When looking for door hinges it seems that what’s available in the hardware section are hinges with square corners and 1/4 inch and 5/8 inch radius.Customer wants rounded corners. Is it just for looks or is there another reason to select 1/4 inch or 5/8 inch corners?
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Radius corners as a hinge leaf feature isn't really a decorative feature, but one meant to make easier the job of machining the hinge mortises.
A 1/2" diameter (1/4" radius) mortising bit is used for doing the one, and a 1-1/4" diameter bit for the other.
The high production plants prefer the larger bit, because it chops out the mortises in two passes.
Thank you all for your input.
Usually on higher end work I see nothing but square hinges.
The rounded hinges are simply a convienence in mortising the hinges. Niether hinge is mo better - I prefer the look of the square corners, maybe its just the tradition but the rounded corners always looks like a cheap hinge to me.
Doug
I wholly agree.Inmate # 40735 At Taunton Federal Penitentiary.
Like you, I think that squared hinge leaf mortises look more "high-end".
I have one of those right angle chisel thingies (I can't remember the "real" name - lol) and can square up those rounded corners in a few seconds. One whack with a hammer and a quick scoop with a regular chisel and ............ta-da!!..........a square corner.
Of course, all that gets wasted when some moron decides to paint over the hinge leaves!!!
Does he paint the weather seal too?
I've seen it done. The best one was the guy who painted the weather stripping, then closed the door for the night. - lol
I had that same thing done to me last week.
Have they ever took out the weatherstrips and then caulked the crack?
No, but they have caulked access panels shut.
Painters.........Kill em all! ( That do that kind of work) They are the bain of my existence.
...the pain of your existence?
I beg to differ, Mike. The guy I recommend for all of my painting work (also named Mike) is almost anal about that sort of thing. He's all about prep work being the basis of a good paint job and I always tell customers to not expect him to just walk in and open the paint can.
I've had a few customers tell me that they had no idea of what makes a good paint job until they had watched Mike in action. - lol
Dave
.......not expect him to just walk in and open the paint can.
........no idea of what makes a good paint job......
Exactly, any shmoe can slap the paint on, its knowing what to do before that time that makes or breaks a good job.
My ex-MIL always did the paint work for their rental property, she thought she was a painter, made me laugh thinking about the crappy job she always did. She'd walk into a rental unit, open up the can, dip the brush in and start right in. Quality work she did!
I dont have the paitience to be a good painter, know what it takes and am able to do it but not for extended periods of time. My hats off to the guy that can do the prep work because thats what makes a good painter.
Doug
I'm actually a fairly decent painter and do all the interior painting in my house. I don't like it well enough (and I'm probably not good enough) , however, to do it for a customer.
When they ask about painting, I just hand them Mike's card. - lol
There are true professionals in every trade. It seems to me that a lot of the painters I have come across lately have been guys how can't do anything else. I also think it is a trade that has been devalued over time. A good professional paint job is going to cost ALOT of money, and most of the cost is in the labor. My customers see Trading Spaces and all those other shows and say "That costs how much?" I tell all people who ask, if you want your home to look as good as it can, and you want my work to look as good as it can, hire a PROFESSIONAL painter. The prep, application, and fit and finish with crisp, clean lines is worth every penny. Most say, "I'll just have a painting party". We all know where that ends up. Looking like you had a painting party. I have nothing against professional painters, I have everything against some guy with a Honda and a paint brush calling himself a professional painter. Ok I'll get off my soapbox now..........
My painter drives a E-250 van :-).
They are very good about keeping paint off of what it should not be on, but also has a laborer who spends hours cleaning paint off of stuff, sanding, etc.
The thing about painting is that everyone thinks they know how to paint. To me having a good painter is just as important as having a good trim man or anything else... I've seen HO paint jobs that could "gag a magot" - borrowed that one from my dad - God rest his soul. Part of the problem is that a lot of people just don't know what looks like cr@p. That's why when I get a reference of a sub, I always prefer to look at the work in person, especially if the reference is from a HO.
No - the best thing is when the painter removes the weather strips and then a helper comes along and caulks the slots that the weather strip fits in. I've this happen 2 or 3 times. Painter always says the same thing "WE didn''t do that. Musta been someone else". And my response "Yea right. I'll inspect it when you finish repairing the damage..." :-)
Do you find the same thing and feel the same way about mortice for the knob strikes and the piece that goes around the "barrel" or whatever you call it?
I do.
I often see the 1" hole thats drilled to except the "barrel" (I dont know what its called either) get loose after a while and that makes for a sloppy door. That usually happens in cheaper doors though, not in solid wood.
I prefer to mortice out the esccusion plate for the barrel, just looks better to me. Now I should clear that up a bit, I've installed the "drill the 1 inch hole - slam the barrel in, slap the knobs on, put a couple screws in and walk away" but in the houses we normally do that isnt what the customer is paying for.
Maybe 99 out of 100 people wont even notice the square corners on the hinges/esccusion plates but its the first thing I notice when I look at a door. Its all in the details!
I wont go so far as to say that my way is right, just that its the way I prefer to do it. I dont think there is a right/wrong way, just a prefered way, or for me, a prefered look!
And I'd never suggest that the 1" hole is somehow inferior to the esccusion plate, because I dont think it is.
Doug
Doug -
I've seen some latchsets that don't use that plate over the barrel striker. I can't recall the brand, but the barrel has ribs that give a press fit into a 1" hole. They seem ok, but they "look funny" to me. - lol
Dave,
Some Schlage sets come with a square plate on the barrel that can be pop off and replaced with a rounded one or removed all together and inserted into the hole with a plastic bushing to keep it tight. Not that I advocate doing that.
Doug:
Most all the doors used on houses around here are prehung. Not only are the hinges pre mortised but they are pre-bored and the barrel plate with the 2 screws or escussion as you called it, and the strike pre-mortised too. That includes solid core and solid wood doors. Granted I haven't done any million dollar shacks, but I think it's a regional thing too. I've read here at BT that in some places it is more common to actually "hang" the doors, and also that in some places they don't use split jamb pre-hung doors, even on less expensive homes.
So, I've never seen a barrel escussion that wasn't mortised in. I've also never seen lock sets that didn't have the escussion with 2 screws on the barrel. Maybe my experience is somewhat limited on this topic.
Matt
I've read here at BT that in some places it is more common to actually "hang" the doors, and also that in some places they don't use split jamb pre-hung doors, even on less expensive homes.
On most of the houses that we do we hang the doors. That is we buy just the doors and make our own jambs, mortice, hang...........
Since I have been back in Iowa I havent seen a prehung door, of course thats because I have been limited to three houses! These are houses with trim packages of $750K plus.
I've only known of one place around here that uses the split jambs and thats a track builder. I'm sure there are others but none that I'm aware of.
BTW, I've installed a lot of those split jambs for the track builder. I think there a fine door as long as there shimmed properly. I know Gary Katz says that you dont have to but I consider that hack work even in a track home.
I'm sure your right about the regional differences. I'm sure that in the less expensive homes(by less expensive I dont mean cheap) that the doors are prehungs. As far as how they are morticed for harware I'm guessing that can probably be done in almost any fashion imaginable.
Doug
Shimming of doors is a big thing with me. It's one way I quickly identify what kind of trim carp I am dealing with. Even if pres Bush said not shimming is OK, I'd still have a strong opinion for shimming. :-)
Regarding houses with $750 trim packages - WOW! - did I understand that right? I guess it makes for good job security when it takes 9 months to trim a house... We used to have a guy here form Texas - Ed I'm thinking was his name, who did that kind of stuff. Posted some awesome pics. You guys would get along good.
The most expensive home I've ever been in around here was roughly $5 mil. Maybe that would have a $750k trim package? Maybe not. Not sure what kind of doors it had, but I know for a fact that the $mil homes my co builds have pre-hungs although sometimes they are not pre-cased.
Regarding houses with $750K trim packages - WOW! - did I understand that right?
Yes and I've been in a few that were double that.
I accidently walked into a house in Austin that had a trim package that had already reached 5 mil and they wernt done yet. I wish I had my camera with me that day but I probably would have been shot trying to take pictures! Some of the most beautiful milwork/trim work that I'd ever seen in my life. It was hard for me to focus on the measly 2 million dollar house that I was supposed to be working on.
I guess it makes for good job security when it takes 9 months to trim a house...
9 months doesnt get the job done, more like 12-14 months.
I'm involved in a theater room thats gonna be close to 1/4 mil. This house has been going on for well over a year. We were drilling tapcons in the floor the other day and one guy said, "man this concrete is hard, hell its a new house!" other guys says, "that concrete has been there for 2 years" its not all that new anymore!
I think I remember the guy from TX that you're refering to. Wasnt his call name Brisketbean? I was going to go up to Salado TX to see one of the houses that he was working on, got tied up and never did get there.
In Austin TX there are 10 mil. places that are going up just for weekend get-aways. I'm sure there are much more expensive ones up in the Teaton Mt's area. Probably some near you and your just not aware of them.
Hell this is Iowa, we arnt exactly known as big spenders!
Doug
I wouldn't be suprised if this horse barn we are roofing is not gonna exceed 1.5 Mil. All stained T&G 2x6 roof decking exposed inside. All Framing sanded and stained, I need to get some inside pics.
I bet the stalls have Broadband internet and Satellite TV...LOLInmate # 40735 At Taunton Federal Penitentiary.
I bet the stalls have Broadband internet and Satellite TV...LOL
Dont laugh, its probably true!
There are a few of those barns around here. The house that I worked on right before leaving to move to TX had a horse barn that exceeded 2 mil!
My BIL sold a piece of land to a well know billionaire and he built a horse barn that they say probably cost 5 mil. The whole interior was cherry, horses never walked on dirt, some sort of rubber matt. They were deffinetly living better then me.
Hell I worked on this complex down in Austin that had a garge cost 1.5 mil. Probably 8 buildings on the lot, all costing more then most nice houses. Hell the boat house was loaded with teak cabinetry. I love these people with money, sure takes the boredom out of things.
You might be way low on the projection of the barn, hell you guys are known for horsing around, you probably got the real expensive ones!
I probably am guessing way low,I didn't want to sound like I was exaggerating, the costs. And I really don't know, for sure, what all is going on there..It's a big damm barn for sure.
I saw them digging footings for the next one, just across the main drive way. There is $$$ in them horses man. Amazes me.Inmate # 40735 At Taunton Federal Penitentiary.
Yea I grew up working in barns, never saw anything like these horse barns.
I think you'd be amazed, or already are amazed, at what some of these things cost just to put a damn horse in.
Obviously your in an area where raising horses is much more prevalant then here but we do have a few fancy horse barns around.
I never knew that there was so much money in horses, must be cause personally I know of 6 or 7 places with horse barns sitting around that cost in excess of 1-2 mill.
BTW, today is nice and sunny, wife went to her parents for the weekend and I'm going over to my storage unit and finish crateing up that lath, hope you havent needed it!!! It will be on its way sometimes this week.
Doug
Yeah, I gotta get out side and get ready for lawn cutting season, pick up all the trash and tree bits..ugh.
I almost got that HF lathe, but I held off, so whenevr it gets here is fine, no big hurry, but I am about to lose the place I had set aside for it, by piling yet more junk in the shop..LOL
Thanks Doug.Inmate # 40735 At Taunton Federal Penitentiary.
but I am about to lose the place I had set aside for it, by piling yet more junk in the shop
In my best Bobcat Golthwaith imitation," I dont need that kind of presure!"
Doug
Around here one is called the strike plate and the other the latch, or backset.
Thanks.
Remember before you pick your radius that you'll need the right jig, collar, and bit to do the job. If you decide to go for the big morticing bit, best to just double-check that your router-base handles a bit/collar that size.
In either case, may I suggest buying a HSS bit only for morticing (i.e. not carbide, this is one job where sharpness and crispness of cut are more important than wear). I often use a ½" HSS omsrud down-spiral.
Phill Giles
The Unionville Woodwright
That would be "bane"
And I agree with doug and others about preferring the look of square corner hinges. rounded corners just save you a few seconds per door in chisel time. Everybody needs more chisel time anyway.
zak
"When we build, let us think that we build forever. Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone." --John Ruskin
"so it goes"
Like the rest, I prefer the square. I have mostly rounded in my house because of the choice to go with ph doors. Good 6p doors though. The house while solidly built (now anyways), isn't schmancey enough to worry about those details, nor will it ever be.I love it when I see the markings of a hand cut mortise, like the tiny over cut of a sharp chisel, and it fits perfect. The other one is when you see the knife mark layouts on hand cut dovetails and the over bite of a fine back saw.When I set hinges, I hog out with a router freehand to within a 1/16" of all deeply scored edges, and then do the rest by hand. Never bought one of the jigs, made a few and they worked fine, but I still prefer to do it the way I do. Muscle memory likes to be used I guess.
Yes, "bane" sorry. My spellin' not too good sometimes.