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Who says what? I may be in the market soon……jave used the big Makita….which was very nice……but usually end up going with DeWalt for one reason or another….and this was before DeWalt came out with theirs. So……how do they stack up? Any other contenders? Jeff
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Jeff- I'm getting disillusioned with the yellow tools personally. Good value for the money, but you only get what you pay for. Have a Dewalt 12" CMS (single bevel) and can't really complain, altho I'm not ecstatic, either. But for $300 you can't beat it........If I were to be upgrading to a 12" SCMS, then my first serious look would be the blue stream. Good old Makita is still here, made in USA, still making good stuff, and appears to still be embracing innovation. I do recall a number of comments in past threads praising the Mak saws above all. Try a search. -Ken
*I year or so ago I picked up the 8 1/2" Hitatchi SCMS for about 450 buck. I love this thing to death! It cuts everything I've ever needed to cut both at work (residential framing) and at home in the woodworking shop. Blades are reasonable. It's heavy enough to be stable but not like the awkward 12" yellow and black pig I used to have that was so heavy it never left the truck. This saw is fantastic. If you think the 8 1/2 may be a little too small for you check out the 10 inch by Hitatchi...that's a beauty too and is on sale right now at Woodworkers Warehouse for about 500 bucks. Other than framing guns this is the only green tool I own...I'm not a big green fan in general, but these are great saws for the money
*Jeff,I got a spare bed and food and stuff to quench your thirst in the fridge if you want to zip on down and run a few feet of trim through my LS 1013.When I first got it, everyone was saying that the factory blade was the cat's meow. But my saw was constantly binding on the wider pieces. Took it in to the shop. Turned out the new blade was bad. Oh well. Works good now.Also got a $150 beater that I carry around in my truck all the time. Single tilt. Put on a good blade and it does very good work. Many jobs don't require the capacity of the larger machines so if the beater cuts consistantly square and the alternating miter cuts line up, I'm happy. Plus I can carry it in one hand.
*The Makita mitre saws are made in the US ? What else ? They make 7.25" and 8.25" inch circular saws, 3/8" drills, and the 7" and 9" sander-grinders just east of Toronto. I wonder how much is actually built in Japan ?
*Jeff:I have had the DeWALT 708 for several years and love it. The blade swings 60 degrees to the right, 50 to the left, and tilts 48 both ways. There also is a depth stop on it for cutting rabbets etc. I use it all the time and it remanins very accurate.
*Jeff, it really depends on what you need to do. If it's just trim work, then the slider is probably overkill. A simple well thought out Single CMS will probably do the Job. Check out the Bosch 3912, you can find them on Ebay for around 285.00 (top price) delivered. However, if you really anticipate a need to cut complex miters on wide material then the DeWalt seems to be the way to go. They are widely available in both new and reconditioned and offer the most bang for the buck. Steve
*Makita LS1013
*Stan nailed the big advantage for the Dewalt, it turns more degrees. The Makita has a depth stop as well, and I think it is the better quality saw. If you only buy one, and there is a big enough price diff, you may be well off to start with the Dewalt.Now I know there was something about the Hitachi I didn't like, besides the fence, but handle each side by side and you'll see. They are both nice saws, but I prefer the Makita.
*I have the Hitachi 8 1/2. What a saw! I love its small size, and its ACCURATE. If I needed a 10", I'd probabaly go Hitachi, with Makita a close second. The only bad thing about Hitachi's are the wimpy detents and the scale that's hard to read. But I've found that I usually don't pay much attention to the detents, and just align the pointer with the degree I want. In fact, the detents are so wimpy that its easy to bump the table cut something at 90.5 degrees, or 44.5 degrees, which is a huge advantage.Also, the 8 1/2" bevels only one way.This is just theory, but notice that the Makita's rails are fully extended when all you need to do is make a small cut. Any saw is least accurate when its rails are fully extended.
*I aready have the DeWalt....what is it....705?....that I've had for years. Still cutting like a champ. I'm looking for something deeper......mantle shelves....book cases.....stuff like that. I'd also get alot of use as with cutting dados...so a well thought out depth stop is at the top of the list. Don't remember the model number I used off hand.....LS 1012...LS1013...which ever is the biggest one....had a single rail...and I think a coil cover over the rail of some sort. That saw was really nice. The weight really isn't a limiting factor....as it would ride in the van with the DeWalt doing the daily work.....and only coming out on special occasions! Thanks, Jeff
*Ls 1211 I have one and love it. Super easy to work and smooth.
*Jeff, I think the saw you want is the LS1211. 12" blade, single rail with a boot over it like motocross forks have. I used one several years ago and thought is was a really good saw, but too big for me.
*my pet peeve about the new jlconline web site...can't access the article that turned me on to this mag. was a great review of the CMSs out there. the hitachi's smaller SCMS had the best overall capability, surprising performance exceeding capabilities of the 10" CMSs. never owned any of these, but have followed auctions at ebay with serious interest. reconditioned models available.has anyone ever tried the harbor freight 10" SCMS equivalent? you know... the ones selling for $125. seems appropriate for framing...i keep seeing steelworkers and plumbers using their chop saw.brian
*you can make accurate dados on a scms? i did not know. is it easy?
*The edges of the dado will be as accurate as the blade and fence setup. But the depth is minutely variable because each time you bring the head across the work you tend to apply a slightly different amount of downward pressure against the screw stop. You DON"T use a dado blade in these saws.I have used this feature to recreate the tongue on the end of floor boards rather than changing the setting on my router which is used to plow the groove in the mating end. Also good for kerfing the back of a piece you want to bend.
*We have both the 8.5" and 10" Hitachi slider at work. The 8.5" is nice. Dont really like the 10". This is what I see wrong with it:1. Cuts not being accurate when doing a bevel and or angle ( seems that the rails have play). 2. The saw dust seems to be expelled right onto the rails. Then have to clean out the rail " bearings".3. Its hard to read the bevel angle.Dont know if some of these problems are due to abuse or if the 10" was like that out of the box. Wish the 8.5" was dual bevel. Guy I work with has the Dewalt 12" slider, seems really nice, but I havent used it enough yet.My 2 cents in a 5 cent message.m2akita
*I have the same problem when I try to dado with my Hitachi. It takes a certain touch. When fully extended, it'll take a deeper cut than when taking a cut up by the fence, so it's all about touch. I wonder if the 10" Makitas would be better for this because of how the rail system is designed.
*I have the Makita Ls1212. It's the most accurate miter saw I have ever used. The main draw back is it doesn't have crown stops like the Hitachi. I only had on problem with it so far. The switch went out & Makita replaced it. When they shipped it back to me after the repair, Ups did over $500 worth of damage to it. They broke the base & bent several other things. They wouldn't replace it so Makita fixed all the broke stuff & it still cuts very good. I had an Hitachi at one time but I had several problems with it so I sent it back. The Hitachi people are a pain in the @ss to deal with! I don't think I would ever buy another one of their tools.
*Yeah. That was news to me too, Phill. I had no idea "good old Makita" was made in the US.
*DW 708. Excellent.It has another big advantage over every other saw: you can look through the blade guard, and line up your cuts. And don't start telling me that works with the clear plastic because it doesn't. Not good enough.
*plastic shmastic. I lower the blade right to the material to line up the cut. no paralax error that way.I have the makita LS1013 and love it. only had one boo boo with it and that was when I didn't flip up the sub fence that has the little sign telling you to flip it up when you do a left bevel. ran the blade right through it. that was a costly mistake. 80 bucks for a new blade and 18 for a new sub fence. on the good side makita had the new ones at my house the very next day without any extra shipping charges.
*Mad Dog and Phill- Sorry I wasn't able to qualify my statement about Makita. Yes, ALL their stuff was originally made in Japan as far as I know. But now, upon further investigation I see Makita is made in: Japan, USA, Canada, 'assembled in Mexico'. Maybe elsewhere, too. As far as the miter saws, I would not know without looking at the label on the tool. Perhaps someone can answer this for us. Think I'll start a thread on this as I think it's kinda interesting.........Mad Dog- Agree 100% on the see-through Dewalt blade guard- don't have to raise guard to line up like all others I've used. Grade A+ for design of safety AND functionality. -Ken
*LS1013 and 2703(table saw) are both made is the USA according to the labels on mine.
*Makita has a big plant in Buford, Gahttp://www.makita.com/CompanyProfile_Item_View.aspI believe Hitachi has an assembly plant in the U.S. too. Hard to figure, Dewalt and Delta go overseas and Makita and Hitachi come here.
*I have the 10" Hitachi. It works well for me but does require a lot of "touch". But then trim carpentry is more art than science, right. Bevel gauge sucks, mitre angle gauge is a couple of degrees off (any suggestions on realigning the table?) Also I I look forward to breaking it down and cleaning the dust out of its vitals. What's this I hear about rail bearings? Any schematics? I'd look into a Makita. Any problems with the 12" blades wobbling through a cut compared with 10"? Aren't two rails better than one?
*I'll be darned. Good info ken.I wonder if the Japanese people are as upset about their companies products being made over here as we are about ours being built elsewhere...
*Mad Dog- Yeah, interesting once you start looking. Seems that tools like many other things are becoming more 'global' in their manufacture and sourcing. Noticed that my Dewalt jig saw is made in Italy. Still gonna start a thread on this but lets wait until the site switch-over on the 20th. -Ken