Ok, anyone willing to help out here, thanks in advance.
This is probably a rudimentary question, or like one of those “can’t you just figure it out”ones, but here goes.
I hung a susp ceiling and now I need to put in the ceiling fan. Ok, so….how do you do it? I assume I am to use a normal ceiling fan junction box up in the exposed joist bay above the ceiling panels, which, if it matters at all, the distance between bottom of joists and ceiling panels is 12″. So how do I get the fan unit below the ceiling panel? The rod I guess is to go thru the panel, but how do you make an attractive hole? Is there a special grommet I can use to clean up the hole and make it look clean? And, how do you install the panel? I mean, if I thread the hanging rod thru the panel hole then I can’t tilt the panel up into the grid to lay it in because the rod, being rigid doesn’t have that flexibility.
Replies
Get yourself a fan kit for drop ceilings. Not sure if the big box hardwares will have it, maybe, but any good electrical supply house should.
The ones I normally use, others are similar in principle, have a cable that takes the weight of the box and fan. Also there are a couple of bars and clips that stabilize the box by attaching to the ceiling grid.
I goes something like this: Identify the location you want the fan to be. There is some flexibility as to where in a tile the box goes but you have to stay some distance away from the grid. Usually a couple of inches at least to allow for how the hardware connects to the box.
I usually try to center the box in 2' square tiles and similarly in one side of a 2' by 4' tile. Seems to look better. Check this location above the drop ceiling for structure capable of taking the load. Don't use any other utility or service for support. Ducts, pipes and electrical conduits should not be used. In a commercial setting bar joists are ideal. Ceiling joists are also good but there you will need some lag screws with eye heads. Might come with the kit. Might need to buy some, or better ones, at the hardware store.
Keep in mind how the cables will run. If you can run the cable straight and plumb up that's OK. Trick is to make sure the box hangs in the hole without any side support needed. I usually try to run the cable in two directions giving a 30 to 45 degree angle from plumb as this gives it a little more stability. At least in one direction. Most manufacturers seem OK with this. Be sure to check the instructions included with the kit to be sure.
Next assemble the box and stabilizing struts. Most units have a 2' leg and a shorter leg and three clips designed to grip the grid. The 2' strut should span two of the structural grid runs. These are the long, stiff members. The structural rails are the ones with wires supporting them. Don't depend on the lighter bars, typically only 2' long, that hang off the structural members.
Keep the tile where you plan to mount the fan in place and remove one next to it. Take your assembly and lay it on top of the tile. Check to make sure the cables will run without interference and the planned location can be accommodated by the hardware. This is a 'dry-fit'.
With experience this check can be more perfunctory. Once your satisfied take the tile you want the fan in and scribe the outline of the box. Note: If your scribing the face side of the tile the box has to be inverted, open side up as you draw. Also, while you were dry fitting, you should have noted the orientation of the octagon box. A reasonably tight fit helps sometimes.
Put the tile back in place. Take the box and struts and install them onto the grid. Well done the box should be firmly supported and the box should be dead flush with the face of the tile. Next rig your cable/s. Some kits come with 'U' bolts to fasten the cables. If so I usually get a few extras at a hardware so the connections each get two. The cables take the load so be sure of what you do. The struts are just there to keep the box from wobbling or spinning.
Trick is to rig the clamps up a bit wider than what two cables will fit through. These I slide onto the cables so that up on the ladder I just position one at a time and tighten it a bit with a nutdriver. This makes it so you don't have to fiddle with so many small parts on a ladder. A little preplanning helps. Draw a picture.
More recently there are clamping devices where you just shove the cable into a fitting and it keeps the cable from backing out. Very handy. Look for kits with these or buy these clamping devices at the hardware.
With the clamps a bit loose fiddle with the cables and clamps until the box is suspended centered within the hole in the tile without any side pressure being taken by the struts or tile. Use the fan mounting screws and have a helper hang some weight, about the weight of the fan, from the box. Lacking a helper I have been known to use a few bricks hung on a length of wire.
With weight applied tweak the cables to get the face of the box flush with the tile while the tile is seated in the grid. Once your satisfied tighten the clamps up firmly. A lot of installations look bad because they are adjusted without accounting for the weight of the fan. Usually this makes the fan hang low with a gap between its escuteon and the tile. Often enough to make the box visible. Alternately they get it too tight and the tile is held up by the fan. Either way looks sloppy, unworkmanlike.
With the box in place run your electrical feed. I like MC cable, 12/2 for just a fan and 12/3 for fan and light, for this. Run to a box where the normal house wiring feeds it.
Hang the fan in the normal manner. Balance the fan blades. Balancing is more important with drop ceiling installations. Those struts help but are less stable than a drywall or plaster ceiling.
Holy cow, 4Lorn, that was quite detailed, and for me not having ever done a fan in a susp ceiling before, much appreciated. All I can say is "thanks." I appreciate your going the extra mile to ensure if I have a question later you've already addressed it. So a big THANK YOU!!!!
Before the kits, the very few times this issue came up, it was like reinventing the wheel. A string of one-off installations involving whatever materials you had on hand like pieces of 2by4, assorted screws or lengths of Unistrut and all-thread. Nothing specifically designed to do the job. Did one with three 16' runs of 3/8" all-thread arranged as an inverter tripod, with unistrut intermediate braces, going up to three 3/8" redheads drilled into the concrete floor above. All that to support a 4" octagon box and a 30# fan. You could have used that box to support a chain fall for lifting engines. It was strong. Worked well and very stable. Boss approved. A single installation could take a full day in tougher conditions. First time I saw the kits I had a boss send me out on a commercial job to hang something like two dozen fans in a drop ceiling. He said the guy at the supply house said they were great. Would save all kinds of trouble.At that time I had no prior experience with these kits. I get there with a helper, a truck and a few ladders. I wished someone would clue me in. Instructions were vague at best. We learned after a few pretty shoddy tries. Quality improved and we went back and tweaked the first installations. By the end of the job we were pretty quick and the fans looked good.The kits did save time and trouble. They have improved since that time. Don't be surprised if you get one with chains. Same principles apply. Most newer ones have cables. Instructions are now generally decent but not inspired. If this makes your experience, or anyone after, a bit easier I feel like I have done well. Who knows I might get senile, as if I'm not already, and need to come back and read my own instructions. Stranger things have happened.Take care and be safe.
If you don't like messing with cables try this....
Attach a 2x6 "hanger leg" to the inside of your existing joist nearest your desired fan location. Attach another 2x6 to the adjacent joist. The "hangers" should extend down far enough to just about touch the top of the ceiling grid panel. Now cut a 2X6 cross member that spans the distance between the 2 hanger legs and affix this cross member to the hangers. What you have is a "U" shaped framing support that should be securely attached to the above joists and which the bottom crossmember should be just slightly shy of touching the actual ceiling panel. Attach your junction box to the bottom crossmember.
Cut a hole in the ceiling panel...hole to match size of junction box. The box, once mounted to the crossmember should fit inside this opening and be either flush with the panel or just shy (1/8 inch) of flush.
Cut a piece of 1/4 inch or even 1/2 inch thick plywood and attach this to one or both sides of the hanging framework so to keep the framework stiff and free from racking due to fan movement when turned on.
Attach your ceiling fan to this junction box /wood hanger framework and be done.
Davo