My turn for a question. I’m redoing an 1880’s schoolhouse in NY. It is now a private residence. The building is roughly 25-28′ high at the peak, working on a gable end. Roof is 8 1/2 to 12 pitch. There were originally ornamental boards that were made from old tongue and groove about 7 inches wide. they ran from the rake down, about 32 inches under the flat roofs, but with the angle, they are about 42 inches long. The top sits against the bottom of the rake/soffit and is covered with 1×6. The bottom sits on a piece of full 1 x 12. Each board (I call them pickets) has an arrow point cut on the bottom, and a circle cut into the face on the seam about 10 inches up. (Can’t download a picture, just tried.) The seams are covered with shaped battens that stop about 16 inches from the bottom.
The question is what is the best material that could be used here. I am not real familiar with the newer manmade stuff – especially sheet goods. The siding under it is all 5 inch beveled cedar. I was going to use 1×8 pine, but it needs to be nearly clear, and would get a little expensive. I thought about getting a good exterior plywood and cutting the pickets from that. I wanted to do one full piece to cover the same distance as 12 (or so) pickets, but the waste because of the angle would be near half the sheet.
Anybody got any other ideas? Thanks for the help.
Replies
Hey
The front facade is it a gingerbread style or Victorian?
and you're talking about the rake trim or siding?
Redsox - The building is probably closest to a Stick Style, but they are all Victorians. It used to have half and quarter sunbursts too. They are long gone (just for kicks and jollies, I might try putting one of them back together).
In terms of the material that I'm trying to replace, it's actually between the top of the beveled cedar siding and the bottom of the rake/soffit. It's part of the siding, not the roof. It's vertical and is nailed to the wall sheathing. The pickets are nailed to a piece of 1 x 12 that runs parallel to the rake. Let's forget about insulation for the moment. You've probably seen some old houses where they do the first story in cedar, then switch styles when they get to the second story. Here, the cedar runs up to the bottom of the 1 x 12.
The bottom of the pickets are nailed on the face of the 1 x 12. Can you imagine a rake board 42 inches wide, made up of vertical boards? That's the start. Maybe a crude drawing looking at the face will help. (It's tough when you can't draw angles.)
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Roof is here
Soffit is here (18 inch deep overhang)
:
: : : Pickets are back here, against the sheathing.
: : : : :: : : : O: : : O :: : O : :: O : :_ _:O : :_ _: /: :_ _: / /:_ _: / Bottoms of pickets run parallel to roof
/ /
/ /
1 X 12 Angles up or Down parallel to Roof
***************
Beneath 1 x 12 is the Beveled Cedar Siding
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PROFILE-
HI I S K
HI I K
OUTSIDE BI I S K STUDS ( INSIDE OF STRUCTURE)
BI I K
BI I K
BI IJ JK
J JK
AS A PROFILE , BETWEEN THE I LETTERS ARE THE PICKETS, ON THE FACE AT THE SEAMS IS THE BATTEN (LETTER "B"), THE "J" AT THE BOTTOM IS THE 1 X 12, AND THE "K" REPRESENTS THE WALL SHEATHING. THE "H" REPRESENTS THE ACTUAL RAKE WHICH IS A PIECE OF 1 x 8 NAILED ON THE FACE OF THE PICKETS AGAINST THE ROOF. THE "S" REPRESENTS A SUPPORT BEHIND THE PICKETS.
I REALLY NEED TO LEARN HOW TO USE PAINTBRUSH! EITHER THAT OR GET SIMPLER QUESTIONS. <G>
I can't picture what you're describing... got a photo?... but it sounds like you need Medex exterior MDF. I've used it for some architectural detailing where sheet goods were needed. A chunk of it soaked in the sink for days barely swelled, and I treated all the exposed edges with epoxy sealer. I used 3/4" but I think you can get 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, 5/8, 3/4, and 1". Check with a sheet goods distributor.
David - Thanks for the suggestion. I tried to do a "drawing", if you want to call it that. I think you got an idea, even without the drawing. I'll check pricing with the yard tomorrow, and compare it against clear 1 x 8 and 3/4" exterior plywood. When you say you treated the edges with epoxy sealer, where does one get that? Is it from the MDF manufacturer, a paint store, lumber yard or someplace else?
I'm more frustrated with my inability to use the computer/scanner/ etc. than with the material. I will get a photo together, somehow, someday...
Don
For epoxy sealer I use Smith & Co. Clear Penetrating Epoxy. It mixes to the consistency of water and is easy to soak into the edges and ends of pieces. Use for paint grade only, not for something that will be clear finished, because it's not good under varnish. My source is rotdoctor.com, where it's re-branded but still easy to find on their site. I think it's a good product for sealing plywood or medex edges before they are painted... it soaks in much more than primer.
Now, about that drawing problem. I recently got a cheapie $120 drawing program called 'AutoSketch' and it's a blast. Easy to use... I basically did the three tutorials in the book and then started playing. I submitted my first permit package with my own CAD drawings last week. Now my problem is finding an affordable large format printer. There's no turning back!
Hey
I do a lot drawing for my client, I use AutoCad LT for the printer I've search every where, the large format plot are to expense so I spent $400 on HP 9800 inkjet it uses 11x17" paper. It works fine for me. If I needed a large print, OfficeMax will do, just bring the floppyD.
Mark Jack of all trades.................Master of none!
highjack warning,If you do find a source for a large format printer/plotter, let me know. I want one for maps. Thought I found one at a state govt auction, but the bidding got to high to justify going to N.J. to get it.
I've was thinking of something like T1-11, but that has random grooves and you'd want them evenly spaced vto look like boards. What about MDO ("signboard") that you could cut your decorative arrows at the bottom edge and also the holes and then add vertical battens evenly spaced?
Danno - T111 is too rough on the face. These pickets are going to be painted and I'd need to sand for a month to get it smooth. The gaps are also a bit wide and the battens don't go down to the bottom. ( By the way, I think T111 can be had with even spacing on the "boards".) As far as the MDO, what's the difference between that and the MDF that David suggested? Like I said, this newfangled stuff is confusing? (Thanks for the help.) Don
I'm thinking - use something that will be the same colour as you intend to paint it...it's gonna be a pig to redo it all in a couple years. Way up there use Trex or similar, with the colour right thru it.ciao for niao
To those who know - this may be obvious. To those who don't - I hope I've helped.
MDF is "medium density fiberboard" and is a particle board (like sawdust and glue) whereas MDO is "medium density overlay" which has a phenolic resin impregnated paper surface (over, some folks here say, plywood and that's what I remember, but others have said, particle board). MDO is very smooth and takes paint well, hense the name "signboard".
MEDEX might be OK under an overhang, but I recently wrapped a few posts with it and most of the joints failed after a year in the weather. All the joints were poly glued, and all seams were caulked. I think I would use MDO.