I am considering buying some door hanging equipment and I want a hinge jig that is accurate, will move from the door leaf to the door frame(jamb) and not shift or move around on me, will work equally well on installing new doors or installing a new leaf into an existing frame. Need some help on what brand to purchase.
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Replies
I cut my teeth on the Rockwell (now Porter-Cable) jig back in the 70s, and have owned my own for almost 30 years. It works well, but there are things I don't like about it:
The length-adjustments on the arms work well when snapped into place at the presets, but are hard to tighten down enough to avoid slipping on odd settings, when matching up to existing mortises, for instance. It's like a lot of miter saws: great at the detents, but try to cut 89 degrees, and good luck.
These odd settings have to withstand being removed from the door or jamb by prying the template nails loose, then being reattached to the other piece. Often the jig is leaned up in a corner between routings, and if not done really gently, the jig is tapped out of alignment when it hits the floor.
Also, make sure that the design is remodel-friendly. The Rockwell/PC jig has optional blocks which fit snuggly into an existing mortise, and screw to the edge of the jig. Holding each individual block in its mortise while you tighten down the knobs is really a two-person job, though.
So I milled hardwood blocks that fit the oversize jig snuggly on one side, and are rabetted to fit into the existing hinge mortise on the other. I pre-drilled them to screw them into the existing mortises (offset your holes from the hinge pattern!). I made them thick enough so that I can hang each template on its block and then tighten down all of the knobs. Much better.
Stanley Power Tools used to make a good jig, but I think it went out of production when they got bought out by Bosch in the early 80s.
AitchKay
I agree with AitchKay, the PC or the Bosch metal templates can be adjusted but are easily bumped out of alignment on odd spacing retrofits. Premade, or shopmade plywood templates cant be knocked out of alignment, but also cant be adjusted. If you use the plywood on a retrofit that doesn't line up correctly you can fill the existing mortises with Wood Epox or Bondo then use the template, as long as its paint grade. If you have a lot of retrofits with the same spacing, you could make a custom ply template.
Greetings and Welcome to BT!
This newer model was recently discussed here with several favorable comments from those who own it. Using a story pole to mark hinge locations, the template becomes a very simple alternative to the three hinge version. It's about $30 at HD or from Amazon.
I have a three hinge template but I'll buy one of these the next time I need to cut mortises for hinges, just because there's no time lost, setting it up.
http://www.deltaportercable.com/Products/AccessoriesDetail.aspx?ProductID=16391
What Hudson Valley Carpenter said......View Image
I have the porter -cable version (cheaper looking -Home Depot) It works for me for the
rare times that i need i ; custom 8 ft. doors. But I really cannot justify a metal jig.
But I have been called a tool addict.
I got this one as a B-Day gift and just used it last week on a replacement door mounting. It and the latch mortise templates both worked easily and perfectly. Much better than some of the others I have used.Never fear the want of business. A man who qualifies himself well for his calling, never fails of employment.
Thomas Jefferson
3rd president of US (1743 - 1826)
Glad to hear that you got a neat new tool on that special occasion. Thanks for confirming that both of them are worth owning.
I learned how to do both those jobs with basic hand tools, self taught in fact, so I' really looking forward to having both of those jigs among my tools.
I have a Bosch jig and it is great for prehanging new doors in new jambs. It is miserable for matching existing hinge spacing such as when hanging a new door in an existing jamb, unless you get lucky and the spacing matches exactly. For that you need an individual hinge template. I have used Templaco stuff and it is fine although not heavy-duty IMO.
I have used the Bosch for years.
I recently had to retrofit 8 interior doors to existing mortices....yuck. But I developed a gauge block that allowed me to line up the individual templates with the existing mortices. It worked perfectly, with less than 1/16th room for error. I'd do it that way again if I had to. (it was the length of the hinge template that I was using less an 1/8th. It allowed me to perfectly line up the 3 templates.)"The nearest thing to eternal life we will ever see on this earth is a governmental program" -Ronald Reagan
I have done the same, but the real issue is when the hinge spacing is not compatible with the bars in the Bosch kit that join the templates together. On several occasions I have used just one of the templates from the kit individually, but I've always felt that they should have designed the bars to allow a wider range of spacing.
In my next life I'll invent such a thing.
understood. I agree. Fortunately, I've not had to deal with spacing that bad."The nearest thing to eternal life we will ever see on this earth is a governmental program" -Ronald Reagan
I have my pops older Rockwell boring jig that works fine if your in need of a locket boring jig.
ML
Thanks for the input.These tips have given me some ideas and somewhere to start. I'll be back with more questions later
i have the porter cable... i have the bosch... i have a craftsman set thats 40yrs old...
and i have never enjoyed use'n or set'n up any of them... i hung 12 8ft doors last week use'n the porter cable one that the link was shown to... easy & fast... i usually dread match'n up hinges... some of these door were already mortised some weren't no 2 were exactly the same but all had 4 four inch hinges... i got every hinge within 1/32nd I actually enjoyed do'n it... if you can read a tape measure then you won't have problems... when i first posted about this it was recomended to me to get a carbide bit to replace the HSS one that come with it... I took that advice so for less than $40 i have a tool that i can see use'n for years... that in my minds eye paid for itself on the first door...
p
Got spares?
Backups in case you forget?
Over the years I have accumulated a few. For retrofit they are more trouble then they are worth.
I free hand most material removal with a mortise bit in a laminate trimmer then fine tune with chisel and razor knife. Not counting fitting the door... just mortising hinges... I can average 1 in about 5 minutes, not worth fooling around with a jig.
I have 2 PC's myself, always wondered why I did, oh I bought the second cause I couldn't find the first, now I know where they both are.>G<
i saw pc has the one just like it for the latch/strike haven't pulled that trigger yet...
i never liked any of my 3-4 hinge template setups... too many small knobs set screws and since 90% of my stuff is reuse'n something to making something do.... it was never intended to do... never had that comfort level... so i'd mark em out and freehand em then clean em up.... 10x the time of the little PC jig... i use to wait til last to mortis my hinges... now i just knock em out like i know what i'm doing...
p
I have the Milwaukee, I think it is the same as the Bosch. These three-gang setups are really only worth the setup time to use them for multiple new doors/jambs. I've bought the plastic PC ones now and again and like 'em just fine, perfect for retrofits. You can nick/gouge them a little and just bondo to fix. Sooner or later I break or chew 'em up bad enough to have to replace.
sledgehammer.
I bought my PC for 2 doors! (I'll use it on other doors as well but that's not terribly important)
The reason I bought mine is to keep perfect alignment of the hinges.. I have extremely heavy doors to hang. (It takes two of us to carry one door and we struggle) I need 6 ball bearings 4 inch hinges per door and if a hinge is slightly misaligned it makes the door bind as it swings.
That binding causes the hinge to work on the mount and will eventually pull out.
Before installing I'll knock out the pins and using one shaft to perfectly line up the hinges with each other make absolutely sure that everything is dead nuts right on..
On the plus side nobodies gonna knock down these babies!
That's just dandy, I personally can't remember the last house I was in that had a door that required 2 people to carry. Apparently you and I specialized in different directions.
2 guys to hang a door with 6 hinges isn't common in these parts. Glad the investment worked out so well for you.Which template did you spring for that does 6 hinges?
Edited 8/27/2008 9:39 pm ET by sledgehammer
Edited 8/27/2008 9:55 pm ET by sledgehammer
Man, so much tension here!
OK, this is what I use. It costs $42,000.00 dollars and can mortise 3 hinges on one door in a half an hour. It's paid for itself many times over. You guys.......
View ImageView Image
If you can't get 3 mortises in less than half an hour you need to call the salesman back for another demo!
You must have meant half a minute.
I was trying to include all my time, like loading it
in my truck, plugging it in and stuff.......View Image
Edited 8/27/2008 10:19 pm ET by jocobe
OK, if you have to carry it up a set of stairs at the jobsite I can understand the 30 minutes.
LOL!
Is that the contracter version or the gimmicky homeowner version?
sledgehammer,
Sorry to get back to you so late, server problems.
Any way the door is so tall that I set it up for three hinges on the top and slide it down for three hinges at the bottom. As luck would have it that winds up being perfect spacing.
I can't believe people buy those hinge templates for standard hinges. I make my own with a scrap of cabinet grade plywood. For my DeWalt trim router the template opening is almost exactly 7" for a 4" hinge. I make a pass on the jointer to clean up the edge of the plywood and then cut the top and bottom with the miter saw. To cut out the back I raise the tablesaw blade into the piece. I draw reference lines for the center and edges of the hinge on the template. I line up the edge of the template with the jamb or the door and attach it with a nail or screw.
I also make templates for SOSS hidden hinges that are better than the store bought ones. All you need is a plunge router and a bit diameter that matches the hinge width.
Say Mike you must have a lot of extra time on your hands, I'm going 6 days a week and none of my clients will pay me to make up a jig at home and I'm too tired after working all day anyway! I do have jigs that I have made on site for a special application of some kind, but for hinges and knobs/dead bolts, give me a good easy to use and accurate store bought jig anytime. BTW - do you know a Teresa Callahan up at the Lake?Never fear the want of business. A man who qualifies himself well for his calling, never fails of employment.
Thomas Jefferson
3rd president of US (1743 - 1826)
I bet you buy your sawhorses too. I bet they are those little plastic ones. The time you take to go buy your jig, I will have your door finished and a home made jig to make perfect mortises. It is just a small scrap of 9 ply that I use and it takes less than 5 minutes to make. Another scrap makes a jig for the strike plate. They don't wear out so I can use them for years. The scrap I am using for 4" hinges has been used about a hundred times at least. That is quite a return on five minutes of fabrication time. I would rather use my time making stuff than shopping any day. The time it took to post your little whine would have been more than enough time to make a bunch more of them. I do have a nice store bought boring jig for lock sets.Mike Callahan, Lake Tahoe, Ca.
Did you miss the part about them being gifts to me, no time involved getting them on my part. Your angst shows through trying to defend your time, so much so that you seem to have missed my personal question at the end of my "whine". Yes,I do have several sets of the "little plastic sawhorses", all gifts BTW, and home welded collapsable metal ones and home made wood ones all for different purposes. Everything keeps going around because we all choose to spend our time differently and keep our clients happy.
Take care, good skiing to you, and if you get out to the islands give me a shout and we can talk jigs.Never fear the want of business. A man who qualifies himself well for his calling, never fails of employment.
Thomas Jefferson
3rd president of US (1743 - 1826)
I can't believe people buy those hinge templates for standard hinges.
I can't believe that you're insulting a bunch of anonymous strangers on a message board, then giving them your real name and location.
But please don't let my petty, irrational concerns bother you. We're just a group of humble tradespeople, who have been awaiting your arrival and the shining light which you bring forth in this dark little corner of cyber space.
Like sheep, awaiting the new day and the return of our shepherd, we're comforted by your presence and reassured that we'll now be led to greener pastures.
You forgot that the first insult was directed towards me for wasting time because I suggested in a thread titled hinge mortising that you could make your own jig easily. For God's sake, a hinge is just a rectangle. It is the easiest jig ever made. I was not suggesting that you make a jig for a curlicue hinge. I was accused of wasting time when I could have gone out and bought some jig made in China instead. Sometimes I wonder about the ratio of posers to real carpenters on this forum. A DIY would more likely buy a jig whereas a day to day carpenter uses his money for tools he needs and not ones he can make in a few seconds. The majority of posters on this forum are posers and I wish that a lot of them would just shut up and listen. Talk about too much time on their hands? This forum is mostly just a bunch of chatty Cathies without much substance to add.
I use my real name and you can look me up in the phone book too. Most of the posers here have cute handles. I know that many of the real carpenters also use their names here.
No one buys me tools for gifts. I buy tools as I need them. My wife lets me decide what tools I need. For my birthday I get a new Mountain Bike. Giving tools as gifts to a carpenter would be like buying a saucepan for a house wifes' birthday.Mike Callahan, Lake Tahoe, Ca.
You forgot that the first insult was directed towards me for wasting time because I suggested in a thread titled hinge mortising that you could make your own jig easily.
You really expect me to know what you wrote in another thread?
The simple underlying suggestion from me is to offer your advice, then let it stand alone, without criticising others to make your methods seem superior.
Edited 8/28/2008 4:49 am by Hudson Valley Carpenter
I've made numerous mortising jigs, mostly for odd sizes. Often it is more convenient to just buy one, especially the PC strike one that has multiple sizes. I do not agree that it takes only a few minutes to make one- probably at least a half hour to make one that is spot-on accurate. And spot-on accurate for a 3 1/2" hinge, for instance, means one that will produce a mortise just a tad over 3 1/2" wide- just the right size so that the hinge slips in nice and snug but there is no fighting to get it in. The other part of the jig-making thing for me is that I really enjoy doing it, making them. I enjoy carpentry so much that a gift of a tool is a real joy to me. And this is my full-time profession.That's how I roll.
The majority of posters on this forum are posers...
If I agreed with that, I wouldn't waste my time here. Of course there's some, but the MAJORITY? How do you wade through the morass of morons?
As for making vs buying a mortising jig... there's a time place for everything. I do doors a few times a year and I find it very convenient to keep an inexpensive, compact jig in my router accessory bag.
I don't really care if I'm a "real" carpenter or not. I don't even think there's a very clear definition. But I do know what I'm capable of and what challenges I still face. Making a jig for mortising the 3 most popular sizes of door hinges is not something that I feel I need to do when an inexpensive, convenient alternative is available. If I do get around to making jigs, it would just be mostly out of curiosity to see if I could improve on the jig I have now, not to prove anything.
I have used several types,Bosch,Porter Cable, homemade one hinge jig and homemade three hinge from aluminum angle.For new work the aluminum angle is the best for me. Can not be bumped out of alignment and relatively cheap to make.
For old openings, the PC is my favorite. The PC works fine for new or old work, but could be inadvertently knocked out of alignment.I have used the Bosch but only for a few doors. No problems with the bosch, just not enough time with it to rate it.
mike