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Elevations

NCYVT | Posted in General Discussion on July 22, 2009 04:20am

I have an issue right now with the grade of my land. Currently I have footings set for the foundation and I am told what was supposed to be a 9′ concrete wall for my basement due to road elevations and the excavator trying to keep the downhill side of the house walkout basement a reasonable grade to build on will now be 12’8″. The only other option I was given is to get a Jack hammer to remove ledge between the house wall and the road. I realize this may be a challenge to understand but let me know if there are any suggestions. or questions that I can try to clarify.

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  1. Hudson Valley Carpenter | Jul 22, 2009 04:56pm | #1

    O.K.  Despite the run-on sentence I did grasp the situation but what's the question? 

    If the question is whether or not to jackhammer the ledge, instead of adding 4+feet of height to the foundation, you'll have to get some bids on both yourself. 

    Just don't accept an estimate on the jackhammer work.  That could prove to be very expensive.

    Note: Take a message board composition lesson from the above.  Short sentences. Short paragraphs.  A lot of people won't read through your post because of the way it's constructed.  If I wasn't trying to avoid painting this morning, I wouldn't have read it either.

  2. User avater
    hammer1 | Jul 22, 2009 05:29pm | #2

    Somebody is off almost 4' on your excavation?? Better fire that person. Things don't make sense. How is a 12'8" foundation wall going to bring your walkout floor up to the necessary grade? You plan on filling it up? If this is indeed the situation, I'd fore go the walkout. No one can answer your question intelligently without seeing the site. There may be grading options but a 12'8" foundation wall isn't one of them.

    Beat it to fit / Paint it to match

  3. migraine | Jul 22, 2009 07:16pm | #3

    If I understand, you are only talking about the footin's toe or heal???  In theory, the footing size is figured with the height and width of the wall.  I imagine that the footing would be doubling in size and depth(quick guess, maybe not...).

    Jack hammering out the toe, or heal(ledge as you call it???) and enlarging it would not make it a continueous footing/pour/bond.

    No matter what you do, you need to contact the engineer that did the wall calculations.

    How about some pictures and a copy of the engineer's approved plans?  This would help.   I'm scratching my head...

     



    Edited 7/22/2009 12:18 pm by migraine

    1. NCYVT | Jul 22, 2009 11:09pm | #4

      Sorry, had gotten the news this morning and my head was spinning!  I realize I am not painting a great picture for any feedback, but my inexperience cripples me in this situation.

      My excavator has dug me too deep to allow for any less than a 12'8" wall on the frontside of my home. He was trying to help the grade in the backyard for a walkout basement. He had measured incorrectly and therefore I'm in a deep hole. On the front side of the house there is ledge preventing him from digging the front yard any lower for irragation purposes.  The only problem is we are down to ledge.  I see my only escape at this point is a an excavator jackhammer. I think my excavator should fit the bill for this part of the project but we'll see how that conversation goes. It comes down to him making a mistake with his measurements.  I am not looking to play basketball in my basement?! I hope this clarifies my situation. Any ideas?

      1. john7g | Jul 22, 2009 11:57pm | #5

        I can't remember for sure but I think a 12'-8" wall is going to require engineering paperwork under most of the IRC (max poured wall height of 10' ????).  but... what about moving forward with the tall wall and then float your slab on compacted fill inside the walls back up to your desired floor height?

        just a shot in the dark

      2. User avater
        CapnMac | Jul 23, 2009 01:47am | #7

        My excavator has dug me too deep

        Ok, I'm a simple person in the middle of Texas and all, but can't the excavator simply bring in some fill and compact it to the correct depth?

        Certainly sounds like he, the excavator, owes you either the cut or the fill, and the fill ought to be far cheaper than the cut, especially into exposed bedrock.

        Cellphone photo or the like might really help here.

        Question:   Do the engineer's drawings indicate where to benchmark the dig from?  Or, what did the GC say to use as a depth benchmark?  Was there no one there watching to ask, hey, aren't you a bit deep there?  Where did all the removed material go?  Around here, somebody pays for every trip the dumptruck makes.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)

        1. stevent1 | Jul 23, 2009 02:10am | #9

          If the footings are in, will a sheepsfoot compact the brought-in soil enough to equal undisturbed soil?Chuck Slive, work, build, ...better with wood

        2. Piffin | Jul 23, 2009 02:16am | #10

          A description of the excavator's work..."He was trying to help the grade in the backyard for a walkout basement. He had measured incorrectly and therefore I'm in a deep hole."This sounds like a conflicting statement to me.
          That he 'measured incorrectly' suggests that there was some sort of benchmark, but that he 'was trying to help...' suggests that he was turned loose to use his own best judgement.Somehow, methinks the OP is his own GC and is in the process of learning his first of many lessons in how GCs EARN their money 

           

          Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

          1. User avater
            CapnMac | Jul 23, 2009 07:37am | #11

            This sounds like a conflicting statement to me. That he 'measured incorrectly' suggests that there was some sort of benchmark, but that he 'was trying to help...' suggests that he was turned loose to use his own best judgement.

            Somehow, methinks the OP is his own GC and is in the process of learning his first of many lessons in how GCs EARN their money

            We are on similar pages here, but, I did not want to back the OP into a hole (sorry) of his own making, in case it wasn't.

            Was aksing in case it's a BiL who is the GC or FoF or the like.  Or, in case this is out beyond an AHJ, so it's caveat constructor or the like.

            Also, I'm not sure the footings are "placed" yet, just excavated--so there still may be time to get this "right."  Even though that's dicey work ahead of a deadline to reach engineered specifications for compaction with the hole only just now dug.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)

          2. Piffin | Jul 23, 2009 12:01pm | #12

            Yeah, all we can do is wait for answers to those critical questions.I for one, don't have much confidence that an excavator who overdigs that much (if indeed it was his fault) is capable of properly refilling and compacting it right.There are excavators who work miracles and are true genius tradesmen, and there are guys who just buy an excavator 'cause it seems the right thing to do, and never learn the machine or the soils. 

             

            Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

      3. Piffin | Jul 23, 2009 01:57am | #8

        Was he given clear information to do his work with or just a guess and point with a napkin sketch? Did he have elevation drawings for the plan referencing the site landmarks? Who is the General Contractor overseeing him? I wouldn't start to lay blame on him until I knew these answers.It really won't be a terrible thing to blast or jack hammer the ledge out, but I can't see it from here. 

         

        Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

      4. Bing187 | Jul 23, 2009 07:19pm | #13

        If I'm reading this right, I think the first problem is your excavator, if he can't see a ballpark difference between 8'-8" and 12'-8"......thinking this story has more telling to be done...anyhow

         

        If you need to get the basement elevation higher now, why not pour a frost wall, then stack a 4' wall on that, and compact fill inside that? Then you can pour an 8' wall on the front, everyone's happy. Only "drawback, if you want to call it that, is if I'm correct in how I picture this, your basement floor el will be 4' above grade at the rear....oh well. You had to have SOME vision of how the severe grade change on this lot would pan out after looking at a topo, right?

        At any rate, my point is that I would have a lot more faith in compaction inside a foundation, placed in 6" lifts and compacted, than I would have of him filling the whole thing back in and pouring foundation on that after compaction. CAN be done, but not as solid, imho.

        Good luck

        Bing

  4. Piffin | Jul 23, 2009 01:45am | #6

    "I realize this may be a challenge to understand"

    Pictures or drawings would help muchly

     

     

    Welcome to the
    Taunton University of
    Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
     where ...
    Excellence is its own reward!

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