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Clogged vent problem

| Posted in General Discussion on January 6, 2004 04:08am

Hello,

Our plumbing vent is plugged with some kind of muck.  Our toilet and drains work, but the washer (in basement) tends to suck the water from the traps and toilet when draining.  

My father suggested that I try flushing it with the hose, so I went up on the roof, turned the hose on. . .result was a geiser from the roof and a steady stream into the basement!  Next, the neighbor suggested I use a piece of pipe and try to ram it through the clog.  The pipe got stuck and I spent 3 hours getting it out.  However according the muck on the pipe, the clog is at least 18″ thick. 

I called our plumber.  He came out and said that considering that the vent pipe is cast iron and apparently original to the house (1930), the “muck” is probably cast iron scale and that it has been clogged for years.  When I called initially, the appointment was for them to auger out the vent.  When I asked about it when he arrived, he said the auger would have to go up to the roof (no cleanout in the basement), and it was heavy.  His solution was to install two boca valves and said that if that didn’t work, the entire vent stack would have to be replaced for about $800-$1000.

The boca valves may have helped some, but not much.  Is replacing the entire stack the only option, or do I simply need to call a plumber with stronger arms or a lighter auger?  Or is there some other option all together?

Jason

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  1. User avater
    JeffBuck | Jan 06, 2004 05:01pm | #1

    I'd find a plumber with video to scope it out and make sure that's what the problem is ....

    cast iron at that age can clog ...

    but lotsa cast has lasted way longer .....

    Jeff

    Buck Construction   Pittsburgh,PA

         Artistry in Carpentry                

  2. ClaysWorld | Jan 06, 2004 06:04pm | #2

    For less than a compleate replacement you can tap in  the basement or? and put some cleanouts in. Then snake that line good and your good to go for another 80 years.

     Maintenence it's what keeps the world  working.

  3. sungod | Jan 06, 2004 06:26pm | #3

    Based on your first sentence the vent is not clogged.  Maybe its the drains and vent were not done correctly in the beginning.

    Open up the wall behind the toilet and see if you can find its vent.  If you find it, another vent can be tapped into it and rerouted somewhere else.

    Also when you filled the stack with water, just where did the water come out in the basement?

    1. JasonGauthie | Jan 06, 2004 06:57pm | #4

      Maybe plumbing methods were different in 1930 or maybe you are correct in that the plumbing was done incorrectly from the start. . .Our home has one bathroom and the plumbing to one kitchen sink.  There is no direct vent to the toilet.  There is one "L" shaped line that drains the sink and toilet and a second straight line that drains the kitchen sink.  These merge and drain into the sewer line.   The vent comes off the line that drains the kitchen sink.  Keep in mind, I am only taking about maybe 15' of pipe all together before connecting to the sewer line so I don't know if that short amount of pipe made this arrangement preferable.

      The vent is definately clogged with something.  From my measuring, the clog probably starts at the elbow in the basement (45 degree elbows which directs the vent to the line that the sink drains to) and consists of about 18" of brown "something."  My original thoughts were that since the home was purchased as a forclosure, the previous owner filled the vent with mud from the roof (possible given what we know about him) or there was a sewage back-up that filled the vent.  The house was vacant for 18 months, if that makes a difference.  If I understood him correctly, the plumber who came out thought that may have prevented the natural clearing of the vent that results from using the sinks/toilet (cast iron scale would be cleared from use as opposed to accumulating at the elbow from non-use). 

      When I tried clearing the pipe with the hose, the pipe filled up and overflowed.  The leaking came at a joint at the top elbow.  The pipe eventually drained, but I don't know if it drained from leaking out at the elbow or actually made it passed the clog.

      Thanks for any advice,

      Jason

      1. MojoMan | Jan 06, 2004 07:34pm | #5

        I'm trying to understand the set-up here...There is only one vent in the entire system, and to runs up from the kitchen sink? What is the diameter of that vent? Is the clog above the sink? Sounds like a vent for the washer drain might help the symptoms but not fix the entire system.

        Al Mollitor, Sharon MA

        1. JasonGauthie | Jan 06, 2004 07:46pm | #7

          The vent pipe is 4" cast iron pipe.  The clog starts right about at the basement ceiling. . .below the sink.  The sink drains into the pipe to the left and below the elbow that leads to the vent. 

          The plumber who came out did place two boca valves in the basement.  One on the bathroom drain side, the other on the kitchen drain side.  The washer drains into a utility sink in the basement (forgot to mention that) that also drains to the sewer pipe. . .about 4 feet below where the bath/kitchen drains merge. - Jason

      2. MojoMan | Jan 06, 2004 07:42pm | #6

        Three more thoughts: (1) A vent should have no horizontal runs below the flood level of any fixture. It's puzzling to me how the vent could get so clogged. That's a lot of cast iron! (2) That leak, wherever it is, should be repaired. (3) How about buying a good manual snake and cleaning it from the roof yourself. Your hose and pipe may just make things worse, but a snake can auger through the muck.

        Al

      3. sungod | Jan 06, 2004 11:36pm | #9

        Cut a hole in the wall a foot above the clog elbow.  Get a chisel and hammer and tap/knotch all the way around the cast iron pipe and break it out (hopefully the whole pipe does not drop to the basement.  Use no-hub adapters and install ABS or PVC 4" vent pipe replacement

        1. JasonGauthie | Jan 06, 2004 11:43pm | #10

          My father is coming down this weekend, I was thinking of enlisting him to help out if I rent an auger.  If I cause some real damage, its always nice to have someone around with a high credit limit on their credit card and someone else to blame when neighbors ask what happened!

          Replacing the clogged section of the vent pipe or the hole thing seems like it could be kind of easy - BUT - there is a 250 gal oil tank in front of it in the basement and the clog seems to be in the part of the pipe that is behind the kitchen sink. 

          Jason

          1. sungod | Jan 07, 2004 12:00am | #11

            Take out the 2 Boca Valves and install a 2" pipe run it directly out to the exterior wall and up past the roof if its not too ugly.  This would work if you try this first--flush and/or run water in the fixtures with the boca valves removed and see if it all works OK.

          2. davidmeiland | Jan 07, 2004 03:09am | #13

            Last time I had a major drain problem I called in a company that brought (a) a flexible fiber optic camera that they shoved way, way down the drain (b) a whole bunch of drain cleaning equipment, and (c) a trenchless sewer replacement rig. Loaded for bear, so to speak. Plumbers don't like to deal with clogs. Call in a drain company that can clear the leak and then scope the line to see if the pipe is shot. If it is, then call a plumber.

            Drains can run well on very little venting, in my experience. Our current house (circa 1920) had no vents when we moved in and now has one 1-1/2" vent that's temporary. The bathroom drains about 15 feet before it gets to the main line. The kitchen comes in at the same point, and about 20 feet up the kitchen line is the only vent. Heinous by UPC standards, but it flows fine and I ain't fixin' any of it until I gut-remodel the whole house.

        2. ClaysWorld | Jan 07, 2004 03:03am | #12

          If you need to get through the cast iron use the sawzall with a long metal blade 8"for cutting heavy metal on low speed cuts just fine. I think the millwake blade # is like 1182 or somthing close maybe 1183 or 84?

  4. ClaysWorld | Jan 06, 2004 11:23pm | #8

    If you have the umph to do it before starting to tear the house apart check to see if you can rent a good 5/8s or 3/4" snake with 125-150' length. It takes two to do it one on the roof and one  running the unit on the ground. Start off with a very small auger and go to larger once you penetrate the block. Also take a little time to lay out the vent and drains on paper so you can see them.  You measure the snake and you can mark it with duct tape so you can tell where the snake is. add up the vertical up and down ect. to determine how far you have to go. It's not impossible but you will have to work at it to get it cleared. Plus be very careful on the roof, and if need be rope off for safety. No luck all skill and sweat.

     Clay

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