Replies

1. 
   MarkH | Oct 20, 2006 02:59am | #1

   No.  It was a total failure.  Very difficult to paint, then the paint peeled off by at least 80%.  I used latex primer, maybe that was wrong, who knows?

2. 
   MisterT | Oct 21, 2006 05:39pm | #2

   if it is 100% silicone, then it is NOT paintable!!!

   well ackshully anything is paintable but the paint's future performance is what counts...

    

    

    

    

    

   WARNING!!!

   The FCC has determined the this post may contain unsafe levels of SARCASM!!!!

   If you are sensitive or become offended when you are shown to be WRONG!!!!

   You should make a complaint to our hotline:

   1-800-BITE-ME

    

1. 
   BillHartmann | Oct 21, 2006 08:37pm | #6

   The 100% silicone (or anything else) always makes we wonder about the literal accuracy of that.Now you cana get 100% silicone in clear, white, brown, black, etc. I would assume that those come from different pigments and that the clear is "natural".Now if they are adding pigments then it is only 99.999% silicone and the remainder pigments.I suspect that the 100% silicone means that the "active ingrediants (whatever that is) is 100% silicone and you still have other ingrediants which include retarders, flow agents, pigments, and a host of other things need to make the product work.A good example is paint. You will see 100% acrylic latex paint. But if you look at the MSDS you will see gobs of materials that aren't arcylic latex. In fact if it was 100% acrylic then it would be a hard block and worthless.I assume that he is talking about GE Silicone II XST Paintable Caulk.http://kbam.geampod.com/KBAM/Reflection/Assets/9999.pdfSee page 7.That is the only one that I have seen. But they do have a compariosn chart comparity with Other paintable silicone caulks along with siliconized latex, poly, and elastomer caulks.PS. I used it on one bathroom after it was painted. But the painted needed to be touched up and the edge of the caulk was painted over. Seems to have held, but the house was not lived since them until about a weeks ago. I did that about 15 months ago.

   Edited 10/21/2006 1:40 pm by BillHartmann

2. 
   Matt | Oct 21, 2006 08:45pm | #9

   >> if it is 100% silicone, then it is NOT paintable!!! <<  You need to do some checking around - there is such an animal.  See my above post.  For example: http://www.amazon.com/GE-GE5091-Silicone-Paintable-Cartridge/dp/B0000CBJ7Y

   Also, In a recient bout I had with bathroom caulking, I also found out that all silicone is not created equal...  For example, although this was the un-paintable stuff, what I found is that GE Silicone I and GE Silicone II are very different.

1. 
   Andy06 | Oct 22, 2006 09:34pm | #16

   I probably should have added a link to clearify exactly what I was looking at.  This is a DAP product and does state being 100% silicone as well as paintable.  Here is the link http://www.dap.com/docs/tech/0008654.pdf let me know if anyone has had any experience with this.

   Thanks for all the help,

   Andy

1. 
   MarkH | Oct 23, 2006 04:16am | #20

   That is the stuff I was unimpressed with.

2. 
   Ryan1 | Oct 23, 2006 08:45pm | #21

   If you don't mind sharing, what exactly did you find out about GE Silicone I vs GE Silicone II?   Thanks.

1. 
   Matt | Oct 24, 2006 02:00am | #22

   >> If you don't mind sharing, what exactly did you find out about GE Silicone I vs GE Silicone II? <<

   The GE Silicone II is the non VOC stuff - smells totally different than GE Silicone I.  Based on that alone, I don't see how they can be similar.  Kind of like oil based paint vs latex paint...  So, what does 100% silicone really mean? 

   The main thing I learned the hard way though is that GE Silicone II is heat sensitive.  If you get a magnifying glass and read the label it says not to store above 80 degrees F.  I caulked a shower using a tube that was a  few months old.  Went on like normal.  After waiting 3 or so days, I came to the realization that it was never gonna dry...  Had to scrape off the gooey mess and redo it.  Naturally the 2nd time around it didn't come out nearly as nice as the first time I did it...

1. 
   Ryan1 | Oct 24, 2006 04:10pm | #23

   Thanks for the heads up.   Sorry to hear about your experience.   

3. 
   PaulBinCT | Oct 21, 2006 06:06pm | #3

   Are you using indoors or out? Years ago, in an episode we still laugh about, a friend of  mine bought unpaintable silicone for an application where he needed to paint... We called the GE answer center and incredibly, on a weekend, they had someone there who knew the product cold and told us to sand it for tooth, and then paint.  It worked quite well and lasted for years.

   Good luck,

   PaulB

1. 
   PaulGC | Oct 21, 2006 06:48pm | #4

   Paul, latex caulking with silicone is paintable. Everyone I know uses it (Dap brand) but I don't like it, except for indoor work. For outdoor work I use Mono and find it to last a lot longer than regular caulking. I do know someone who had no choice but to use Mono instead of silicone around their stainless steel chiney. The silicone didn't hold good enough for long term use.

    

   Paul in Canada

   P.s. CT. huh! I have family in Manchester

1. 
   PaulBinCT | Oct 21, 2006 07:26pm | #5

   I know what you're saying Paul, but this was GE silicone, labeled "not paintable".  I'm not saying it's a perfect solution, but in a case like this it was sand or scrape it all off and clean with lacquer thinner. All I know is, it worked...

   Manchester's a nice area... ritzy ;)

   PaulB

   Edited 10/21/2006 12:46 pm ET by PaulBinCT

4. 
   Matt | Oct 21, 2006 08:38pm | #7

   I used Duron paintable silicone caulk on my own home about 7 years ago when it was built.  I think this was when the paintable silicone came out.  It is an interior (bathroom) application.  It has held up fine, including the paint.  At the time I thought "wow this stuff is great" but it hasn't seemed to catch on as much as I expected based on the fact that it is not very common.  Maybe that is partially because of the hefty price tag...

   
   

   ---

   Edited 10/21/2006 1:47 pm ET by Matt

5. 
   DanH | Oct 21, 2006 08:40pm | #8

   All I know is that I made the mistake of using some paintable silicone around the towel bars in the bathroom. The stuff had no shine and started turning yellow in a couple of months. So I painted it with white Testors, and it's been fine ever since (15 years maybe).

   If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
6. 
   Tomrocks21212 | Oct 22, 2006 02:42am | #10

   Don't remember where I read it years ago, and can't remember if it was interior only, but the gist was that you can prime silicone caulk with contact cement, which will then take paint.

1. 
   BillBrennen | Oct 22, 2006 04:57am | #11

   Tom,Along that same line I heard that you can smear a thin layer of acrylic caulk over the cured silicone, then paint that. Never tried it , though, so cannot vouch from experience.Roughing it up and cleaning with alcohol sound like two good ideas no matter what you are trying to stick onto silicone RTV.Bill

7. 
   drbgwood | Oct 22, 2006 06:34am | #12

   what ya going to be caulking?

   If I'm caulking interior, I use dynaflex 230.  it's a premium laytex, and paintable anytime, that I would use just about anywhere in a house.  The exception might be caulking shower handles to the surround... stuf like that, I'll go with clear silicon.

   Outdoors, my highest recomendation would be sidewinder.  It's a hybrid caulk that's reatively easy to use, and very paintable in less than a day.

   I've only used the paintable silicones when I'm making a seal that has to bond to glass.  They seamed to paint fine, but I've only had to paint them the same color as the caulk.. white.

    

1. 
   FLA Mike | Oct 22, 2006 07:12am | #13

   The Dynaflex230 is a great interior caulk.  I use it most of the time, unless I'm repairing a previous failure resulting from material movement.  If I know the material's going to keep moving I use GE XSt(?) paintable silicone. 

   The only thing I don't like about the GE XST is how badly it flashes the paint.  Though it does seem to hold the paint well.  And no way can you get away with less than two coats if its for a finish application, unless you're painting it white.

   The GE XST is also good to use exterior.  SideWinder is also great.  I also like the PL sealants, though you have to wait a week or so before painting, and they HAVE to be painted. 

   I have totally gotten away from 100% silicone.  I used to love it, now I hate it. 

1. 
   sharpblade | Oct 22, 2006 02:42pm | #14

   PL sealants.  Please tell me why you say they HAVE to be painted? is it because they get dirty looking otherwise? thanks.

1. 
   FLA Mike | Oct 22, 2006 09:18pm | #15

   The sun says so.

   Seriously, it's a polyurethane, and it's UV resistance isn't so good.  A few years in the sun will dry it up and result in a shorter life.  PL says it has to be painted, right there on the tube.

   Please correct me if I'm wrong! 

1. 
   BillHartmann | Oct 22, 2006 11:12pm | #17

   I am not sure where you see that on the tube.I have a tube of PL Plyurethane Window, Door, & Siding Sealant in white.UV is not listed on a lable anyplace. And the only place that I see paint is "Paintable and permanently flexible".And look at this.http://www.bestmaterials.com/caulk_sealants.aspxAbut Sonneborn."Caulks vs. Sealants: Some manufacturers use the terms "Sealants & Caulks" interchangeably. Sealants are designed to seal an interface which has movement. Caulkings are designed to fill a gap. Sealants are designed to create a long-term seal that stays intact and prevents moisture ingress and are UV resistant. Sealants are designed to deal with greater joint movement, extreme temperatures and have very low shrinkage. Class A sealants have +/-25% joint movement capability. Polyurethane (urethane) based sealants are now the most widely used product in the roofing and waterproofing industry. Today, polyurethane sealants (still called caulks by many) are specified for most roofing details. They are used extensively in flashings, termination bars, reglets, copings and pitch pans."Then if you look at the products that are specificly listed as being UV resistant at least 2 of them (if not all) are listed as polyureathanes.Now here is something interesting.http://www.conservationtechnology.com/downloads/Sealants.pdf"Note that we do not offer clear silicone caulk or recommend their use: clear silicones are UV transparent
   and will permit sunlight to pass through the caulk and quickly deteriorate the bond between the caulk and substrate."

2. 
   zak | Oct 22, 2006 11:54pm | #18

   Thanks for posting that, it confirms my thoughts.  PL or Sikaflex are the gold standard for outdoor caulks, as far as I'm concerned.  I often use silicone in bathrooms and kitchens, because I'm more likely to use clear or white, and silicone is easier to clean up and tool. 

   Everywhere else, something like dynaflex 2300 (I think that's what it's called) plenty of lifespan for interior work, high enough quality for me to depend on it for airsealing around windows and such.

   PL seems like it might be slightly easier to work with than Sikaflex.  I think it cures a bit faster?  Either way, get out the nitrile gloves and mineral spirits.zak

   "When we build, let us think that we build forever.  Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone." --John Ruskin

   "so it goes"

    

3. 
   FLA Mike | Oct 23, 2006 02:24am | #19

   Thanks.

   I am both puzzled and relieved.  I read your post, then ran out to my garage and read a tube of PL Window and a tube of PL Concrete...nothing about required painting.  Interestingly, two months ago while sealing some sliders, I recall to myself that PL needs painting.  I don't know why, but I must have used some sealant or caulk the week before that required painting, and mixed it up with PL.  I began to worry about all the times I'd used PL and didn't paint.  I'm now relieved- sort of...

   So I go in my back yard and look at a window on my house that I repaired some rot on three years ago.  My house has vinyl siding and the window trim is wrapped with aluminum (ugulee).  When I replaced the window, I used GE XST at the perimeter vinyl/aluminum joint. I used PL Window for the aluminum trim where the legs meet the stool and head, and around the window.  NEITHER sealant was painted and BOTH are 'wrinkling'.  Little cracks everywhere on the surface.  The PL even has a couple of small holes.  This is mainly happening at the bottom third of the legs and along the sill.  I guess I should check on the GE XST being okay for vinyl, but I'm assuming it is.  It seems to me that if they're going to be exposed to the central Florida sun, they need paint.  But it may be a different story further north.

   I had trouble getting your first link to work.  The second was very good reading.  I found this interesting- "(Polyurethane caulk) can be painted, but the paint will not stretch like the caulk and may crack or peel".  I have actually experienced this, but always thought it happened because I must not have given it long enough cure time.

   Thanks for setting me straight about the PL.