Replies

1. 
   durabond5 | Oct 29, 2004 09:39pm | #1

   You have the right idea to make the vinyl look better. It will also make the windows look way better. I would use 1x6 cedar with the rough side out and prime and paint it. You shouldn't have to wrap anything in aluminum. Use butt joints around windows and doors. The J-channel will cover the ends.  And if you have two windows close to each other, fill the space between them with a cedar board and then run your horizontal pieces across both of them.

2. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Oct 30, 2004 02:11am | #2

   We use 1x rough sawn spruce around here. It gives it a nicer look with custom colored trim.

   blue

    FRAMING ADVICE ALERT!!!! DON'T TAKE ANY FRAMING ADVICE FROM ME. I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT. IF YOU WANT GOOD FRAMING ADVICE, JUST ASK GABE. DON'T ASK ANYONE ELSE....JUST ASK GABE! REMEMBER, I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT FRAMING...I JUST BS ABOUT IT.

   END OF ALERT!
3. 
   calvin | Oct 30, 2004 02:47am | #3

   You might want to think about "blocking" the casings etc out a bit so the j-channel doesn't bury it, make it look too flush.  Remember to flash detail the trim pcs as vinyl even properly done could allow water in behind the wood.

   Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.

   Quittin' Time

4. 
   WayneL5 | Oct 30, 2004 04:09am | #4

   I used Trex to trim my home (though the siding is not vinyl).  It holds up really well.  There are a number of synthetic trim materials which will hold up much better than any type of wood.  Wood just needs lots of care to keep it looking good.

5. 
   kestrel | Oct 30, 2004 04:45am | #5

   You might consider Louisiana-Pacific's SmartSide.   It is a wood composite,  very stable (not like their old stuff that disolved), and easy to cut.  It takes paint well and paint should hold up.

   I put a small scrap in a jug of water almost 2 years ago and it is still intact, though the alge growth on it is rather gastly looking.

   http://www.lpcorp.com/products/products_detail.jsp?ProductGroupID=24&ProductID=387

   kestrel

6. 
   JeffBuck | Oct 30, 2004 04:55am | #6

   aztec.

   build it out and make a "dado" that'll hide the J.

   a nice look.

   Jeff

1. 
   durabond5 | Oct 30, 2004 04:51pm | #8

   When you create the dado, does that eliminate the use of J-channel. Do you just slide the ends of the siding into the dado? That sounds like a good idea, saving time cutting all the J.

1. 
   JeffBuck | Oct 30, 2004 07:28pm | #10

   I still use the J.

   Jeff

1. 
   truehaven | Nov 07, 2004 09:07pm | #16

   just read the the rest of the posts about the j

2. 
   CapnMac | Nov 09, 2004 10:48pm | #22

   Is is a dado, like on the right, or a rabbet like on the left?Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)

1. 
   JeffBuck | Nov 09, 2004 11:06pm | #23

   rabbit on the left ....

   Jeff

2. 
   truehaven | Nov 07, 2004 09:04pm | #15

   Jeff

   if you dado 5/4 material would you need to bother with a j?

7. 
   Woodbutcher | Oct 30, 2004 06:40am | #7

   If you're gonna use crap-I mean vinyl anyway.  Why bother with other trim materials?  I know that some of the vinyl siding companies offer quite an assortment of trim pieces with a built-in J channel  designed for just this application.  It wouldn't hurt to ask your supplier, and if they don't have it, ask a different supplier.

8. 
   fartherhome | Oct 30, 2004 07:05pm | #9

   use 5/4 pvc. no use using wood if your siding is vinyl.

9. 
   Piffin | Oct 31, 2004 01:38am | #11

   Azek

    

    

   Welcome to the
   Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
    where ...
   Excellence is its own reward!

10. 
    [email protected] | Oct 31, 2004 06:46am | #12

    I've just finished doing something similar to what you're looking for -- except for the final trim pieces, which I've decided to put on hold till winter has come and gone. I've built a 17x27 addition at the rear of my Victorian home and wanted something that looks good while meeting a rather tight budget. Went with vinyl in the end, but chose a "cedar shake" style that seems more typically used as decorative siding on gables. Looks great over the whole building, though!

    Anyway, to the point. Like you, I wanted to avoid the obvious tell-tale signs of vinyl, meaning J-channel everywhere, and to go with wider trim stock than what the vinyl manufacturers commonly provide. So I took 1x4 PT boards and ripped them to about a 2.75" width, then used them for trimming out all my windows, doors, rakes, eaves, and inside corners. Outside corners got 5" boards instead, for a wider look. I then installed the vinyl up to the edge of these boards (allowing the usual gap for expansion) -- without needing *any* J-channel.

    The final step will be to cover these PT boards with my final exterior trim, using full 1x4 and 1x6 painted lumber. Since they're full width, they'll overlap the vinyl and perform the same function as J-channel would have. I haven't made this step yet, but a few quick trials suggest it'll look quite nice.

    Saw a suggestion from someone else to consider Trex or other engineered products for the trim. I'd wondered about that; makes sense. Less maintenance in the long run, probably. Especially if they happen to make it in the exact color you're looking for! (Yes, unlikely.)

11. 
    sammcgee | Nov 01, 2004 03:19pm | #13

    thanks for all the replies.........I always get good suggestions here.  I like the idea of bumping out with the PT, running the siding, then overlapping with the finish trim. The only problem I would have, after I get to thinking about it, is at the corners where the bottom of the corners meet the frieze board. (Is that what you guys term it? The horizontal trim board at the bottom of the exterior wall)

    This would have to be bumped out also and flashed creatively.......

    thanks again for the ideas..........

    sam

12. 
    user-331077 | Nov 07, 2004 05:40pm | #14

    cedar looks good to me,  but not primed and painted, try  f and p stain on the rough side im fond of the redwood tone but other tones may be better w that hellish vinyl you are installing.

13. 
    dIrishInMe | Nov 08, 2004 01:19am | #17

    Alside a nation wide (I think) vinyl supplier has lineal (I think that is what they call it) that is basically a hollow vinyl 5/4 x 4 that comes with a built in J channel.  If someone wants to take the time and money, an all vinyl trim out can look very nice.  Check with different vnyl suppliers and see what they have to offer, but forget about the big boxes and most lumber yards becase they only stock the common stuff.

     

    Matt
14. 
    DanteO | Nov 08, 2004 03:25am | #18

    If you really want to use vinyl, then a great way to get a "real" wood look is use 5/4 Cedar or a 3/4" PVC product as others suggested.  Then rabbet  the trim 5/8" to completely eliminate the use of J-Channel.  I did a house last year where I put crown on the exterior head casing.  I left the returns of the casing 5/8" shy of the wall so the siding slid behind that as well.   

1. 
   sammcgee | Nov 09, 2004 04:29pm | #19

   I appreciate all the good suggestions...............I'll try to post a picture someday. I'm going with the cedar......:o)

   Again, what do you men term the trim piece at the bottom of an exterior wall? Frieze board?

   thanks

   sam

1. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Nov 09, 2004 04:30pm | #20

   We call that the belt.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, some of it is viewed as boogerin and not consistent with views of those who prefer to overbuild everything...including their own egos

   Additionally, don't take any political advice from me. I'm just a parrot for the Republican talking points. I get all my news from Rush Limbaugh and Fox and Friends (they are funny...try them out)!

2. 
   xMikeSmith | Nov 09, 2004 08:59pm | #21

   commonly "water table"Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

1. 
   dIrishInMe | Nov 10, 2004 02:11am | #24

   What is the proper name for a horizontal belt or band that is up higher on the wall?  See attached pic.Matt

1. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Nov 10, 2004 03:31am | #25

   That would be called a belt here in SE Michigan.

   If there is a belt at the lower level, that would also be called a belt. If it has a special drip molding it might be called a watertable.

   I've never heard anyone call the upper belt a water table.

   Wht the heck is a water table anyways? Theres no table. Theres no water. I don't get it.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, some of it is viewed as boogerin and not consistent with views of those who prefer to overbuild everything...including their own egos

   Additionally, don't take any political advice from me. I'm just a parrot for the Republican talking points. I get all my news from Rush Limbaugh and Fox and Friends (they are funny...try them out)!

2. 
   xMikeSmith | Nov 10, 2004 03:44am | #27

   a beltway is also described as a "stringcourse".. and a watertable is a "projecting stringcourse " to divert water..Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

3. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Nov 10, 2004 04:13am | #28

   Thats kinda what I've always known too Mike. A watertable is a small beveled/sloped lower member that throws the water away from the foundation. Metal drip edge has replaced most of it but I like the looks of most watertables.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, some of it is viewed as boogerin and not consistent with views of those who prefer to overbuild everything...including their own egos

   Additionally, don't take any political advice from me. I'm just a parrot for the Republican talking points. I get all my news from Rush Limbaugh and Fox and Friends (they are funny...try them out)!

4. 
   xMikeSmith | Nov 10, 2004 03:33am | #26

   matt.. as far as i know..

   in a masonry house.. that would be the "belt course".. in a wood sided house"beltway"

   i sure would like a good field guide to all of the terms for trim details.. mostly you have to pick them up here and there..

   most of the guides are on the line of Benjamin Asher... or American Vignola.. so formal that they don't address the common details we see so much of

   anyone got a good suggestion ?Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

5. 
   dIrishInMe | Nov 10, 2004 05:35am | #29

   Thanks Mike.Matt