FHB Logo Facebook LinkedIn Email Pinterest Twitter X Instagram Tiktok YouTube Plus Icon Close Icon Navigation Search Icon Navigation Search Icon Arrow Down Icon Video Guide Icon Article Guide Icon Modal Close Icon Guide Search Icon Skip to content
Subscribe
Log In
  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Restoration
  • Videos
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House
  • Podcast
Log In

Discussion Forum

Discussion Forum

Electrical Generator Q

FrankTate | Posted in Energy, Heating & Insulation on June 17, 2010 07:24am

I have the opportunity to purchase a diesel generator.  The output is 240/416 3ph 400Hz and 120/204 3ph 400Hz.  I know I can drop the 3ph down to 1ph for the house, but my question is…what is the difference between the regular household frequency of 60Hz and the generator output at 400Hz?  I figure it makes a difference, but don’t know how.  Can you all help me out?

Thanks!

Reply
  • X
  • facebook
  • linkedin
  • pinterest
  • email
  • add to favorites Log in or Sign up to save your favorite articles

Replies

  1. Norman | Jun 17, 2010 10:26am | #1

    Your clocks are going to run real fast

    Most AC devices get their speed from the frequency of the signal, so everything with a motor is going to run about 7 times faster. Your lights are now going to flash 7 times faster. I am sure that others will know more than I, but this doesn't sound good at all.

  2. gfretwell | Jun 18, 2010 04:01pm | #2

    This is unusable in it's present state. You could ask a motor shop what they can do with the generator head (swap it out or rewind it). The engine is the only valuable part at this time.

  3. junkhound | Jun 18, 2010 05:37pm | #3

    6 diodes at about $14 ea gives you 270 Vdc.

    a 270VDC to 120vac 60 Hz costs about $50 per kw - see if you cand find an inverter.

    HOwever, even needing to ask the question means you will need to likely hire somebody for big $$ to hook it up???

    Do yu know how to wire a 6 ple 3 phase bridge? 

    Just about anything you have that is modern electronics will run fine on 120 vac 400 hz,

    BUT - yur motors will run at 10,000 rpm or more on 400 Hz though and soon burn up.  (<10 minutes) -- eg. fridge, furnance fan, dishwasher, freezer, air compressor,

    your universal motor tools (drill, shop vac, vacuum cleaner, skilsaw, etc.)  will run OK on 400 hz but a bit hotter.

  4. DanH | Jun 18, 2010 06:26pm | #4

    400 Hz can be used to power standard lightbulbs (not fluorescent), and simple resistance heaters (eg, toasters, space heaters) that do not have electronic controls.  It won't (safely/effectively) power any sort of motor, device with a transformer or ballast, or device containing complex electronics.

    1. junkhound | Jun 19, 2010 12:31pm | #5

      It won't (safely/effectively) power any sort of........ device containing complex electronics.

      ya wanna rethink that comment? 

      actually have a 400Hz generator at home, would not hesitate to plug any of my own electronics that do not include an induction motor into it.

      any fluorescent light with an electronic ballast will run just fine also.

      however, would not expect original poster to know ow to check for that. 

      1. DanH | Jun 19, 2010 10:54pm | #6

        The power supplies of most electronic devices are "tuned" to 50/60 Hz.  You are right that it likely so happens that many of these would, somewhat by accident, function OK on 400 Hz, but I woudn't want to bet a piece of equipment worth several thou on this accident being true.

        In particular, any device containing a line voltage transformer is likely to malfunction (if it isn't, in fact, damaged).  Devices with switching power supplies would PROBABLY be OK, but you never know when the designer may have, eg, used the 60 Hz to "clock" some part of the logic.

        1. junkhound | Jun 20, 2010 08:33am | #7

          ""any device containing a

          ""any device containing a line voltage transformer is likely to malfunction (if it isn't, in fact, damaged).  ""

          Please 'educate' me regarding that comment..  I want to learn, so airplanes with lots of 400 Hz equipment dont fall out of the sky.     Remember, we are discussing the limited case of plugging a xfmr designed for 50-60 Hz, 120 Vac into 120 Vac, 400 Hz. 

          recall that V=N*B*A*w

          So, any core for 60 Hz 120 Vac will see less than 2.7kG flux density, zero chance of satruation.

          Granted, core losses are a power function (cube in some cases) of frequency, but also an inverse power function of flux density (square or cube, depending on material, lamination thickness, etc.) 

          For a typical 60 Hz xfmr with 12 mil silicon iron, the core losses are only 1/2 at 400 Hz vs. 60 Hz assuming a 60 Hz designed xfmr plugged into 400 Hz.  The xfmr is more efficient at 400 Hz. 

          Unless you get to big whomping 100 kVA, skin effect on copper is negligible.

          PD damage is zero for 120 Vac to chassis in either case.

          Tell me what I'm missing, or do you just spout out some of your replies without thinking about them or without a complete knowledge base ?  Bill stays away these days, so somebody needs to cut down on the BS inaccuracies.  <G>

          1. DanH | Jun 20, 2010 09:36am | #8

            The transformer coils are more efficient at 400 Hz.  The core isn't.  The typical 60 Hz laminated core will overheat at 400 Hz, due to hysteresis loses.  At the higher frequency you need thinner laminations, or some other material.

          2. junkhound | Jun 20, 2010 10:14am | #9

            No, you are not considering all factors or are simply not aware of how transformers are designed. .

            You need to go read some core material specifications and basic physics.  Core losses (watts heating) for a xfmr designed for 60 Hz will be approx 1/2 level that when run at 400 Hz.   Remember; flux density = volts / (core area* number of turns*radian frequency; in SI units naturally) 

            Then look up core losses for 2.7 kG at 400 Hz vs 18 kG at 60 Hz for silectron or any other material and compare  ....

            At the higher frequency you need thinner laminations -- true if you are trying to run the core at near saturation levels, not if the core is at 1/7 of the design flux density as it is for a 60 Hz xfmr pluggedd into 400 Hz. 

            Every once in awhile you seem 'to just shoot from the hip' in reflex responses or something - engineering is not like liberal politics, where you can just wish something were true even though it is not ??  Have you ever actually run any power circuits at 400 Hz? 

            Also, due to slight skin and proximity effects at 400Hz, transformer COILs are Less efficient (very slightly higher losses) at 400 Hz everything else being equal.

          3. DanH | Jun 20, 2010 10:26am | #10

            The thickness of the laminations doesn't have that much to do with saturation -- eddy currents can form at any level of saturation.

          4. junkhound | Jun 20, 2010 12:57pm | #11

            Of course, eddy currents form anytime there is any magnetic field and a conductor

            However, Please read the following link on the relationship between eddy currents and flux density.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddy_current

            In the equations provided there, you will notice that B and f are both square functions.  The BF product is thus the same for 60 and 400 Hz, so eddy current losses remain constant for the case we are considering.

            Hysterysis losses - need those need to be explained also. 

            Lessons finished for the day...

          5. FrankTate | Jun 21, 2010 06:18am | #12

            Thank you

            for the lessons gentlemen.  You are quite correct that I would be hiring someone for big $$$ to convert and hook the beast up for me.  So this "opportunity" will just have to pass.

  5. FrankTate | Jun 22, 2010 06:51am | #13

    Youse guys did

    and helped me out!

  6. Amish Electrician | Jun 27, 2010 01:44pm | #14

    This thread ought to be posted and framed, required reading for anyone who wants a generator.

    "I have an opportunity to purchase ...." is the opening line of the classic generator tragedy story. In no other area -not even cheap used cars- can I more stronglt make the point that you ought not buy someone else's troubles.

    Generators are quite specific for their application. Almost like buying shoes- the wrong size or style and you're made very unhappy, very fast.

    Even when the generator is suitable for the application, it's critical that it be maintained and operated regularly. Associated equipment -the sound package, the transfer switch, etc.- is essential. Buying a generator without them is like buying shoes without laces.

    Generators seem quite the fad these days. Yet, most folks NEED a generator as much as a fish needs a bicycle. Power interruptions? So what? Only a century ago, most homes were completely without electricity. Most of the gizmos we use had yet to be invented.

    1. gfretwell | Jun 28, 2010 12:29pm | #15

      A century ago your pump had a handle on it and you didn't have a freezer full of food.

      1. Scott | Jun 28, 2010 11:01pm | #17

        I think one's position on this should be based on the credibility and track record of one's local poco. We live in the boonies, and it gets good and cold here, but in ten years the longest power outage we've had is about three hours.

        Hence, I've got a 5kw genset that will power the well pump or a few lights and appliances. The wood stove is our usual source of heat anyway.

        If the poco's track record had multi-day or week outages I would have preprared differently.

        1. DaveRicheson | Jun 29, 2010 06:26am | #18

          The ice storm that hit Ky last year was real wake up call for many here. Prior to that we were hit with the rements of the Ike hurricane.  Ike was a warm weather event and even with 2000+ workers restoring service it was a two week ordeal, The ice storm sent thousands of people to shelters and even with 3500+ people working it took almost a month to restore.

          I worked  the first two weeks of the ice storm 24/7 and the last two weeks on 16 hr shifts. My family had no power except a small 2Kw portable generator for ten days. That was eneough to keep the refrigerators and a few lights on. heat was one wood  burning stove and that only kept things habitable in the family room and kichen of the inlaws house.

          The county emergency shelter  was only large enough for 60 people. that was the FEMA/Homeland Security approved plan and no amount of common sense could change it. We had two schools that did not loose power and could have easily handled the 200 people that were seeking shelter. The same senerio played out in counties throughout KY. Fortunately most municiple governments stepped in and found  shelters on thier own because the Feds failed miserably.

          It was an extremely frustrating time for those of us working the storm. our families were at risk and we could do nothing specically for them because we had thousands to try to get power to.

          That was a wake up call for me. I won't be caught like that agian.

          1. DanH | Jun 29, 2010 06:50am | #19

            The problem is, in most areas of the country you only see an event like that maybe once every 20 years.  The cost to purchase, install, and maintain a large generator that's used once every 20 years swamps the expenses associated with a single event.

          2. DaveRicheson | Jun 29, 2010 03:45pm | #20

            A 17Kw Generac generator at HD is $3499 and includes the transfer switch. NG or propane.

            My price is a little better and I'll install it myself. I use propane for my shop and DW studio for heat so the tank is already there.

            All in all it is cheaper than most good used cars. I'm on a rural electric service and over the last 8 years we have had to use a portable generator at least 5 times for three or more days. Fortunately all but the ice storm occured in mild weather so the inconvienience was minor.

            Durring the windstorm and ice storm we were scrambling to furnish very large generators to many municipalities. We lost transmission tower as well as distribution poles,transformers and such. Like most utilities nationwide we don't keep a large enventory of those items on hand, so it takes longer to restore service than it did say 20 years ago. That is also the reason utilities pool thier physical and manpower resources durring major events. 

            One of the funny things that occurred durring the 08 windstorm was a critical fuel shortage durrin the first three days. the fuel treminals lost power and did not have adequate emergency generators to load out fuel trucks. Hundreds of gas stations and service marts were also without power. There was plenty of fuel in tanks. Just no way to pump it. By day three we were having fuel trucked in  from outside the damaged area, just to keep the several hundred vehicles ours and our co- utilities fleets in service.

            I 've seen way to many 20 and 100 year events occure in the last 25 years working for a utlity company to have much faith in the statistic or averages. $3500 is cheap insurance over the next 25 years.

          3. DanH | Jun 29, 2010 04:57pm | #21

            It's one thing if you can have a three day event every year or two.  But many buying the fancy units rarely are out of power for more than 15 minutes twice a year (if even that).  When you consider that a unit that's been sitting untested/unserviced for 2-3 years is apt to be useless, and when you consider that many people don't even change the oil in their cars on any sort of decent interval, for most people a standby generator is a waste of money (if not outright dangerous).

    2. DaveRicheson | Jun 28, 2010 12:35pm | #16

      Generators seem quite the fad these days. Yet, most folks NEED a generator as much as a fish needs a bicycle. Power interruptions? So what? Only a century ago, most homes were completely without electricity. Most of the gizmos we use had yet to be invented

      That statement is a littel over the top.

      So you are saying just tough it out for a week or more while the utility repairs downed lines and restores your power?

      Most home today don't have auxillary heat, root cellars and coal oil lanterns. Without backup power you may as well back your family up and go to the closest shelter,...then hope you get there early enough to not be turned away and sent somewhere else.

      Of course when you do get back to your home you will have plenty to survive on in the way of non-parishable food you stocked for just such emergencies.

      As a society we have proven we are not prepared to atke care of very large numbers og people that need shelter and care durring natural disasters. FEMA has blown it everytime they have been called on.

      I'll count on me to take care of my family, immediate and extented. That is why I'm building with an 18K kw generator in the budget.

    3. User avater
      Jeff_Clarke | Jul 02, 2010 08:17am | #22

      Generators

      Power interruptions? So what?

      So:  your food doesn't spoil

      So:  your security system works

      So:  your basement doesn't have a foot of water in it, ruining everything

      So:  you can continue with your life for 30 hours (like we did) in the last storm (March 2010) while your neighbors are going down to see FEMA for help.

      After 3 years I'd say someone would have to pry our Generac 16KW out of my cold lifeless hands ;o)

      <eta - So:  you can run your NEIGHBOR'S sump pump as well, with 300' of HD extension cord>

  7. User avater
    MarkH | Jul 02, 2010 11:28am | #23

    Perhaps you're right, but that windstorm from hurricane Ike took my power down for almost a week.  I have a 5hp 1850 watt old generator that cost me $75 used.  Problem was no gas anywhere, but I had enough in the vehicles to get by.

    I had a fan, nice bright lights, cold food, a microwave, tv reception, etc.  Fortunately that was all I required, but I could have had heat if it was winter, or maybe a small airconditioner if it was deathly hot.

    I'm glad to have that little guy, and have considered getting a small size stationary natural gas unit installed. 

    Also there was a guy on tv that had to have electrical power for medical reasons or he would have died.  A neighbor ran a cord to his machine, the man was crying and saying how thankful he was to have a neighbor like that.  Of course the neighbor said he wasn't a hero, just a guy that spared a little power to a neighbor in need.

  8. FrankDuVal | Jul 02, 2010 01:51pm | #24

    I don't care if it is only $100 worth of food. My family MIGHT want to eat something in five days. Why not eat what's in the freezer being kept cold by a generator? Our generation does not "home can", we freeze. Go out to eat? Typically impractical in ice storms for the first few days. Also, when hurricane Isabel rolled through the city of Richmond, it was hard to eat out since there was almost a city wide loss of power and therefore WATER service! We went there to deliver a generator to my dad as we had an extra, and some more fuel. Finally found a restaurant open about 8 miles out of town. 

    Even people living and working in downtown Richmond were without power for a week! Now that may never happen again... But, this is only the mild effect of Isabel, just ask people living between Richmond and the Atlantic ocean how long their power was off, including the cities of Norfolk, Williamsburg and VA Beach.

    Water in the basement is a problem if you do not live on a sloping lot where you can perimeter drain to daylight. Most of the systems in this area drain the underslab and perimeter to a sump pump. No power, water is comming in. Or you don't build a basement. I have a sloping lot, a requirement of mine when lot shopping, so I don't have the problem. But any house with an outside stairwell accessing the basement must pump up, as it is illegal now to dump that water into the sewer, or daylight drain. Remember, hurricane means loss of power when there is lots of water to deal with. No small summer shower here.

    The other water concern here is we are on a well, one without a handle for pumping! It is nice to flush toilets. Even nicer to take a hot shower after clearing the driveway and cutting up trees. But that is not a necessity.

    Heat is also real handy in the winter to keep the people and pipes from freezing.

    But I highly agree location, location, location will determine if a generator will ever really be used, or be ready to use if the occasion arises. It is not a one size fits all solution for the average person. But hey, who here is average?

    Frank DuVal

  9. junkhound | Jul 02, 2010 06:27pm | #25

    folks NEED a generator

    You BET. The question is how many.

    I only got 6*, 12kW, 4kW, 3.5kW, 1500W, 1.2kW, and a 4kW 400 Hz. ... looking to find another at a garage sale this summer.

    Never can have too many of a good thing. Only one I did not use last year was the 400 Hz.

    *Well actually 7, if you count the 800Adc Lincoln welder on V4 wisconsin engine.

  10. User avater
    Jeff_Clarke | Jul 03, 2010 02:49pm | #26

    Basement is fixed

    There are areas like ours (boulder fields/terminal moraine/high bedrock) where even a 'fixed' basement can be overwhelmed by groundwater in extreme conditions (Hurrican Floyd for example - we got 8" rain in 8 hours).   It's a house, not a boat.   House nearby had $100,000 + damage in basement flooded to 2' ... several houses had basements flooded to 6'.   I prefer Generac to FEMA thank you very much!

    1. gfretwell | Jul 03, 2010 05:04pm | #28

      I never understood the basement thing. Even when I was in Maryland, where basements were the norm, I insisted that the house I bought/built had a grade level walk out so water could not accumulate. As predicted, I never had a water problem. Everyone I know with a basement has had a water problem of one kind or another.

      Here in Florida, therre are no basements and I don't miss it.

      1. User avater
        Jeff_Clarke | Jul 03, 2010 05:53pm | #29

        Florida, generally, has sandy soil that drains well.

        Our house has an 18th century stone foundation and it was built, literally, inside a 'bowl' of diabase bedrock.   This diabase, which the excavators around here call 'blue jingle' because the quarries (somehow!) manage to crush it into gravel for drainage coursing and it's so frickin' hard it actually 'jingles' one stone against the next.

        So picture your house sitting inside a cereal bowl, with a network of mission-critical sump pumps to take care of any 'fill-ups' in the bowl.   Leaders all drain to daylight just over the edge of the bowl so they're not a problem.

  11. User avater
    Jeff_Clarke | Jul 03, 2010 02:49pm | #27

    Basement is fixed

    There are areas like ours (boulder fields/terminal moraine/high bedrock) where even a 'fixed' basement can be overwhelmed by groundwater in extreme conditions (Hurrican Floyd for example - we got 8" rain in 8 hours).   It's a house, not a boat.   House nearby had $100,000 + damage in basement flooded to 2' ... several houses had basements flooded to 6'.   I prefer Generac to FEMA thank you very much!

  12. Tim | Jul 08, 2010 02:53pm | #30

    Out in the country

    is a special case, as you mentioned.

    Water is supplied by a well and the tank will provide a days worth if rationed. Modern water heaters, furnaces and boilers, all require electric power to operate. In the midwest, power is more likeley to be lost for an extended period of time due to winter storms, when heat is necessary. I do not have a generator, I do live out in the country and I have lost power for several days on many occassions, probably on the average of about once every two years. Usually, two to three days at a time, sometimes more.

    If I stayed at a hotel in town every time it happened, the cost of small generator would have easily been worth it. Otherwise, the frequency and consequences are not that sever, in my circumstance. BUT, I would still love to have one.

Log in or create an account to post a comment.

Sign up Log in

Become a member and get full access to FineHomebuilding.com

Video Shorts

Categories

  • Business
  • Code Questions
  • Construction Techniques
  • Energy, Heating & Insulation
  • General Discussion
  • Help/Work Wanted
  • Photo Gallery
  • Reader Classified
  • Tools for Home Building

Discussion Forum

Recent Posts and Replies

  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
View More Create Post

Up Next

Video Shorts

Featured Story

Rescuing Old Hardware

Whether it’s already in your house or picked up at a flea market, vintage hardware almost always needs help.

Featured Video

How to Install Cable Rail Around Wood-Post Corners

Use these tips to keep cables tight and straight for a professional-looking deck-railing job.

Related Stories

  • Fight House Fires Through Design
  • Making the Move to Multifamily
  • Custom Built-ins With Job-Site Tools
  • An Easier Method for Mitered Head Casings

Highlights

Fine Homebuilding All Access
Fine Homebuilding Podcast
Tool Tech
Plus, get an extra 20% off with code GIFT20

"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Fine Homebuilding Magazine

  • Issue 332 - July 2025
    • Custom Built-ins With Job-Site Tools
    • Fight House Fires Through Design
    • Making the Move to Multifamily
  • Issue 331 - June 2025
    • A More Resilient Roof
    • Tool Test: You Need a Drywall Sander
    • Ducted vs. Ductless Heat Pumps
  • Issue 330 - April/May 2025
    • Deck Details for Durability
    • FAQs on HPWHs
    • 10 Tips for a Long-Lasting Paint Job
  • Issue 329 - Feb/Mar 2025
    • Smart Foundation for a Small Addition
    • A Kominka Comes West
    • Making Small Kitchens Work
  • Issue 328 - Dec/Jan 2024
    • How a Pro Replaces Columns
    • Passive House 3.0
    • Tool Test: Compact Line Lasers

Fine Home Building

Newsletter Sign-up

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox.

  • Green Building Advisor

    Building science and energy efficiency advice, plus special offers, in your inbox.

  • Old House Journal

    Repair, renovation, and restoration tips, plus special offers, in your inbox.

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters

Follow

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X

Membership & Magazine

  • Online Archive
  • Start Free Trial
  • Magazine Subscription
  • Magazine Renewal
  • Gift a Subscription
  • Customer Support
  • Privacy Preferences
  • About
  • Contact
  • Advertise
  • Careers
  • Terms of Use
  • Site Map
  • Do not sell or share my information
  • Privacy Policy
  • Accessibility
  • California Privacy Rights

© 2025 Active Interest Media. All rights reserved.

Fine Homebuilding receives a commission for items purchased through links on this site, including Amazon Associates and other affiliate advertising programs.

  • Home Group
  • Antique Trader
  • Arts & Crafts Homes
  • Bank Note Reporter
  • Cabin Life
  • Cuisine at Home
  • Fine Gardening
  • Fine Woodworking
  • Green Building Advisor
  • Garden Gate
  • Horticulture
  • Keep Craft Alive
  • Log Home Living
  • Military Trader/Vehicles
  • Numismatic News
  • Numismaster
  • Old Cars Weekly
  • Old House Journal
  • Period Homes
  • Popular Woodworking
  • Script
  • ShopNotes
  • Sports Collectors Digest
  • Threads
  • Timber Home Living
  • Traditional Building
  • Woodsmith
  • World Coin News
  • Writer's Digest
Active Interest Media logo
X
X
This is a dialog window which overlays the main content of the page. The modal window is a 'site map' of the most critical areas of the site. Pressing the Escape (ESC) button will close the modal and bring you back to where you were on the page.

Main Menu

  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Video
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Popular Topics

  • Kitchens
  • Business
  • Bedrooms
  • Roofs
  • Architecture and Design
  • Green Building
  • Decks
  • Framing
  • Safety
  • Remodeling
  • Bathrooms
  • Windows
  • Tilework
  • Ceilings
  • HVAC

Magazine

  • Current Issue
  • Past Issues
  • Magazine Index
  • Subscribe
  • Online Archive
  • Author Guidelines

All Access

  • Member Home
  • Start Free Trial
  • Gift Membership

Online Learning

  • Courses
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Podcast

More

  • FHB Ambassadors
  • FHB House
  • Customer Support

Account

  • Log In
  • Join

Newsletter

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Follow

  • X
  • YouTube
  • instagram
  • facebook
  • pinterest
  • Tiktok

Join All Access

Become a member and get instant access to thousands of videos, how-tos, tool reviews, and design features.

Start Your Free Trial

Subscribe

FHB Magazine

Start your subscription today and save up to 70%

Subscribe

Enjoy unlimited access to Fine Homebuilding. Join Now

Already a member? Log in

We hope you’ve enjoyed your free articles. To keep reading, become a member today.

Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine.

Start your FREE trial

Already a member? Log in

Privacy Policy Update

We use cookies, pixels, script and other tracking technologies to analyze and improve our service, to improve and personalize content, and for advertising to you. We also share information about your use of our site with third-party social media, advertising and analytics partners. You can view our Privacy Policy here and our Terms of Use here.

Cookies

Analytics

These cookies help us track site metrics to improve our sites and provide a better user experience.

Advertising/Social Media

These cookies are used to serve advertisements aligned with your interests.

Essential

These cookies are required to provide basic functions like page navigation and access to secure areas of the website.

Delete My Data

Delete all cookies and associated data