted
to put in a central UPS. No advantage except a few less boxes
under the desks, but a lot more money and more expensive to
maintain. When A UPS fries (about once every 2 years), just pitch
it and get a new one. Technology changes too fast in this area
to consider buying a big system and burying it in the basement.
When it breaks, you call an expensive repair guy. When the little
one under your desk blows up, you just run out to K-mart.
Now, if you're living off-grid and have solar or wind or some
alternative energy source, you probably have a de-facto whole-house
UPS system. But, you also have a ton or so of batteries and
a very large investment.
Bob, do you know what the wiring requirements will for High Definition TV when it becomes standard. I've seen bundled 5 rg6's for this purpose, but it's rudely expensive.
Paul
There's no standard that I know about. Most
setups I've worked on use a projection TV or
monitor and connect the HDTV tuner with S-video
or the SVGA computer connector. You can't run
S-video very far. MAybe 20 feet. Likewise the SVGA.
If you want to distribute base-band HDTV video, you'd
have to run 3 coax and convert to S-video at the set.
But, you're talking about a setup for a studio and
a price tag to go with it. For home use, baseband video
would probably only go within a single room.
The tuner uses about twice the bandwidth of a regular
TV channel, but that's not really relevant. 6 versus
12 MHz on a cable good for a couple gigahertz makes no
difference. There's some talk that cable boxes or sat
tuners will need an extra coax for HDTV, but I don't really
think so. Most of the HDTV differences are in the tuner
and monitor, not the cable plant. Five RG-6 cables would be
necessary only to pipe RGB or YIQ baseband video plus
antenna and satellite. I don't see doing that. I do usually
run 2 coax and 3 if they'll put up with that, but not because
of HDTV. One for antenna, one for satellite or cable, and
one for optional output so you can run more than one TV
(not at the same time) from the same cable or satellite box.
You can multiplex it all together on one cable, but its messy
and expensive. The extra cable is cheaper and more flexible.
You can mix the off-air and cable on one coax, but there's
extra gizmos involved, 6 extra dB loss minimum. You get
signal strength problems, noise, big problems in fringe areas.
Once in a blue moon I'll get a real complicated job that needs
lots of cables, but that's for somebody who's doing a home
studio or something equally complex. I'm sticking with the
2 or 3 coax system for general residential. In a few years
somebody will have to poke more cables anyway. They'll invent
something new and everything will change.
Bob:
Thank you for your fast and through response.
I think I'll run three rg6's and three cat5e to each point. The plan is to have four computers, and five TVs' wired into different rooms in the house. The TV's will probably be on cable as will the internet connection hooked up to a router.
It's an old brick home built in 1870's which I've completely gutted. I'll be posting some pic's before the walls go up.
Thanks again for the advice.
Paul
That's a good mix. You can fit 6 connectors
on a single-gang wallplate. You only really
need 2 CAT-5 cables, one for phone and one for LAN,
but I usually run one extra of everything. MAybe
half the time you end up needing it here and there.
$10 extra for cable at this point is way cheaper than
having to add a wire later. I usually only terminate
2 CAT-5 and 2 coax. I leave the rest coiled in the wall.
No point spending an extra $10 on connectors until
you need them. Easy to put on connectors anytime.
95% of the time, all you need is cable, antenna,
phone and LAN. I use metal plaster rings, not boxes.
Easy to reach your hand inside and do stuff. Never
enough room in a box to easily bend all the coax.
Plus, you're always fighting the little cable clips.
Ty-rap the wires together and screw it to the stud
where it can be seen. When they drywall and push all the
wires inside you can find them later. Get the ty-raps with
a little molded screw hole. Also use them to secure the
cable every couple feet. Staples are bad for coax.
If you don't crimp the cable, you hit it with the hammer.
Don't forget the security system. CAT-3 is cheap.
Just run it to an upper corner of each room on a wall
facing away from the windows. Run another couple pairs
to places where you might want an entry/exit keypad.
Bury them in the wall and drywall over them. If you
ever want a security system, just poke a few holes
and pull out the wire. Cost maybe $100. Run a heavy
pair someplace where you might want to put a siren,
like the attic.
Don't get lazy. Label both ends of every cable. Saves
hours and lots of swearing later.
Thanks for the advice. Are the metal plaster rings the same as a mud ring?
My wife is dead set against an alarm system. She feels that a well lit exterior, good doors and windows and a built-in safe is all we need. But your right, I'll throw some Cat 3 in the walls.
I have also been playing with the idea of wiring for some outside cameras, which I gather requires a single run of CAT5e and RG6 each.
Paul
Yes, same thing. I like the metal ones because
the drywall people can't cut through them.
I don't like security systems either, but it does
add to resale value and the wires are real easy
put in when the walls are open.
Some exterior cameras need coax, some just need
twisted pair. No need for RG6. Any cheap 75-ohm
cable is fine in this case. Some cameras just screw
in like a light bulb and send data over the power line
like X-10. They're expensive, though. Your safest bet
is one CAT3 and one coax, like RG59.
IMHO, I suspect 100BaseT will be sufficient for some time. Most people can't even max out 10BaseT with sustained output from their hard drives as it is. I do hard drive to hard drive backups and get about 8 gigs/hr, which works out to about 16.1 meg/sec bandwidth. Even though burst rates on HD's have increased dramatically, the sustained output has remained somewhat constant for the last 5 years. If you have 4 striped cheetahs (a raid array, not an animal) in your server you might actually max out a 100 baseT, but then, does that justify the added expense of gigabit connectivity?
I'm looking at adding home video security. Could one use cat5 for that? I'm thinking of using each pair as a joined conductor for lower resistance. One pair for signal+, one for signal ground, one for power+ and the last pair for power ground. I have heard of people successfully using existing phone wiring for this application. If the camera draws 150 mA of 12V, would (2) 24ga conductors be sufficient to carry this current? I'd also like to buy one 12V power supply and run all cameras off of it. The other option would be to pull separate runs of RG6 and probably 20 ga speaker wire. But since I figure to have several hundred feet of Cat5 left over from the puter project, why not use for other systems?
TIA Bob
I'm no expert on any of this, but two things haven't been mentioned that could be thrown on to the pile:
Firewire. Firewire is a powered networking format. Mostly used in video to computer connections, though the plan is to be able to connect any AV device to any other AV device via Firewire.
Wireless. I think it's extremely important to have pullable conduits chases throughout the house, but I think the reality is that we'll just be seeing less and less wires over time. Most 'new' home networks are wirless. My phones are all wireless. I have satellite (no more cable wire to the house). When we move we probably won't bother with a phone wire by using cell phones. They are now selling wireless printers, wireless speakers, etc...
But, I'd have to agree with most everything said here...run all your wires to a central point (ideally a room suitable for running a server/central computer...ie, not wet, not so enclosed as to over heat, it's own circuit, etc.). And run ALL of your wires back...the phone, Cat5, Coax, etc. I'd also put every cable into every room (don't forget the kitchen...or garage).
And if you REALLY want to impress the geek-buyer, run one 4-socket outlet from each room back to the main with a system-wide UPS...you'll make plenty o' geeks (both computer AND av) smile over that one....and while you are at it, stick that outlet just above desk-level. Having to crawl under desks constantly gets old.
I would not run Fiber Op, because the costs will be rather high, and the return not enough to warrant it, in my opinion. The bottleneck, for most people, will be their connection to the internet, not what they have in the house. The highest speeds to the internet that most average consumers achieve now are only marginally over 10Bt, so anything faster then that externally is not going to get you anything. Also, the equipment to work with and test Fiber Op is not readily available to average consumers, nor is it "easy to use", from what I understand from electrician relatives and friends. Solid connections, without some hands on training, is not easy to achieve for first timers and novices. The equipment to do it "right" may be rather expensive. I would recommend just running Cat 5 or 5e, it is relatively fast, and easy, all the equipment can be had for a marginal cost, and just about anyone that can hold a tool and read a diagram can handle it. Considering also that Cat5/5e is capable of doing Gigabit Ethernet, it should hold us over for some time on the consumer market. Also bear in mind that that most at home consumer products, switches and hubs are geared to 10BaseT, and 100BaseT. The only reason that I can think of for fiber is if you are doing massive transmissions of data of any kind internally, or have some huge bandwidth to the internet, like a T3.
Whoa...wait a minute.... Didn't you read my posts. I said run fiber with converters so that you don't have to pull it again. Fiber is cheap and no longer difficult to install like it used to be. It was just an idea. If pulling it again is not going to be a problem if it does become reality in the future then theres no need to pull it now I guess.
Technically speaking, DSL is a two wire solution so the theoretical (advertised) 1.5mbps/128mbps data transfer rates are no where near that of a DS1 or DS3. These are full duplex multi-channel solutions running at 1.5mbps and 45mbps. They are 4 wire solutions with synchronization channels. By the way, the term T1 and T3 refer to AT&T Data lines only. Lots of folks don't realize that since it used to be that AT&T had the only high speed data lines available. Oh, by the way, that cute little internet web site that is supposed to check you internet speed is sponsored by people selling broadband connections.
The most common use in networking is on the backbone only. This keeps the bottle neck from occuring between the hubs and the routers or the switches and the routers or just the switches whichever configuration you might have.
Oh yeah, I make cabinets, have done a heck of lot of plumbing, was a darn good naval communications technician and have been a systems engineer/consultant for the better part of the last 10 years. I also make a lot of mistakes.Steve - in Northern California
Hmmmm, I stand corrected on all of the above. Apparently I am under some serious mis-conceptions about fiber and its handling, and will have to look into this more closely. I apologize for opening my mouth and speaking to quickly, no insults or impugning of any reputations was meant. (This goes to show that one should try to keep quiet and have everyone think you are intelligent rather then open you mouth and confirm your ignorance!) My thoughts are copper oriented because that is what I am used to, good at, and have all the testing and crimping equipment for. What I should have done, instead of trying to show off, was to simply ask if the cost differential of the equipment justifies it? How easy is it really? I have Cat5 run in my house, and a 100bT switch that I will just pull out and replace when I feel the need to go to the Gigabit bandwidth. However, that being said my ultimate bottleneck is the internet connection. I find that the 100bT internal speed is pretty adequate for data transfer and transmissions.
RG6 Quad shield for coax. Slightly more expensive,
but lower loss. Always run everything back to the panel.
Do NOT daisy chain anything.
If you can manage it, run two coax to every plate.
If you only run one and you have satellite, then
you have to use a diplexer to merge the satellite
and off-the-air antenna connections. Then you have
to separate them out again with another diplexer filter
at the TV. Always run an extra phone line with the coax.
May need it for the satellite thingy. Also, a second
coax allows you to feed the satellite or cable box
output back into another TV if you want to run more
than one from the same box. In that case, make sure you
have an extra CAT3 or similar in case you need to run
an infra-red remote repeater so you can run the box with
its remote from another room. There are gigs made by
Leviton and others that run an IR repeater over the coax,
but they're not cheap and not always compatible with
everything. Also note some cable systems use two coax (A/B).
If that's your local system, run 3 coax to each place.
So, I run two (3) RG6 quad-shield coax, one CAT5 for phone (yes, you
only need CAT3, but..) and a CAT3 to each location where ####TV will go. Costs $10 more, but you won't be sorry later.
CAT-5E for data. Any old junk for phone, IF you run ####separate CAT3 cable for each line. If you run just one
4-pair for phone, use good stuff (CAT-5) to reduce crosstalk.
Audio and home theater are all over the map these days.
Best to have the system in-hand first. Some use special
cables (Bose). A very few want fiber. Some want fancy
speaker cable. Most need an S-video cable. Try to wire up
to the attic or down to the basement so you can pull cables
later. If you're meticulous and paranoid, include a pull
cord along with the wires so you can pull another in later.
Then you pull the extra stuff along with a new pull cord.
Conduit is sometimes helpful, but you have to watch about
fire stops. Some places make you plug them, which is not
much help for future expansion.
Currently the front yard is dug up so this is my chance to eliminate the overhead tangle. My inclination is to run a separate conduit for each service. Is there a minimum distance between conduits or can phone, cable and data even share a conduit for a short run (or longer)? Is there a minimum required separation from the electrical service? Used to be that you'd want a mile wide gap. Are the new category shieldings good enough to eliminate these concerns?No problems, only opportunities.
You can't share a trench with the electrical
or other services. Separation of the phone
is usually 3 feet and depth is usually shallow,
like 18 inches. The Phone Company does everything
up to the box on the wall (POP or Point Of Presence).
What you actually get depends on how big a bozo the
telco installer is. I've seen cables as shallow as
2 inches and had to fix it. No problem sharing conduits
with any phone/data/video cables. Just not with AC power.
Try to cross any signal wires with power at a right angle.
Don't run them within an inch or two for more than ####few inches. Cable-to-cable crosstalk is minimal. I see
commercial jobs with hundreds of cables bundled almost solid.
The biggest problem is running 4 phone lines on a single
4-pair cable. Then you are likely to get a little crosstalk
if two modems are running and you use CAT3 cable. Better to
run one cable per line or use CAT5 cable. Its very slightly
better shielded. Nothing to really worry about. The Phone
Company runs 500 pair cables for miles without much problem.
The major problem is not crosstalk, its grounding. Make sure
all grounds are separate and don't connect anywhere except
source and destination. If you have a bad (or none) electrical
ground someplace, you can get substantial differences between
the signal and power grounds, like a couple volts. This makes
some equipment very unhappy. A badly crimped coax connector can
cause problems everywhere. A faulty or miswired appliance
can put a couple volts on the ground that raises havoc with
the electronics. Bad hum problems can be fixed with ground
isolators or transformers. Good ones are not cheap, so try not
to have that problem.
Not mentioned before, you need a whole-house surge protector
AND a telephone surge protector. The whole house thing goes
in the panel and connects to a 220 breaker pair. The phone
lines are protected by the phone company, but only enough to
prevent damaging THEIR lines. A close lightning strike can
send hundreds of volts onto the line and trash phones, computers,
fax, satellite. There are both varistor and gas discharge
protectors. The gas ones are hard to get and more expensive,
but I trust them more. The varistor ones can sometimes blow up
after a few big spikes and you never know it. The gas ones last.
Make sure you have a good ground rod and a solid ground connection
to the surge protectors.
This stuff changes so fast that there's just about zero chance of installing now what you'll want for the life of the structure. I've given up on guessing. I'm just putting empty boxes and conduit in, running up to the attic on the second floor and down to the crawl space on the first. That's all you really need to do now, with that you can pull in whatever you want whenever they invent it. You can decide at that time whether to home run or daisy chain.
-- J.S.