Dragged the planer out today I’d bought at auction years ago without the manual or knife setting gauge.
Having never changed the blades on a planer before and feeling like a deer blinded by the car headlights after reading horror stories about blade replacement, I thought to ask here in hopes of technique and advice to better arm myself before I head in.
Thanks
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‘Nemo me impune lacesset’
No one will provoke me with impunity
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Replies
Without the gauge and wrench, I wouldn't even try it. Do you know anyone else who has one of the machines who would loan you the things?
It would be a heck of a lot easier with the gauge and wrench made for the machine.
It's awfully easy to get cut sliding the new blades in there, so watch your pinkies.
razzman,
What are your mechanical skills like?
Replacing blades on a planner is relatively simple and with a little experiance can be done in about ten minutes or so..
The model number doesn't jump out at me. Heck I may have that model down in the basement (too far buried to make it worthwhile to dig out) If it's the model with the disposable blades, I revise my estimate. you can do it inside of 5 minutes.. real piece of cake...
If it's the model with resharpenable blades, it takes a little more time and you really need a set up gauge to do quickly, God I'd never attempt to do it without one..
Don't worry, you can buy them very easily or in a pinch make your own..
If your blades need sharpening, you can usually get them sharpened at the same place that sharpens your tablesaw blades. However I found that my local printers supply outlet did a better job, faster and cheaper.. (turns out the saw blade sharpening place was sending them over there and marking them up when they got back)
If you want I can walk you thru the process in a genartic way..
I second Frenchy. If they are reversable or disposable, they self register when you install them. If they are resharpenable, you need a doohicky like a "magna-set" ..a magnaset is a semi circular ring with 3 magnets, two hold the cutter head shaft while the center will keep ( supposedly) the knife at the proper exposure.
If there is any way to locate the real deal that Delta supplied, I'd go with that..the magnaset can be a challange and two work better than one when going for parallel to the cutter head.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" Iam not a poet, but your hat is singularily inadequate"
"If they are reversable or disposable, they self register when you install them."
On this particular planer, they don't self-register. You change the blades from the top, so a magnetic setting gauge doesn't do any good.
Without the factory blade and wrench it would be very difficult to do.
Everybody is somebody else's weirdo.
Well, thanks to all for the input.
It's the story of my life in that I hate going in green on something new and I sometimes/usually/mostly carry the attitude that things are always worse than the are:o0
Last night after posting here and arming myself with my 5 year old 2001 printout from the Knots recommendations and my two sets of newblades ordered from toolcrib around that same time. Yep, Two sets, gotta be ready see, goes well along with my two speeds of slow and slower, I marched to what I knew would be my doom.
Bolstering myself with the fact that the worst thing that could happen would be failure, lost springs, out of alignment, rounded heads and broken threads, I steadied myself and said 'what the hey'.
Undaunted, for knowing that at times ignorance can be a strength, I leaned into the wind and took my shot.
Couldn't get the feel for the block recommendations and didn't want to wait for more stuff in the mails or be buying more stuff not to be used.(two sets in waiting, the old blades hadn't been used on their other sides so they got inverted and the newblades are back in storage.Roar! yeah, Storage...ok,arf)
Anyhoo, I elected to raise the thing as high as it would go for the easiest access since it's mounted on a stand, managed to locate an 8mm openend that fit well, and they all loosened without a situation developing. ok baby, first base.
So I just stuck my head in there and eyeballed the thing, wondering how close of tolerances these getting older eyeballs could still produce and think I got the things within 1/128th of each other. ROAR!
Drew no blood but did manage to put some nice little slices in the skin.
It was certainly a chore and yep, took more than 10minutes. For sure would have been easier with some gauge tools but it ended with what was a successful adventure into the unknown.
Grabbed the roughcut maple and ran it thru there. Hooboy, those old blades musta been dull dull dull.
Now I need to find a use for maple shavings as there will be a lot. Bagged and labeled as hamster bedding maybe?
Will it be maple flooring in the rustic kitchen of ye old cottage/cabin to match the barn beams or go with the brown ceramic tile.
What day is it today? Saturday again?
be wondering if I can use the EZguide to make shiplap on the maple
Thanks again, glad you guys are holding the safety net.
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
...blades back in storage. Ya right.
What do you guys do? Run the roughcut once thru first on a number of boards then change the blades to dress out the final?
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
"Run the roughcut once thru first on a number of boards then change the blades to dress out the final?"
Yep. With a chill-out period in between. On stickers, a few days to a few weeks (depending on what else comes up - LOL). Makes a huge difference in the final stability. (Of course, there's a jointer pass before it hits the planer...)
(Of course, there's a jointer pass before it hits the planer...)
Being a greenhorn in this I'm not sure what you mean.
Are you saying in order to help save the planer blades to first run them over a joiner to rid of the outer rough cut? Thanks
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
I think what he means is: if you're wanting a board really flat, you need to use the jointer to get the whole thing on one plane. Even though a planer is called a planer, it only gets the faces of a board parallel to each other and smooth, and it can't really remove much bow or twist. A jointer can.
Of course, if you use a jointer and no planer, you might get two perfectly flat faces that aren't parallel to each other. problem.
Hope that was somewhat helpful.
zak
What Zak said.
The process I like to follow is:
1. Cut to length + 1/2" (easier to take the twisties out of a shorter piece)
2. Joint flat one side
3. Joint flat & square one edge
4. Plane / thickness to ~1/8" "fat"
5. Rip to width + ~1/4"
6. Sticker & chill out
7. Repeat steps 2 - 5 to final dimension
8. Cut to final length - both ends (edge may not have been square when first cut).
Yea, lots of sawdust & time. I'm doing this on maple; on more stable woods you may not need to be so crazed about the process.
Oh, yea #2 - I'm not trying to make a living doing this :-)
Of course, a jointer is a kinda critical component of the equation. You can play games hot-gluing shims to a board to flaten it on the planer, or (better yet, per the Knots purists) use a hand plane to take the worst out.
What would be the widest you would want to put down for a floor.
I've got a 16x20 room joists 16" inch on center, Half with a one inch t&g subfloor and half with 3/4 ply.
7/8 inch thick ok?
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
Edited 4/1/2006 1:23 am ET by razzman
Unless it is quarter sawn, I would't want maple strip flooring at over 2-1/4".
It's purely a country style with no desire to try to acheive a highend look so it can be screwed and plugged when needed.
What will happen if wider boards are used?
be in thanks for info
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
The wider the boards, the bigger the crack width between boards when they shrink, and shrink they will.
Maple experiences more tangential shrinkage than oak or cherry, and flat sawn wood experience more tangential shrinkage than quartersawn or rift sawn.
Are you gonna T&G the edges? Shiplap? Spline?
Spline is the fastest and easiest...talk w/ Doud ..he knows the drill.
be humble to his woodism..uh..I mean..he's smart.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" Iam not a poet, but your hat is singularily inadequate"
Gene- What kind of shrinkage could be expected with 7 inch boards?
I have a couple hundred roughcut 10ft maple boards that have been sticked and covered on top for 5 or 6 years so cutting whenever needed is not a problem.
Is the thicker the better? Meaning 1 inch would be better than 7/8?
What if I were to just gap andbutt the boards together and screwed down with just the flat edges?
Do the boards needed to have relief cuts on the backs?
Shiplap is the halfthick routed edge top on one edge and bottom on the other so they somewhat lock into one another?
The spline is a edge centered route with same route thickness having a same thickness spline placed into it which keys the two boards together?
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
Edited 3/29/2006 9:25 pm ET by razzman
Yes and Yes. You got it.
Shiplap is not so swell for a floor, I'd spline it..cuz T&G is a hassel and a half w/o the set up to do it right.
When another poster(s) mentioned flattening one side on a jointer prior to the planer, They was right on.
If and when ya surface the stock, face joint the wind out of it, if not and the wood is cupped the feed rollers will 'flatten' the cup and the blades make it smoothe..when it exits the rollers, it will be re-cupped, but smooth.
Face jointing will allow the most meat to stay on top and get shaved away, flip as needed.
Always try to joint the face that has two edges riding on the table, not a bowl like face that can roll away and get funky on yer azz.
The amount shaved from both faces oughtta be close to the same..otherwise you can inflect a drying stress release program that will make you, make the wood, thinner.
Be a flipper izer, and afraid of Richard Bachman
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" Iam not a poet, but your hat is singularily inadequate"
Here ya go. http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl?calculator=shrinkage
I plugged in a width of 7 inches for red maple (that is northern hard) and started at 12 percent MC, then went to 6 percent.
The amount of shrinkage calculated is:0.1230 inches or:0 1/8 inches(rounded to nearest 1/32 inch) The information you entered was:Width: 7 inchesInitial Moisture Content: 0.12 (decimal percentage value)Final Moisture Content: 0.06 (decimal percentage value)The type of lumber you chose was: Flat SawnThe Shrinkage Percentage Value used forthe species you chose (Maple, Red) was: 8.2%
Edited 3/30/2006 5:13 pm ET by Gene_Davis
So that would mean a full 1/8 inch wide gap appearing between two side by side boards that were laid flush then. Those are pretty good size gaps speading all over the floor.
So in a northern heating season a 6 percent MC can be expected in the flooring? Can anything be done to cause to lessen the 1/8 inch gapping outside of somehow further drying of the flooring before laying?
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
What effect would splineing the flooring boards do to those boards if the boards are screwed securely to the subfloor and joists?
Is this done just to lessen the depth of the gaps between the boards?
Thanks
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
keeps the boards on the same plane and limits deflection...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
As I said about maple, it doesn't behave well as a floorboard when laid wide.
Use the online calculator and check how flatsawn compares to radial in various species and widths.
Quartersawn white oak, my all-time favorite for going down over radiant heat, changes (for my 2-1/4" strip) a little less than 1/32" in width when moving from 12 to 6 percent MC.
Here are the kind of things that can help.
The floor is not laid over radiant heat.
The wood substrate is dry, perhaps down at 5-6% MC.
The wood strips are narrow, 2-1/4" up to 3" maximum.
The flooring has been dried down to the same MC as the wood substrate.
The space is heated in winter, and air conditioned in summer.
Thanks for the info.
Sounds like I'm back to ceramic tile and maple paneling instead.
cheers
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
I've got a very old maple strip floor.True, the gaps are big enough to trap chihuahuas.It's beautiful anyway.Go for it.zak
zak, What's the width of your boards?
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
the boards are 2 1/4" wide. The gaps are only wide where there was some water damage- the boards are all stained dark in one side of the kitchen. Even there, it's about 1/4" gaps in the places where boards twisted away from the same gap.
In other words, the average gap on the whole floor is about 1/16 or 3/32, but since it was water damaged and not nailed down well, there are places with wider gaps.
Maple makes a beautiful floor, but I probably wouldn't go more than 4" wide- I think cupping will be more of a problem with wide boards than the gaps will be.zak
On the net I'd found some pretty wide maple flooring boards being sold which got me thinking, but seeing the possible complexities of using the wider boards and the fact that it will be a kitchen area I'm at a toss up between the maple and just laying some ceramic tile on the floor.
It's just a 12x16 area and thought the pegged maple floor might look good with the exposed barn beams in there is all, and since I already have the maple.
Seems a bit like a lot of work to turn those 6" to 14'"wide boards into usable 2 1/4 inch strips so I'll probably just use them on the walls and such.
Thanks
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
Edited 4/1/2006 1:37 am ET by razzman
Hey you clown. So you decided to go ahead and use some maple on the upstairs aye?
That area between the balcony and the wall about 5 ft wide that widens to 10 in front of the door huh?
And you're wondering if running the boards shorter across the 5 ft width rather than the longer 10ft lengths will help lessen the future board movement.
Good question but I don't have an answer for you.
What are you, some kind of a DIYcrazy? Sometimes I read your posts and have to admit I wonder what in the world is going on in that cubicle of yours.
You sure you want to try this? What is it, a matter of principle or something?
half of good living is staying out of bad situations
grasshopper say:
"The buddha is a bag of flour."
whoops, wrong one.
"The shrinkage of wood over it's length (along the grain) is nil, while the shrinkage of wood perpendicular to said axis will be significant. Therefore, to minimize shrinkage problems, distances across the grain should be minimized, while distances with the grain may be maximized."
the length of the boards should go the long way, unless there is compelling reason otherwise- continuity with other flooring, etc.zak
"so it goes"
ahso great wizened one. Thank you.
Reason I asked is I cut a 4 inch width off an planed 8inch with my EZ guide and per previous warnings that thing tweaked out pretty good. Had to be retrimmed to get a straight edge.
Inherent instability of maple it seems. I have it and want to use it as it is the principle of the thing.
be spitting in the face of complacency
half of good living is staying out of bad situations
ah luv maple, move-ey as it may be. you'll get there eventually.zak
"so it goes"
Sorry, not qualified to pontificate on flooring dimensions. You're a better man than me if you are milling your own flooring - rock on!!
"1. Cut to length + 1/2""
I'd suggest leaving 2" or more at each end. That allows for planer snipe, and splitting of the end of the board as it dries out.
Politicians are people who, when they see light at the end of the tunnel, they go out and buy more tunnel [John Quinton]
"I'd suggest leaving 2" or more "
I'd agree; with wood that still has some moisture there could be checking. My results to date have been great leaving 1/2"; sounds like I should count my blessings - and buy a moisture meter!
I have the Delta 22-580 and snipe is quite minimal (still counting those blessings!).
You are correct on that. Maple likes to end check very quickly. and even with my planer tweaked to the balls, I STILL get some snipe.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" Iam not a poet, but your hat is singularily inadequate"
So you're saying to plane the wood a tad to ~1/8th fat and then sticker them again? To do what? Permit a final drying period before planing to a finished thickness?
thanks
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
undelete my hanging chad please?
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" Iam not a poet, but your hat is singularily inadequate"
I learned a lesson.
Don't plane in the house.
be a dumazz
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
Edited 3/30/2006 3:19 pm ET by razzman
"then sticker them again? To do what?"
I've found that (at least for maple) it often moves a bit after you take some wood off. Stickering lets it adjust to it's new size, and prevent the moving that would occur if the boards were stacked without air between them. The final pass will ensure that it is as flat and stable as possible.
You do realize that those blades are 2 sided, don't you?
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. [Mark Twain ]
yep, and a good thing too.
also good news to find out they can be resharpened a number of times.
be planing more than soft pine and yer going to be needing it
'Nemo me impune lacesset'No one will provoke me with impunity
I have the same planer. Here's the manual:
http://media.ptg-online.com/media/dm/OwnersManuals/20040609150159_En901606-03-31-01.pdf
As far as the knife-setting jig that came with the machine, it's not really that good. It just gets you close. And sometimes it nicks the blade.
UNPLUG THE MACHINE.
Once you get close, cut a block of wood(a 2x4 about 3-4" long works). Place that on the planer table, and adjust the knives that way.
Raise the cutter head so the block fits between the table and the knives.
Rotate the cutter head until the knife just touches the block at bottom dead center.
Slide the block to the other end of the same knife, and make any adjustments.
Then do the other knife,without raising or lowering the table, getting it to the same adjustment.
Make the adjustments gradually. Overtightening the gib bolts can move the blade. I usually just tighten a few bolts on the knife to hold it firm, but allow easier adjustment. When I get it where I want I gradually tighten the bolts in an alternating pattern.
Or spend the $$ on a magnetic knife setting jig.
Good luck.
Pete Duffy, Handyman
Do you know what that site is that the manual came from. Is it just for PC manuals?Whenever I come across links like that I often work them backwards and find interesting info.But in this case, even the root director is not displayable.
http://www.deltawoodworking.com
Pete Duffy, Handyman