Does anyone know whether you can use a festool Ct22 or Ct33 hepa vac for the new EPA RRP lead law.
I know it has a HEPA filter as well as another dust bag to catch the bigger stuff.
I forgot to ask during the class.
I called Festool and thier answer was not really that great, however I did call the EPA and they said that the vacum must have a HEPA filter, but mentioned nothing about any specifics about any specs or ratings
PS what do you folks think of this whole RRP thing anyway??
Ray
Replies
Festool Hepa Vac
Ray,
I read either at JLC or Remodeling earlier in the year that the Festool line currently does not really fall into the range of HEPA that the EPA "thinks" is fit for the new law's specs.
It was close- (as are these figures I remember) 99.5 for Festool, 99.6 to be in compliance.........(probably closer to 100 for both) of keeping particulates out of the exhaust. A case of not much vs. very little.
And a HEPA vac is not really what the EPA is looking for. The parts per million released into the air cannot be a certain number and a SUPER HEPA vac is what is required to reach that mark. Not all "hepa filter" vacs qualify (and some really don't quality) The filter itself doesn't make it.
I take the class in a couple weeks and will try to take better notes than those I didn't take while reading up on this mess.
And dig this, I think it was mentioned that the vac has to be approved by-EPA of which I don't think any are (why you didn't get the whole story when you asked the EPA)
Supposedly Eureka (again, memory) and another company have releases in the range of that initial EPA allowable limit.
So, what we do know ..........
we don't.
There are several bodies (organizations) that are pressing congress to delay the implementation of the RULES until :
there's a investigatory branch......people, to actually implement, monitor and enforce the rules.
the Govt. 's weatherization and insulation improvement programs don't clash with or severely affect the implementation (one hand not knowing what the other is doing).
and lets see.....................
a couple other reasons.
So, the jury is still out.
What do I think about it all?
I take great pains (tho not to the extremes of the EPA requirements) to limit damage, dust, etc and cleanup real good. This already adds dollars to the job. To do it the right way, will surely eclipse that.
The time to buy visqueen stock (and pollute the resultant universe with all the chemical downside of ) is now. Lets all remember how visqueen must be the worst to work over-slip and fall accidents will be increasing I'm sure.
I'm now trying to shop new liability insurers as StateFarm is getting out of the contractors policy issuing upon your next renewal date. Maybe they see the new light and don't want to expose themselves...........or Katrina blew them away.
At any rate, what will be the impact on all our Liability policies? Mold made an impact-they pulled anything mold out of most policies-except as a rider - maybe.
There's a nice debate going on over at BTC about the subject. And you'll find that everyone has an opinion.
Big question is can we market our new CLEAN services and keep our share while the tailgate unisured already anyway cut-throat operations fail in the attempt. Surely their already low low prices will be even lower in comparison.
Remember where you got this tho-
from a dumb carpenter.
Yeah I sort of already knew the answer.
I was really hoping if i had to spend soooooo much money on a vac why not one that can be for more than one purpose aka hooking it up to realy nice tools. But so it is.
The Guy at the EPA siad that they don't "approve " HEPA vacs. My real question to him was how does one get their vacum ie Festool tested for the proper specs and what are those specs. So far he has not been able to answer that question.
Is it a third party doing the testing or the Manufacturer that needs to adhere to certain specs... I don't know.
But we'll see.
I Know that Pullman Holt makes HEPA vacs that are ok for lead removal, just like Festool they are darn expensive.
As Calvin mentioned there was lengthy discussion of this at JLC. The jist was that the Festool vacs do not comply and that you'll be spending ~$500 for a new one that does.
Thanks David
I know just as i thought. So much for having a dual purpose vac, well i guess i could hook the HEPA vac up to a any tools if i really wanted.
Man if things were not bad enough with the ecomony and business, and now having to go out and spend all kinds of $$$$ on new equipment that is not even stuff i want to get..... Bummer.
Ray
Here's my interpratation of the requirements. I recently attended the RRP class in Rhode Island. I'm still wrapping my head around all of it.
We need to pass the clearance testing to make the EPA happy. I don't think they care what we use as long as we pass the clearance tests. I do believe that the vacuum has to built with special seals that reduces the exhaust form spewing out dirty dust. I do not think you can go out and buy a HEPA filter for your old shop-vac and expect it to clean to a level needed to pass a clearance test.
I was advised of a couple things regarding the vacuums. One was they need to be like 97% (not exactly sure) effective at HEPA filtration . Another thing is that carpets will need to be cleaned with a beater bar. A motor driven beater bar is better than an air powered beater bar. I am thinking of buying an Electrolux Oxygen 3($500.00) at Lowes when the need arrises.
In the mean time, I purchased a Pro-team back pack vacuum. It's the Super Coach HEPA. I found it for about $420.00 and has 99.97% @ 0.3 micrograms and has a 10 Qt capacity. The bags can be easily emptied and reused(to reduce costs). I thought it would come in a lot more useful/handy more often than the Electrolux would. The wife likes the backpack style. She was curious of the hardwood floor guy's back pack vac when he was at our house recently.
I could not find one vacuum that would be great for all around clean up duties and have a beater bar.
Regarding the RRP thing. I don't mind the training and info but I do mind having to perform tasks to a certain level that the home owner does not want to pay for. I think that the homeowner should be responsable for what happens in their own home. They want to pay us to use the prescribed precautions and have the clearance tests then GREAT! They want to sign off and let us work as usual, then GREAT. LET THE HOMEOWNER DECIDE.
Good Luck. Hope this helped a little.
George
GLS Services LLC
For what it's worth, apparently the Fein Turbo II has a HEPA kit that is rated for asbestos or lead removal and containment.
Nothing cheap there either.
We’ve asked the fine folks at Fein (pun intended) to upgrade each of these with a HEPA filter. HEPA Filters trap particles to 0.3 microns – smaller than any wood sawdust you can create. When working with lead and asbestos pick-up, use the TURBO II model which is supplied with the HEPA Dust Bag for hazardous particulate containment.
Fein/Festool Coming Around With Parts For New Lead Law
Just stopped in my local supplier of tools for eternity and we talked Lead.
He pulled out an advance info sheet from Fein-(cousins with Festool)
Seems that Fein is offering for maybe 60.00 soon, a new Hepa filter that will be rated to EPA standards.
And the beater bar end (powered) that will serve the carpet cleanup rules.
That one, no price as of yet.
Festool is expected to do the same................when, don't know but maybe continued questioning of Festool would turn up results or answers.
Of course, the Fein powered beater bar end can be compatible with the festool vac-Their tools swap out on the hose end ok-and the power comes from the accessory outlet on the vac.
Still $'s but it looks like maybe we can get a way a fuzz cheaper.................
i.e. if the advance info pans out as it seems it might.