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Door Clearance

Don | Posted in General Discussion on January 7, 2005 02:22am

Help! Again. Interior doors all driving me to a Psychiatrist. None of them have the proper clearance all the way around. Real problem is along the hinge side; wider at top than at bottom. (On strike side the clearance is narrower at top than at bottom – sorta makes sense, doesn’t it?) Jambs are plumb. Pre-hung doors; Masonite Corp 6 panel real wood doors. Space between hinge leaves is greater at top; about twice the space between leaves as on bottom hinges. All hinges are inlet the same distance, since they were pre-hung. A couple won’t close w/o interference. All hinge leaves were removed from wood while it was painted. If you lift up (as opposed to lifting down) on the lever when you close door, most will close w/o interference; that tells me something is loose at the top. Checked top hinges for being loose. Not the problem everywhere, but to make sure, I am driving 3″ screws through center hole in top hinge. (I know that’s a bit long, but I want to be sure I get into the real studs w/ lots of holding power.)

Don’t want to do anything rash till I hear from someone who knows what they are doing.

Thanks, guys! (For the females out there, as best as I can figure it, “Guys” is neutral. I’ve heard my daughters say “C’mon, guys!” to a gang of friends when there wasn’t a male type guy around other than me – and I know I wasn’t included in the group.)

Don

The GlassMasterworks – If it scratches, I etch it!
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Replies

  1. Shep | Jan 07, 2005 03:34am | #1

      Driving a screw into the stud is a good step in the right direction. Lots of times, that should take care of the problem.

      " All hinges are inlet the same distance, since they were pre-hung"

        Not necessarily so. It depends on the shop doing the work. I've seen prehungs that I've pretty much had to rehang myself to get the door operating properly.

       It could be the hinge mortice depth, it could be a bent hinge.

      How's the margin along the top of the door? From your description, I would think that there's a wider gap on the strike side. If not, there's some problem with how the jambs are set.

  2. STimms | Jan 07, 2005 04:52am | #2

    Something that I try to always use is my eye but only after setting the hinge jamb plumb. After closely setting the hinge jamb as plumb as possible I then almost close the door to set the level on the edge of the door slab. I feel that you can only count on your level being accurate over its length so using the longer straight edge of the slab tells me if my hinges are plumb with each other. Assuming you are using only a 4' level you could have deflection on prehung jambs between the hinges that can give you a false reading of an accurately plumb jamb. Its the hinges that I want to be set plumb first. Once the hinges are set I use my eye to set the gaps all around the door. All too often it is overlooked that there can be deflection in the hinge jamb between the top hinge and the head jamb that will close the gap too tight on the strike side at the top of the door. The length of the head jamb is fixed so if the gap to one side at the top of the door is too big the other side will be too small. I think your attempt to pull the door over by drawing the top hinge is a good approach but you can often raise the strike side of the slab closer to the head jamb in the process thus affecting the latching of the strike.
    To recap my approach once the hinges are plumb with each other I gap the hinge side to match that of the gap created by the hinge itself. (about 1/16") Then make the gap between the head jamb and the slab and then the strike jamb and the slab consistent. (about 1/8") It almost sounds to me like you might have to pull the trim on one side of the door to make the needed adjustments with shims. Hope all goes well in the attempted fix.
    Scott T.

  3. DanH | Jan 07, 2005 05:46am | #3

    After you've inserted long screws into the top hinge and that doesn't fix it, stick something (I've used a screwdriver handle) in between the leaves of the bottom hinge and push the door closed HARD.

  4. J2020 | Jan 07, 2005 08:05am | #4

    If replacing an 'inside' hinge screw with a 3"-er into the stud doesn't fix it, try to determine if shimming behind one of the hinges will work. Use cardboard and start thin.

    If you're having the the same problem with a lot of doors you should probably find a better solution though. ...Maybe remortising.

  5. slykarma | Jan 07, 2005 09:49am | #5

    Did you try to throw the hinges with shims? A relatively thin piece of card can make a difference of 1/16" or more in the gap around the door.

    In paint grade work, I like to use trimhead screws for easier adjustability and holding power. As one poster already mentioned, sometimes there can be considerable warp in the short length between top hinge and head jamb - and ditto for bottom of frame. An extra screw near the end of the side jamb can make a difference. The new composite jamb shims are a step ahead too - less compressible than cedar and they snap off with less force and mess.

    Finally, there's nothing like a 6' level to show the real straight and plumb story. It's surprising what a different picture you get compared to a 4'. A subtle bow in a jamb can easily trick a 4' into showing plumb when it isn't, or vice versa.

    Wally

    Lignum est bonum.
  6. gordzco | Jan 07, 2005 10:58am | #6

    Makes sense?

    Cheap hinges? Are the pins too small for the hinge? Is this why the weight of the door is opening the top hinge?

    Another thing I've found with pre-hungs is the hideous hinge misalignment.  If a door has been removed it is quite common that a hammer is needed to coax the bottom hinge in place to receive the pin. If the door has been installed heavily a couple of times in this manner, it could affect a hinge gap.

    Sometimes after painting, the Painters re-install the hinges. I've seen loose screws and hinges installed in reverse position. I've seen different brands of hinges mixed and matched on the same door.

    The big screw sounds like the first fix.

     

    Be Constructive

    Gord

    St.Margaret's Bay NS

  7. mike4244 | Jan 07, 2005 04:49pm | #7

    Don, first thing is prehung does not ensure quality, usually the opposite.Shim the doors with cardboard from the lock box. Long screws ,good idea, I use 2 1/4" brass screws at the top. Longer screws have a larger head that won't fit the countersink on the leaf.Use a steel screw first to form threads, wax long screws and pilot hole.

    The prehungs I have hung usually have 11/16" thick finger jointed jambs. They are rarely straight.All of this plus sloppy premortices contribute to your distress.I would not bend the hinge as someone suggested. Shim it , walk away from it.

    The door binding is probably because the stop is too close to the door on the hinge side.Pop the stop off,nail it back with 1/16" clearance .Some times you can tap the stop back with a thin block of wood and hammer when the door is open.I'll do this when only a small portion of the stop is in the way. With exterior doors that have a plowed jamb, you have to move the hinge out to clear the stop.

    mike

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