I finished this project before Christmas, kind of a last minute rush job, went back today to get some photos after the client finished the tile and hwd floor. The original stairs were built by some real hacks, difference in risers heights varied as much as 1 1/2 inches not to mention out of level by as much as 1/2 inch.
Stair treads are carpet, all wood parts are Captured Bark Rustic Maple, kind of a mutant of the hard maple tree, some of the bark, instead of being pushed outward when the tree grows is captured by the new growth and remains embedded in the lumber producing a deep rustic texture often surrounded by burly looking grain. Pictures do not do justice to the wood.
1st photo before picture.
2nd. full view new stairs
3rd. Inside of stringer
4th. side view section
5th close up of newel and balusters
Replies
Some under const. photos.
Stringers were laminated in a vacuum bag. On the floor to the right of the bag is the full sized masonite stringer template. The outside stringer needed to have some mass so I laminated 4 layers of 1/2 inch baltic birch plywood for the core and faced it off with resawn bookmatched 1/8 inch thick veneer. Inside stringer is 2 layers of 3/8 baltic birch plus 1/8 in. veneer front and back. Balusters are 1 3/4 squares turned on a 45 degree diamond pattern. Staircase finished with 3 coats Sherwin Williams Kem-Var catalized conversion varnish.
Photo 1 Stringer Router jig
Photo 2 balusters being prefitted to stringer.
Armin
Thats some good looking wood!
Good job
Doug
Armin: I am watching....your projects are always top notch...good work
Beautiful Armin! I like that captured bark maple...with a wonderful light finish!
Any estimates as to how much time you have in this project?
Could you tell us about the vacumn bag? If that's what that is. I've never seen one of those in action. Do tell.
Jim,
Yes I use a vacuum bag for most of my laminating. It saves time and the clamping pressure is a uniform 13 pounds per square inch. Not only does the bag eliminate a lot of clamps but the pressure is so uniform that it will produce perfectly flat and straight lumber. I use 8 bags of various sizes, one is a stringer bag, capable of laminating a 14in. x 3 inch thick x 17 ft long stringer. two bags are sized to do stair treads, a variety of narrow long bags for curved trim and rails and a big 60 x 130 bag for tops and big flat work. In the photo below the stringer is half in the bag. I start out by placing a straight plank on 4 saw horses, leveled with a string to avoid sags. The bag is unrolled on the plank and folded open lengthwise. The core laminates are pre-cut, numbered and cleaned up ready to glue. Things need to be in order since you only have about 30 minutes to glue all surfaces, pin together and seal the bag. Two people can do it without to much trouble.
This stringer is rather thick so I opted to laminate the core and rout the cuts for riser and treads before laminating the face veneers. The advantage to doing this is you are not risking all by taking real deep cuts with the finish veneer in place, avoiding the one hiccup and your toast syndrome. After the face veneer is in place I trim the cuts with a follow bit, so far I haven't botched one.
If you look closely to the lower left on the floor there is a section of black plastic heavy duty screen, about 1/8 in holes. The screen is placed on top of the stringer inside the bag. It's purpose is to prevent air pockets from forming inside the bag, in some cases I'll use a section of peg board cut to size under the screen to help even out the pressure over any voids in the substrate.
The big drawback to a bag system is the possible loss of pressure caused by a leak in the line, bag seal or power failure. I use a 3/4 hp vac. pump which is large enough to handle all the bags at once as well as normal leaks, not that I have many. To keep an eye on everything A friend of mine came up with an electric switch and big dial gauge that I can see from almost anywhere in the shop.
When I build another set I'll post a more detailed photo thread on the subject.
Photos of vac switch and gauge
Photo of vac manifold for 3 bags, has auto timer with manual override.
So wait a second. You put the glued materials in a bag, then use a vacumn to suck the air out of the bag, which causes it to apply pressure to the materials? As a way of clamping?
That seems simple enough. Danged good idea.
What type of glue you use for veneering? How do you apply it?
(nice looking shop)
Jim,
You got it, the concept is that simple. Like anything else it does have a learning curve, for one, while they claim the glue will not stick to the inside of the bag, I found out from day one that everything sticks to the bag, lumps of hardened glue will indent the wood you are working on and worse yet accelerate the possibility of a pin hole leak. I have solved the problem by wrapping the edges of the project with stretch wrap or in the case of a stringer a layer of 2 mil plastic, again the issue of trapped air needs to be addressed. The thing to note is pressure is greater than first expected. On one of my early projects I made a huge bar top that wouldn't fit in the bag so I made two sections some what on the order of a 6 inch lap joint at the seam. Well the one half was not supported all the way to the end and the pressure bent the 5/8 thick substrate down 1/8, in the middle. Needless to say there was no quick fix.
I use Unibond 800, a powder catalyzed resin glue for laminations. Titebond is not a good choice because it injects too much water into the veneer and substrate. Imagine the water injected into a stack of 6 laminates, trapped water that just has to come out weeks or months later with maybe not so good consequences . It also does not cold creep with stressed joints avoiding that tiny glue bump at the joint over time. Unibond has the added advantage of longer open time and drying hard and rigid, sands off without gumming. Downside, it must be mixed, slower finial set time and is temp. sensitive min. 65 degrees required.
Edited 3/7/2003 9:19:52 AM ET by Armin a.k.a. The Laminator
Armin,
What's your investment in bags?
Jon Blakemore
Bags are a big ticket item, I sprung for the long life 30 mil poly bags, the custom stringer bag was about $400 the smaller tread sized bags $120 each. I'm guessing total about $1500 for 8 bags. Some suppliers have cutoffs or end runs and will sell at a bargin price. I bought two trim bags 10" x 12 ft. long for $60 bucks.
Word of caution, I found that the bag doesn't work all that good for large curved stringers. Picture trying to manhandle 10 plys 12" x17ft. besides the weight you have to twist everything around the form, then when it's dry take it off the form and corkscrew the bag off the 200 lb. stringer. First time I tried it my helper slipped and the springback just about launched me out the door. Second time I tried it I got four guys, went much better but still had the hassel of getting the bag off the form, still for most work it can't be beat.
Thanks guys, The wood is a real bear to work with since the bark also captures sand and other not so good stuff that eats cutters like nothing I have ever used, even carbide takes a beating.
As for labor time, this was a rush job where I really stuck my neck out, I promised to have it installed before 20 guests arrive Christmas eve. I finished one day early, took ten days and 122 hrs. Plus one day demo and installation.
Jim, I'll answer you question on the vacuum bags later tonight after I get a chance to dig up a few photos.
That puts a whole new meaning to "it's in thebag!"
How'd you do the tops of the balusters?
Very nice, simple, yet elegant... EliphIno!
How'd you do the tops of the balusters?
With a jig on the shaper, next time around I'll do a picture posting.
Does the bag have to be perfectly smooth over the suface it is clamping? If there's a fold in the bag, will you have an unclamped spot in your veneers?
Do you roll the glue on? Brush it? Spray it? Do you put it on one surface or two?
Jim,
Wrinkles or folds in the bag are not a problem, when laminating an arch the outside of the radius will be smooth and tight, depending on the radius the inside of the curve could bunch up. You will only have an unclamped spot if there is a large air bubble trapped between the bag and the veneer. That's why a screen or platen with weep holes and grooves is important. Fortunately the bag is clear so you can see what is going on inside. I usually decompress the bag about 10%, turn off the pump and check everything, if I have a problem I can open it up and fix it without the risk of squeezing the glue out of the joint prematurely.
Glue gets rolled on, both surfaces. It takes a little practice to get the coverage right, to much and you have a big mess.
Sweet!
Man, whole lotta wood in that house, huh?