Replies

1. 
   IMERC | Nov 29, 2006 03:31pm | #1

   no can do here...

   the poers that be won't allow it..

    

   Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming

   WOW!!! What a Ride!

   Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

1. 
   craigct | Nov 29, 2006 03:51pm | #2

   Does anyone know if this code applies in CT as well?

   What would would be the reason for this?

2. 
   FrankDuVal | Nov 29, 2006 04:02pm | #3

   Not a problem at all anywhere I have worked in Virginia. I do it all the time.

   For deluxe installation mount receptacle in sink cabinet area. Break hot tab. Connect one outlet ( of the duplex ) to 20 amp line from panel. Plug dishwasher into this outlet. Wire other outlet ( of the duplex ) to switch near sink. Plug disposer into this outlet. Cord lengths are in NEC.

   I never tried this on a 15 amp circuit. It never comes up here!

   Frank DuVal

   You can never make something foolproof because fools are so ingenious.

3. 
   5brown1 | Nov 29, 2006 04:57pm | #4

   Here in SD a double pole breaker is used, one side feeding the DW and the other the GD, so when one is turned off the other is also.

1. 
   marv | Nov 29, 2006 05:03pm | #5

   Our inspector says its ok for both to be on same circuit.  But he wants a 24" pigtail coming out of the wall at the floor for the dishwasher.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.

   Marv

1. 
   highfigh | Nov 29, 2006 07:43pm | #6

   I would make sure the inspector reads the NEC about this again. AFAIK, they need to be on separate circuits but you could run 12/3 for both. They also need a switch for each within (I think) 6'. That way, you can shut them off in the event of a problem without having to go to the main panel. I'm pretty sure the insurance industry wants it done this way, too.
   "I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."

1. 
   BillHartmann | Nov 29, 2006 09:42pm | #8

   Something happened to my reply.NAME PLATE DATA.The only way to determine this is based on the appliance name plate data.The NEC allows a circuit to be shared if the largest appliance is no more than 50% of the ampacity of the circuit.Most DW I have seen are less than 10 amps.Not sure about the GD.Also the NEC allows the GD, DW and similar appliances to be cord and plug connected. And when cord and plug connected the plugs service as the service disconnect and no other one is needed.But the NEC is meaningless.It is only a suggestion and the local legislation can adopt whatever version that want and make any modifications that they want.There is also the local inspector's "we have alway done it that way" or similar remarks.Only those modifications adopted by the legislation have any legal authority. But arguing about inspectors "made up rules" might just get into a pissing match. But sometimes you can ask them to explaind the requirements using the code and when they can't find it win.

2. 
   marv | Nov 29, 2006 09:58pm | #9

   They also need a switch for each within (I think) 6'

   I've never seen a switched dishwasher.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.

   Marv

3. 
   RippySkippy | Nov 29, 2006 10:06pm | #10

   My inspector says 12/3 can work...he cautioned that the neutral COULD overload if the heater element was too large. He didn't have a fit about it and made no mention of the switching the DW. It would be easy enough to add though....Rip

1. 
   BillHartmann | Nov 29, 2006 10:09pm | #11

   "My inspector says 12/3 can work...he cautioned that the neutral COULD overload if the heater element was too large. "The inspector is an idiot.The requirement for a multi-wire circuit is that the hots are on different legs so that only the DIFFERENCE is carried by the neutral.

2. 
   pm22 | Nov 30, 2006 03:40am | #14

   A threeway switch [single pole double throw] could be used. One pole goes to the DW* and the other to the garbage grinder. That way, only one could be on at the same time.

   ~Peter

   *DW= DryWall? Designated Wife? DeWalt?

3. 
   BillHartmann | Nov 30, 2006 03:48am | #15

   Either all of the switches I have gotten are been bad or I have not been able to wire them correctly.Everytime I have tried to turn off the DW (disegnated wife) it does not turn off. If anything it seems to acting like it is getting 240 instead of 120.

4. 
   highfigh | Nov 29, 2006 10:16pm | #12

   I guess the local rules will win. I just checked and there is a switch for my DW and one for the disposer. They wanted it, the wall was open anyway and it was really easy to put it in, so that's the way it was done. I think that I may have originally told him it would be hard-wired and then found out that a cord was OK. I never thought it necessary to use the GD while the DW was in the drying cycle. I'm usually out of there by that time.
   "I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."

4. 
   CapnMac | Nov 30, 2006 12:02am | #13

   I would make sure the inspector reads the NEC about this again. AFAIK, they need to be on separate circuits but you could run 12/3 for both. They also need a switch for each within (I think) 6'. That way, you can shut them off in the event of a problem without having to go to the main panel. I'm pretty sure the insurance industry wants it done this way, too.

   One of the better, greater, strengths of BT is being able to "see" parts of the world one can't physically visit.

   Around here, a "pigtailed" DW means an appliance guy did it, and wants any future DW replacer to come call an appliance guy to un "hard wire" their appliance.  Builder-installed DW just are plugged in to the same under-sink outlet the GD is plugged into.  Mostly.

   I've seen DW "wired" by having a hunk of romex snake out of the DPCV box's face plate and down to the DW connection (the faceplate even using a longer-than-normal screw to hold it on, too).  I've seen that under-sink outlet wired, enitre, to the switch in the splash next to the sink, too (yep, DW only "on" when the GD is "on"--oops; what's a "punchlist" again? )Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)

4. 
   Scott | Nov 29, 2006 08:54pm | #7

   Even if it were code compliant it wouldn't be a good idea. Most good DWs now include a heating load in addition to the motor and they deserve to be served by a dedicated circuit, preferably a 12AWG, 20A circuit.

   Scott.

   Always remember those first immortal words that Adam said to Eve, “You’d better stand back, I don’t know how big this thing’s going to get.”

5. 
   Dave45 | Nov 30, 2006 03:59am | #16

   Mine are on the same circuit with a split receptacle with one side of the receptacle switched for the disposal.  Both the disposal and dishwasher have plugs.

   My house was built in '79 and doesn't meet current code.  If I ever remodel the kitchen, I'll have to do some serious rewiring since all my receptacles are on one circuit - and it also carries the microwave.  Thank the gods for grandfather clauses - lol.

1. 
   BillHartmann | Nov 30, 2006 04:06am | #17

   Mine is the sameway. Everything on the 2 small appliance circuits.That include, countertop MW, toaster, trash compactor, GD, DW, instant hot water dispenser, and refigerator.The saving grace is that most of those appliance run for only few seconds to a couple of minutes at time.The only sympton that I see is if I run the trash compactor while the MW is on you will see the light dim for a second.

1. 
   craigct | Nov 30, 2006 04:57am | #18

   Thank you all for your responses, very helpful

   <!----><!----> <!---->

   Called Kitchen Aid for some info as the dishwasher arrives tomorrow; neither customer service or the internet had the load info found on the plate, surprised by that.

   <!----> <!---->

   Based on all your information I decided to play it safe.  The garbage disposal was going to pull 10.2 amps (1 HP).  I ran the under cabinet lighting and the garbage disposal off one circuit and the dishwasher off another (both 20 amps).  I decided to switch the dishwasher within 6 ft. and opted not to with the garbage disposal as it’s a batch feed.   

   <!----> <!---->