Replies

1. 
   basswood | Apr 26, 2006 05:30am | #1

   I remodeled a house in Fort Collins, CO that had several large diameter copper vent pipes. Imagine sweating those joints. The drain pipes were cast iron though.

   I made some money at the salvage shop when I turned that stuff in.

1. 
   rooferman | Apr 26, 2006 05:34am | #2

   I have seen that before.  I just worked in a house that had copper waste/vent pipe throughout.  It was a circa 1960 home.  Well built but not extravigant by any means.  Look at it this way ......................better to be copper than cast with the bell attached.  Those make it pretty hard to get the flashing boot on!!!!

1. 
   Heck | Apr 26, 2006 05:39am | #4

   Amazing.

   I would put this house at about 40 - 50 years old.

   What would a house full of copper waste cost today, I wonder?

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

2. 
   Heck | Apr 26, 2006 05:36am | #3

   Sounds like a Colorado thing.I was thinking about what they were worth myself, started driving around looking at roof vents and wishing I had a stealth ladder and a cordless recip saw!

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

3. 
   Stuart | Apr 26, 2006 05:59am | #8

   I lived in a duplex after I got out of college that had a bunch of copper waste/vent lines; they were part of an addition put on in the early 1970s, I think.  The rest of the building used cast iron.  It's the only one I've ever seen.

2. 
   seeyou | Apr 26, 2006 05:40am | #5

   I worked on a restoration about 20 years ago and all the drains (new work) were copper. I've seen it several times since.

   Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, I get waylaid by jackassery?

   http://grantlogan.net/

1. 
   Heck | Apr 26, 2006 05:45am | #6

   Well, I thought it was funny that I had never seen it before, with 30 yrs in the trades.

   Interesting how many things are out there that you never run into.

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

3. 
   philarenewal | Apr 26, 2006 05:53am | #7

   Must be a regional thing.

   House I grew up in (North Jersey) had copper vent pipes and CI drains.

   Where I am now (Philly) it's all CI and new work is PVC.  Imagine some fancy houses still get CI drains for quiet.

   Don't know what was going on in Jersey whan that house was built, but here in Philly all plumbing is driven by the trades.  If our plumber's union wants the drains made out of unobtanium with a tutti fruity taffy coating, that will be in the next code revision.

    

   "Let's get crack-a-lackin"  --- Adam Carolla

4. 
   hoosier | Apr 26, 2006 06:16am | #9

   My house was built in '59-'60 and the entire waste system was plumbed in copper.  The vent stack is still in good shape, but about 4 years ago (shortly after buying the house) I interestingly had to replace a few feet of pipe with PVC from the toilet flange downward.  The pipe had become very thin from the inside out and was at the point of collapsing. I was surprised the copper had deteriorated so badly in certain spots.

1. 
   seb | Apr 27, 2006 03:00am | #22

   I'm in denver, '55 vintage..all pressure water is copper, except for the nipples to the toilets etc (no shutoff valves) are(were) galvanized. Drains were, for smaller diameter, galvanized, and large dia, cast iron...All of the galvanized is rusting out and making for a lot of pita replacement,
   One of my cronies has early 60's with all drains copper..
   I think it musta been the transition between galv and copper era, and they used whatever they had or were comfprtable with...Bud

5. 
   plumbbill | Apr 26, 2006 06:30am | #10

   Mid 60's to early 70's copper was cheaper than steel.

   Actually quite common & plenty of copper drain pipes too back then.

   Copper is great stuff but by far is the loudest pipe one could put in a house.

   Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW

6. 
   rjw | Apr 26, 2006 06:32am | #11

   There was a period in the 60's when the price of copper was apparently low enough to justify its use.

   I see it once or twice a month, even including waste lines in basements and crawls.

   Compared to leading the old caste iron joints, I expect sweating the copper joints was a breeze!

   ---

   Fighting Ignorance since 1967

   It's taking way longer than we thought

1. 
   HammerHarry | Apr 28, 2006 03:07am | #44

   "There was a period in the 60's when the price of copper was apparently low enough to justify its use."

   I think you're right; early - mid 60s, not late 60s/70s as someone else said.  Early 70s was when aluminum wiring became popular, because copper was too expensive.  Something about Vietnam, and shell casings, I understand.

7. 
   bps | Apr 26, 2006 06:35am | #12

   I live near Denver in a house built in 51. All of the dwv is done in copper. As to sweating it... not too hard just gotta be patient a nd pre heat with 2 torchs. Once its warm it sweats like a dream.Tim

8. 
   Bentstick | Apr 26, 2006 07:37am | #13

   There was a point in the mid to late 60's where copper prices were quite low.

   I have seen the same thing around here in houses of that vintage where it's all copper.

   If it wasn’t for the Bank Payments,

   Interest, Taxes, Wages, and Fuel Costs,

   I wouldn’t have to charge you!!

9. 
   IMERC | Apr 26, 2006 08:15am | #14

   a lot of the places around here have the waste plumbed in copper.. 

   Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming

   WOW!!! What a Ride!

   Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

10. 
    gb93433 | Apr 26, 2006 08:47am | #15

    My grandparents owned a home that was originally built in the early 1900s with copper DWV pipes. Water supply was added later when they had a well using an electric pump and the hand pump was removed.

11. 
    Hackinatit | Apr 26, 2006 11:58am | #16

    Grew up in a neighborhood of modest 3br/1ba ranches... 40 yo Green CU stacks standing proudly over complete copper waste systems in every one. Even the toilet flanges are copper.

    Built for the middle class to last.

    Troy Sprout

    Square, Level & Plumb Renovations

12. 
    Taylor | Apr 26, 2006 04:15pm | #17

    Cooper roof flashings.

    You can buy the stuff online at copperlab.com.

    I've also seen a copper sleeve you can put over a PVC vent stack. Look at it this way: PVC looks like sh*t (pardon my French) and is not supposed to be exposed to sunlight.

1. 
   gb93433 | Apr 27, 2006 12:21am | #20

   Paint them to look different

1. 
   Snort | Apr 27, 2006 12:34am | #21

   Like Snowman, some builders here use it just through the roof. Looks much nicer than pvc painted green<G> I need a dump truck, baby, to unload my head

2. 
   sungod | Apr 27, 2006 08:13pm | #37

   Here in Southern California, there was many homes that had copper waste, drain and vent installed. The copper was installed by local famous plumbing repair company who had big TV ads and Yellow Page ads. These copper jobs would cost $10,000 20 years ago. Seen a little old lady pay them $800 for a new toilet, she told me that the old one kept running all the time.

13. 
    Shacko | Apr 26, 2006 06:38pm | #18

    Common practice years ago, total cost wise it was cheaper than galv. FYI it is still used on certain commercial situations. More info. at one time stainless steel tube was used.

1. 
   plumbbill | Apr 27, 2006 03:16am | #23

   Stainless is making a comeback on some gov jobs.

   I don't like it, way too expensive & the cutting process puts a lip on the inside if you ream it out the pipe won't go into the fittings, overall I think a flawed design.Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW

1. 
   Shacko | Apr 27, 2006 07:45pm | #36

   Stainless steel tube was a flawed design in the 60's, thats why it didn't last that long. If the goverment is using it, it may be different than what I'm used to. The goverment dosen't care, they have spec. books that go back to the 40's.

1. 
   plumbbill | Apr 28, 2006 02:00pm | #49

   New spec----- new style

   thin wall , stamped seamed fittings with an O ring. Kinda like glass acid waste pipe if you have ever seen that stuff.Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW

2. 
   BillBrennen | Apr 27, 2006 11:40pm | #39

   Bill,Is the stainless making a comeback as supply or waste piping? Is it sweated together? More $$$ than equivalent copper? Thanks.Bill

1. 
   DanH | Apr 28, 2006 12:06am | #40

   Actually, the way to go is Pyrex.
   If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison

2. 
   plumbbill | Apr 28, 2006 02:09pm | #50

   It was being used at Sea-Tac airport on their central terminal expansion in 2002.

   Thin wall waste pipe.

   Expensive fairly new stuff & was hard to find people who had the stuff in stock.

   Right now with copper being an all time high, I'm looking into 6" sch 10 stainless for the water mains on a 1.5 million square foot two tower job they just broke ground on.

   I have run smaller ss tubing for pure systems for Amgen & Immunex we use swedgelock¯ to join that stuff ( fancy compression joint)

   1.5" & up we use victaulic¯ grooved couplings.Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW

1. 
   BillBrennen | Apr 30, 2006 05:24am | #51

   Thanks for the info. I assume that the groove for the Victaulic¯ couplings is formed by rolling the Sch 10 pipe? Sounds too thin to cut a groove.Bill

2. 
   plumbbill | Apr 30, 2006 06:11am | #52

   Yup roll groove, that's how we join copper 2.5" & up these days too.Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW

14. 
    Snowmon | Apr 26, 2006 08:29pm | #19

    I have switched to copper for just the through-roof part for appearance.

    PVC is not really supposed to be exposed to sunlight anyways(though it is done all the time).

    Some folks switch to ABS, which is supposed to have more UV resistance.

    I have heard that code requires non-PVC for exposed portion in some areas.

    -The poster formerly known as csnow

    
    

    ---

    Edited 4/26/2006 1:30 pm ET by Snowmon

1. 
   caseyr | Apr 27, 2006 03:23am | #25

   "I have switched to copper for just the through-roof part for appearance."How would you go about transitioning to the copper for a short distance?

1. 
   DanH | Apr 27, 2006 03:28am | #26

   Duct tape.
   If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison

2. 
   Snowmon | Apr 27, 2006 03:51am | #27

   "How would you go about transitioning to the copper for a short distance?"

   Rubber coupling works.  I suppose you could switch to threads if you wanted to get fancy.-The poster formerly known as csnow

1. 
   Heck | Apr 27, 2006 04:29am | #28

   Again, I find it interesting how a person can be involved in a trade for so long and be unaware of certain techniques.

   I started my career in the early '70's, copper was used for water supply. Waste was mostly plastic, some galvanized.

   I now see mostly poly for supply, still pvc for waste.

   I have done a ton of remodels and renovations, but mostly on older structures than we are discussing. These had galvy for waste, with galvy for supply, too.

   I have spent most of my time in NM and AZ, having recently relocated to CO.

   I had never seen nor heard of anyone anytime using copper like this in a residentail setting.

   I agree that it looks much better than plastic on the roof. Now if we could figure out how to get rid of the vent pipes altogether!

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

1. 
   Snort | Apr 27, 2006 02:51pm | #32

   I agree that it looks much better than plastic on the roof. Now if we could figure out how to get rid of the vent pipes altogether!studor vents<G> I need a dump truck, baby, to unload my head

3. 
   rjw | Apr 28, 2006 02:25am | #42

   Saw this in a crawl of a 1964 home today....

   Fighting Ignorance since 1967

   It's taking way longer than we thought

1. 
   seeyou | Apr 28, 2006 02:51am | #43

   Are those brass elbows?Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, I get waylaid by jackassery?

   http://grantlogan.net/

1. 
   rjw | Apr 28, 2006 03:53am | #45

   >>Are those brass elbows?Dunno, bronze, maybe?

   Fighting Ignorance since 1967

   It's taking way longer than we thought

15. 
    DanH | Apr 27, 2006 03:19am | #24

    When my parents "remodeled" (gutted and rebuilt) a farmhouse ca 1965 they had most of the waste done in copper. Plastic wasn't quite an option back then, and copper was a heck of a lot easier to deal with than cast or galv. This was in rural Jeffersontown, KY.

    If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
16. 
    frenchy | Apr 27, 2006 04:35am | #29

    Heck,

      I just put copper vent pipes in my roof,  costly but everything else on the roof is copper so putting plastic up would have been a crime.. 

      I wonder if anybody but myself will notice it..

     

1. 
   Heck | Apr 27, 2006 04:38am | #30

   Makes sense to me.

   I would have noticed plastic vents on an all copper roof, you bet.

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

2. 
   seeyou | Apr 27, 2006 04:06pm | #34

   I would have.Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, I get waylaid by jackassery?

   http://grantlogan.net/

1. 
   Rich | Apr 27, 2006 06:20pm | #35

   I saw an episode of This Old House few years ago where they were remodeling an old church into a SFH in San Francisco.  They pointed out that the DWV was all in copper and that was required by city code.  Didn't explain why and I've never been able to get an answer from anyone.

17. 
    TJK | Apr 27, 2006 04:51am | #31

    Our house in Grand Junction, CO built in '67 is all copper for supply and DWV. Pipes and drains in the foundation are all cast iron. The ouside sewer connection they added in the '90s is PVC.

1. 
   UncleDunc | Apr 28, 2006 01:55am | #41

   >> Our house in Grand Junction, CO built in '67 is all copper for supply and DWV.Same here. House in Boulder, CO, built in 1962. All copper supply and drains. The supply comes up out of the basement floor in soft copper. The drains change to cast iron at the basement floor. I assume the vents are copper, too, but I haven't crawled up into the attic to check.To balance the cost of the copper plumbing, they skimped on the electrical. 100A service. Seven circuits on six breakers. No main breakers. No outlet in the hall. All the original wiring is the old fabric and rubber insulation and is getting pretty brittle. It's in cables, like NMX, but it's not plastic insulation. The light over the kitchen sink flickers. When I opened up the box and saw the wiring, I just decided to quit using it rather than fooling with it.

18. 
    Dave45 | Apr 27, 2006 03:59pm | #33

    The manager of the local hardware store told me the other day that cast iron or copper used to be code.  Plastic (ABS) was illegal until the late 70's.

19. 
    chascomp | Apr 27, 2006 08:18pm | #38

    I see it all the time in 60's houses in this area, (Ohio/mid west) copper waste,vent and water. It is very noisey compared to cast but quieter (and more expensive) than PVC. We always use hubless connections when we have to cut into it and move on with PVC. According to much info, PVC will outlast copper. Copper will corrode, not in my life time, faster than cast or PVC.

    
    

    ---

    Edited 4/27/2006 6:21 pm ET by chascomp

20. 
    Jer | Apr 28, 2006 05:17am | #46

    Copper waste was very common in houses of a certain age, the post war houses where all us boomers grew up.  Mine is one, the whole house is done in copper.  I added a full bath 2 years ago and had to chop everything back to the main stack, and all that is now pvc, but the stack and the main line out is still all copper.  Sweating the big joints is no problem at all.

1. 
   Heck | Apr 28, 2006 05:24am | #47

   Funny I never ran into this before. Maybe I did and just never noticed before, but I don't think so.

   I would think that sweating those pipe joints would be no big deal, given a good source of heat.

    "Citius, Altius, Fortius"

21. 
    Sphere | Apr 28, 2006 06:07am | #48

    Required by code in Lansdale, Pa. We had PVC vents, hadda change it out to Cu. This was back in the 80's.

    edit: this was new adition being built.

    Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

    Damm, I miss that stuff

    
    

    ---

    Edited 4/27/2006 11:15 pm ET by Sphere