Hi,
I was wondering if someone could make a suggestion regarding deck stain (not trying to start a religios debate here, so I’ll apologize in advance…). Anyway, I have a 900 sq.ft PT deck that I originally finished with a single coat of Sikkens SRD two years ago. I was never thrilled with the finish as it always appeard to need a second coat (it looks great when it is wet — but looks very dull and faded when dry). The thing that I didn’t like about the Sikkens, is that it is a bear to apply in the NE where 5 days in a row of sunshine is nothing but a dream (especially this summer). I was originially going to just apply a second coat this summer, but now I’m considering alternatives.
So, I’m looking at Cabot, California Storm Stain, etc.. but I have some concerns about applying these over the Sikkens. Given all of this, I am looking for a recommendation…
any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
–Michael
Replies
Right about the weather - which is why I passed on Siekins a couple of times. penofin is good though. Good enough toimpress me, but I can't say anything about going over the Siekins
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Man, you have created a little problem for yourself...............
Silken is great if you want a varnish type finish on your deck but you have virtually killed any chance of having any other deck stain cover for two reasons.
1. You have treated a pre-treated surface with a varnish type sealer.Nothing will penetrate that unless you strip the deck to it's natural wood finish.
2. The only way to treat a pre-treated surface is with paint because it is already treated with a semi-transparent stain which has a paint pigment in it.........
So bag the idea of putting another brand of stain over a painted/varnished finish.
Paint it or replace it...................
Sorry to be so blunt but a pt deck is the last choice for a good looking deck. It is usually treated pine or fir which will check and split and warp under most flat outdoor applications.
"Rather be a hammer than a nail"
Bob
Hey Bob...not trying to hijack this thread or anything but what do you recommend for a T&G 5/4 Mahogany deck with no roof over it.
A finish I mean.....most all the porches I'm doing in Mahogany have roofs over em', but the one outside my new master bedroom has no roof over it.
Be well bro
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Penofin.................."Rather be a hammer than a nail"
Bob
Another thread hi-jack question; a client had a clear film finish applied to their porch and back deck, I'm assuming a Sikkens product. It formed a clear surface layer that lasted about a year. Sun/moisture has the stuff peeling off like a bad sunburn. The guy power washed the deck (Ipe) and railing/balustrade (cedar) and now they want the thing finished with a stain. I told them it would have to be sanded down to bare wood. No pigment was applied on the previous coats. Anything else I should watch for?
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PT wood can make a nice deck - IF - it is sanded smooth and a good quality finish is applied to the clean wood. Make sure you sink the nail heads slightly below grade so you don't sand the galvanization off of the heads. I've had very good luck with Cabot stains. Beside water, UV is what really ages a deck. I don't think clear finishes last very long because of their limited ability to block UV. Adding some pigment will at least double the lifespan of a deck coating. Again, Cabot's oil-based stains have worked well for me, and they now have a line of transparent stains with some pigment. I just used one of these on my cedar shed.
Edited 8/2/2004 9:40 am ET by OVERKNIGHT
The splintering problem on PT decking is one that they throw in for free with all the product. It comes from the fact that the wood is sold soaking wet most of the time. It gets jhandled one or thrice before installation and barely begins to dry out.
So when it gets nailed down, it then does the drying and shrinking in place, the checks and splits appear which lead to the splinters and the ugly look.
The only way to avoid that is to buy a couple months ahead and store it stickered under cover. By the time you invest that much in it, you might as well buy good wood.
I have used PT for milling railings out of. I sticker it and dry it before beginning at least three months. have to get a bunch of 2x8 and then cull out the more knotty pieces to save for framing under which means an additional cost factor, but my point is that yes, you can do a decent job with PT and it will accept stain or paint, but is it worth it? When you get to sanding that stuff, a super dust mask isn't good enough.
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I agree with what you've said about PT being soaking wet when new. But after a deck has been in place for a few years, it has probably moved as much as it's going to. That is when I'll sink the nails and replace any loose ones with screws, and then sand it smooth. I've always used a 4 X 24" belt sander, but a regular floor sander would certainly be faster and keep you off of your knees and farther away from the dust. I also agree with what you said about the dangers of PT dust, which is something I wasn't aware of enough when I'd done the decks. But I'm sure a decent mask can handle the sawdust from PT wood.
Well, first of all you guys aren't hijacking a thread if you stay with the same topic of discussion and that would be all about stain and everyone's opinion right or wrong.
I've never seen a clear shinny surface like Silkins or Verathane that lasted more than a year.
It would be like putting your varnished Oak table out on a deck for a year to see how well it holds up to the weather. It would not hold up at all.
A stain should be transparent and should allow the wood to breathe. Trapping a color under Thompsons, or any other petroleum based products may keep your wood look waterproof but those products will not allow a re-application. Silkens,being more like a five step varnish process does not allow the wood to breathe.
Most people want the water on a deck to roll off like water on a ducks back.
A new application of a transparent stain will shed water for only about six months but it has treated the wood to alleviate shrinking, cracking and checking at the ends, and can be cleaned and re-applied with little work the following year.
Stay with Penofin or Superdeck. My 800 sq.ft cedar deck looks as good as new because I faithfully clean and stain it every year with a transparent stain.
"Rather be a hammer than a nail"
Bob
Dumb question but is Penofin a Ben Moore or Sherwin Williams products...or, better yet, where can I buy it?
Bob,
Thanks for the repsonse -- I had some concerns about applying anything else over this as it's an alkyd oil based product. I hear what you're saying about PT, blunt yes, but I can't argue with you. At the time I built it, it was a replacement for a 10'x10' "builders special" that was falling down... well the stairs were falling down so of course rather than just fix them I decided a two level deck that was 9x the size was in order...you know how that goes... Unfortuntaley I didn't have the $$$ to build something that large and use anything better than PT... The frame however is way over built...In a few years I'm going to add a sizeable addition to the house and all of the decking/railings will be replaced as the layout will change a bit (but using the existing frame). So, I'm really looking for something to tide me over for 2 more summers or so...
Had a feeling that I was going to end up with another coat of Sikkens...
Thanks again to you and everyone who repsonded.
Cheers,
--Michael
Ive got a large (18' x 24') cedar deck that the previous owner basically desroyed with various stains and coverings. Looked awful. It was sanded down and Benjamin Mooore clear coat was put on last August. By April of this year, it was soaking up the water and turning gray in most areas. I did my research (mostly here) and decided on a product called TWP (Total Wood Preservative) with a cedar tone. It penetrates deep into the wood and gives it UV protection. If your deck does not soak up water and get darker, it won't accept a penetrating-type stain.
Do a search for TWP here in Breaktime...a bunch of folks swear by it. There is an article at http://www.woodsealants.com in the articles section about a Texas A&M study on deck sealants. They found that Sikkens was satisfactory for 2-3 years, while TWP was good 3-5 years....we'll see.
That said, I put it down this past weekend and it went on very nicely. I did it with a brush and roller, but it can be done with a sprayer also. It needs a few days to dry, but it rained 36 hours after I put it down and the water beaded like a freshly waxed car. A bit pricey, though...$150 for a 5 gallon drum, plus $16 in shipping. Now, if I can only get 5 years out of it!