I’m posting this because I was thinking about it. A couple of potential customers over the past few months used the F word more than a couple of times during the estimate/first meeting. As it turns out, that was also the last meeting. One I haven’t heard back from and the other I didn’t bother calling back.
What? Just because the used the F word?
Don’t get me wrong, I have about as foul a mouth as one could imagine, on occasion. But I also know when it’s appropriate or not. Fact is, when I use the F word, or the B word, or whatever words I can use here in this forum, it is to express a point. And that’s just the thing. These people do not know me, never met them before that first and last meeting. They don’t know if I might be offended. But I feel there is hidden (or in some cases not so hidded) meaning behind everything someone says and how they say it. Sort of like body language, but verbal. So I have to ask myself “What is the meaning behind these people using the F word several times during our first “Business” meeting?”
My best guess is they are telling me they are out to screw me. I have enough business that I don’t need to take the chance, so I decided not to do business with those clients, because they used the F word.
Just thought I’d share that f*ing thought. =D
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Hi Ted ,
I don't think they are telling you they are going to screw you by using foul language . They are showing you perhaps what type of people they are or at least how they talk .
Always in business we have to trust our gut instinct , and for me that first meeting and impression can be very important . There are folks who we are better off not working for and after many dealings with folks you get a feel at least for who you don't want to work for .
Some people with perfectly Green money have foul mouths , if you don't need the business and it bothers you then, pass .
Ted , I do understand how you feel they may have been dead beat low life's and there are plenty of clients who won't use foul words but , the caution here is if we rule out everyone who we don't like or is different or has wrong orientations the pool of clients who can afford to pay us becomes tiny especially in this economy or lack of one .
regards dusty
That " Gut " instinct is usually right more than wrong, I trust it more and more the older I get.
I absolutely trust my gut instinct. Didn't always used to, but the last time I didn't, the job turned into a total nightmare. The clients are among the best, but it seemed every time I opened a wall there would be new and more challenging obstacles. And the client is on a tight budget, so if I charged for all the hidden surprises I wouldn't have been able to finish the job. So I ate a lot of it. Basically ended up making about $5/hour on that job. What's more, the customer hasn't once refered me to anybody at all.
But about the foul language issue, I think it comes mostly from experience. Several times in the past I dealt with customers who used f*ing this and f*ing that, and in the end I ended up regretting it. Of course, that doesn't mean the customer with impecably clean language won't try to screw me over. Just saying that, to me, the F word during the first business meeting has become a big, red flag. See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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I have known people that interject f--k between every third word of their speech. They do it unconsciously and basically don't mean anything by it. I've known others that use the word liberally but do so relatively consciously, and they're expressing a degree of anger and malice with it. You can kind of tell the two types apart if you listen to them a bit -- feel sorry for the one and be wary of the other.
I see two sides to this.
One, they are trying to be regular people. They have a contractor in the house and they want to seem like "one of the guys". Poor assumption on their part.
Or two, they are just immature. I recently heard a definition of immaturity that I had never thought of before. Immaturity is the disregard of other's opinions or feelings in a situation. Meaning they didn't care or know that it might bother you. Even if it doesn't really bother you that much, this is a sign of immaturity on their part.
Story, years ago I delivered furniture to pay the bills. I was in a customer's house and we were talking about something and I used the term "pi$$ed off". She asked me not to say that and she made a comment about how she didn't understand how this term made its way into everyday language. She was cool about it and I learned a good lesson that day.
Joe
Both your points are well taken and, in fact, I think has a lot to do with my feelings about it.
If they feel this is the way contractors are, then they might also feel contractors are accustomed to getting ripped off.
If they are too imature to know that some language may be offensive to some people(though it doesn't bother me at all, but that's beside the point), then they may be too imature to handle common business matters, like paying me on time, or at all.
I guess if things were tight for me, I would be a little less picky about who I work for. But as my schedule is completely filled up and I'm pushing work back for lack of time, I can afford to be picky. So those that use the F word during a first business meeting are among the first that I decline. See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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"If they feel this is the way contractors are, then they might also feel contractors are accustomed to getting ripped off. "Help me understand the connection. Using the f-word in normal conversation in a business meeting strikes me as lacking social refinement, but I don't see the connection to dishonesty. I met the famous lawyer Barry Scheck once and he was very well spoken, but I know that the guy who deliberately confused a jury about DNA evidence to get OJ off for murdering his ex wife is definitely not an honorable man.BruceT
I'm still trying to figure out when/how/who decided "sucks" was acceptable language?
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
"frickin" and "freakin" don't belong either.
Who decided "sucks" as acceptable langage? Eddie Murphy, that's who.
Ha ha-late to the party here, but I posted almost exactly the same question a while back-I remember when "sucks" was a curse word.
Most nights are crystal clear, but tonight it's like he's stuck between stations.
It's just sound we interpret as language.
We leave it up to our kids to recognize when it's appropriate and not - it's the sort of thing that only the environment determines usage. If they get in trouble at school or with a parent, that's a lot better learning experience of appropriate usage than us (parents) arbitrarily making rules.
If yer gonna' talk, ya gotta listen to what the other guy says and how he says it.
(DW's secret SuperHero alias is The Curser, and her special power is that she can turn the air blue)
Forrest
As a Roofer i noticed some people assume roofers are in the lower strata and i think they might feel there connecting better, Sorta like the homeowner that starts showing off his tools.
Another point is they may be from somewhere else,As im from NJ which is renown for cussing i tawked mighty colorfull even in church, My wife trained me but i still want to use the F word to make a point, If im angry or excited i slip into a heavy accent with dirty words.
As everyone around me smoked and cussed back east it was normal but its not normal other places:i dont smoke anymore}
"As a Roofer i noticed some people assume roofers are in the lower strata and i think they might feel there connecting better, Sorta like the homeowner that starts showing off his tools."
What i was wondering when i first read this. A couple guys who get down and dirty when they assume others are the same. Maybe nothing, or maybe insecurity. Which might manifest itself into something ugly later on.
On a side note, nobody swears like Europeans. Had a roommate from Germany in college who used the f-word so much it gave me a headache when we first met. Later worked with a colleague from Switzerland. Similar situation. Both were great guys, and no shrinking violet of swearing here (especially behind the wheel, then you're all a bunch of muthas). But it's funny how some people just naturally default to it.
I knew a bunch of ESL types in college who were like that. I suspect that part of it is that they want to be a part of "the gang", and feel that using blue language gives them some "cred". Knew another guy who was a little bit "challenged" and who had a speech impediment who was the same way -- using blue language helps to deflect the (ill-conceived) ridicule that might otherwise be directed at such people.
The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of a mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one. --Wilhelm Stekel
My impression was they were like that regardless of language. It was more of a cultural thing. I met parents and spouses who were the same way. Perhaps it's just more analagous to Europe.
They were also much more pointed with criticism. No sugarcoating . . . if they didn't like something, they'd be brutally honest. Never intended as anything personal, but in this pc culture it sometimes got interpreted that way.
Not something I've ever heard from my Norwegian relatives. Maybe you just have lower-brow friends? ;)
The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of a mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one. --Wilhelm Stekel
or maybe it's the Norwegian Lutheran gene <g>
The short time I spent in London confirms what you mention here-the f word is applied liberally over there.
Most nights are crystal clear, but tonight it's like he's stuck between stations.
Ok, just so I got the whole thing straight. It was a big deal and a deal breaker in the first thread but 50 something posts later it is no longer a big deal. It turns out that you had in the past have done business or made exception to not one but a number of folks who do just what you said you didn't tolerate in the first thread. Remind me to jump on your next merry go round and see if I learn something. DanT
Just finished a Bill Bryson book called 'Notes From a Small Island'. The author (a Yank) tours GB one final time after living there for about 20 years. True about the f-word. But they seem to use it more creatively, and with more variants.
That makes sense, given their creativity with the language overall.
Ever go over to Knots? There are a couple of Brits over there and one of them has a rather florid writing style-he really has a way with words. Has half the board writing like him now.
Most nights are crystal clear, but tonight it's like he's stuck between stations.
When people use the F--- You phrase when talking to me, I have three options. One, assume that they are wishing my wife and I blessed conjugal evening. Two, they are threatening me with personal bodily sexual assualt. Or, three, they are so ignorant that they do not even realize what they are saying.
To assume the first, it would have to be in context of a well wishing and they would have to know both myself and my wife very well or it would be entirely inappropriate. To assume the second, requires that I either invite them to step outside to "discuss" their threat or call the police to report the threat of an assault.
Of course, I typically choose the third option and decide that I have no further knowledge or wisdom to gain by associating with the person. Even the potential for profit would not make me want to be in their association any further.
I always wonder where the foul words came from and who decided that it be a foul word. Must be the FCC. It just a word till somebody decide that its foul.Since Katrina I been on the Mississippi coast. most of the crew 99.978 % are mexician. They are the nicest people around, quiet when they work, work till dark.Came back to Mobile about six months ago. Working on a government project full time, with the typical crew. Theses people are crude. They holler and cuss all day long, talk about stuff my mamam slap me for. Will not use the porta let, pull it out right there.Last week during break I was this older worker, go to his car get a can of vineea sausage, pull the top, threw it on the gound. walk across the site, pour the liguid down his leg, ate the sasuage and then threw the can on the ground.I cant wait to go back to mississippi, I wish Mobile would go mexician.If you had a crew that acted like they was working in a suit and tie all day, you could take all the business in town. I got offeneded and I been in construction 28 years I wonder what clients think.
"Will not use the porta let, pull it out right there."I've never understood that. Guys with no sense at all, even some animals have the sense to go in certain places and not in others.About six years ago, I was working with a large crew of maybe 8 guys. We would always take our lunch break under a nice shade tree. One of the guys (easily the most crude and uncouth in the bunch) unzipped and urinated about three feet from where we all would sit.I don't know if he was trying to make a statement, or just so depraved that it didn't even occur to him that he was being disgusting.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I always wonder where the foul words came from and who decided that it be a foul word. Must be the FCC. It just a word till somebody decide that its foul.
We still decide this for ourselves. Foul words represent things that should be private or may be considered vulgar to most. 10 yrs ago, M I L F, wan't in our language. Now it's on TV. If you know what it means, it shouldn't be said, especially on TV. I wouldn't use this word now because I know what it represents and it would be crude to call someone that. Someone who is immature wouldn't take the time to care if it offended someone else.
They are the nicest people around, quiet when they work, work till dark.
Yeah, but they can curse you and you don't know it, especially if you just know textbook Espaniol, you big punta, you.http://www.quittintime.com/ View Image
and that why its so great to work around them.
Bwahahahahttp://www.quittintime.com/ View Image
"...you big punta, you."Watch your language. You just called him a "point" or a maybe small clavo, as the case may be. Next thing you'll be using the ch-word. :)BruceT
Point or end as in "hind end".http://www.quittintime.com/ View Image
ching with an a, followed by tu
thank you, Junot Diaz
And don't forget its adjective (-ado) and noun permutations (-aso). I especially like that marvelous universal noun used as a stand-in for whatever thing, the proper word for which the speaker cannot recall, ch###adera. BruceT
Next thing you'll be using the ch-word. :)
Charo??'Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt man doing it' ~ Chinese proverb
View Image
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.charo.info/images/cuchicover-sm.jpg&imgrefurl=http://tikichris.blogspot.com/2007/03/more-cuchi-cuchi-cruises.html&usg=__VPmnw5B_c2FfQaGYXi78v_g8n5U=&h=295&w=300&sz=36&hl=en&start=4&um=1&tbnid=c0pniMYoX5aMfM:&tbnh=114&tbnw=116&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcharo%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us%26rlz%3D1I7GPEA_enUS288%26sa%3DX
Charo!
i think he meant chollo
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Chollo
hay caramba!
You are probably on the right track.
I can be downright profane sometimes but it wouldn't do it on the first meeting.
I can't second guess you on this one! As a fellow 'businessman' tells me, 'don't be afraid to fire a customer.'
Sure, context matters. It's one thing for a guy to cuss as he steps on a nail .... and another to greet a complete stranger with an obscenity.
Still, probably the most critical element in a job is the ability to communicate with the customer. Language, culture, and past experience can interfer with this. In my experience, nearly every job that has gone sour has had poor communication as a major factor.
So, if you don't know where the guy is coming from, you're already off to a bad start.
Ted,
Good topic.
I'm no prude but think a lot of what's put on BT is excessive at times. Even with the cute punctuation and all, it's still swearing. Yes, I know we're all adults, but growing up, even around blue collar, ex-military and such, the language wasn't what you now here on the school ground.
Some of the crudest language around me comes from female co-workers. Language that at one time would have gotten a male worker in serious trouble for sexual harassment.
Was at a sales meeting and the mgr was discussing a sales rep who had had a complaint filed on him. Seems the company owner's wife was nearby when the sales rep opened up with his colorful language.
Another sales rep said that a foul mouth doesn't make you a bigger man.
When I slip up on occasion, his comment still comes into my head. I do try.
Pete
Well, I think it might also have to do with one's background. I started my working career in the Army and then worked 13 years in a prison. In both places and certainly in prison the F word and MF words are descriptive, nouns, verbs, adjetives etc. because they are used in most sentences.
Is it right? Is it wrong? Who says? George Carlin did many comedy sketches on prudish people who take it upon themselves to decide what other people should or shouldn't say and how they should say it. I guess I think if you can communicate then all those around you should think it is ok but that is obviously not the case.
Language is evolving. When I went to school I must have heard a hundred times that ain't isn't a word because it is not in the dictionary. It is now so it must be ok to use.
I use the F word a lot. I don't in front of my clients. I don't worry about it if I am dealing with a potential vendor or someone who might do work for me as I am paying for the privlidge. If that is the only thing you would base your first judgement of me on then it is ok with me but.........you would be wrong. I pay all my bills, am good to work for, communicate well with my contractors and pay as soon as the job is finished. So if you wish to judge someone on that alone I think you are making a mistake but if you had other issue then the gut feel is usually good. DanT
Using the F word in a situation like this is first of all a sign of class. That works to your benefit because it is as if they had a sign on their head that says they are not going to meet honorable expectations.
Secondly, they are using the word to size you up to see if you are willing to play in their world. If you are, then you are also up for all the problems that go with dealing with low class, such as not getting taken at your word and not getting paid on time.
By far the best way to deal with these folks is to understand your own stand on this issue before you have your first meeting. That puts you in a position to tell them that you do not work for people like them and to get up and walk out. On the other hand, you could keep your thoughts to yourself and specify payments up front along with an iron-clad contract. If they want to drag you down to their level, at least make them pay up front.
I think yours is the best reply on this I've read so far.I can think of two guys I worked for who did the foul language thing. One was a contractor and I was a sub. I think he consciously did it as a way of assedrting his power and position. At the time, I was young and took it as a matter of course, but our working relationship did not last long because he was low in other ways too.The other guy was a more recent deal.
He was a New Jersey Lawyer summering here. We met to discuss some design work and like the OP situation, he inserted the f-bomb a couple of times. First one I ignored, not sure if it was just an unconscious slip[ up. The second time, he was relating a story of another contractor who had done him wrong. I was pretty sure in that, that there was a message intended. Partly, he was warning me that he would not be so used again. But also, I wondered if he normally spoke with f### seasoning (indicating a lack of self control, which I would not take well to) or if he simply had it in mind that contractors normally speak that way and he was trying to speak to me in my own native tongue.So I just told him, "I agree with you that some contractors can be real jerks and give my business the same kind of bad rep that goes with SOME used car salesmen and some lawyers....pause....but do we need to use that kind of language between the two of us?"With that statement I let him know a number of things all at once and put the control back in his hands with the question.He looked me a long one in the eye, and said, "No - You are right - we don't. Now on to this...." and he has never used bad language again with me.BTW, we have had several meetings about other things, but I never did do that design job for him.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
one time my cable subsriber kept messing with me, kept cutting my service. So one time I called customer no service. 'Why are yall F.... with my service. I was heated at that time. and the customer service replyied in a calm manner. "Sir, we dont talk like that" clickwhat do you do, how do you argue that point. It was the best comeback
Good story. Reminds me of my Yankee heritage.
With only 1/2 million words to use in English, they must have run out!!
Shame of it is most have no clue how to curse correctly. but grammar is no longer as important as it once was. Just some of the "stuff" from the film industry shows a poor quality education. Wrong words, curse in the wrong place, used as padding etc.
As for me, my customers think I don't curse at all! But I blew that last feb when working with some really cheap cedar T&G liner. It was really giving me a taught time and the HO had gone out, they had returned but not told me.
They told me later "you are normal after all!" was I insulted? I still wonder...........
I was taught that...
"Profanity is an ignorant mind trying to express itself"
When I feel like cursing I stop and think (when there is time) is that the best I can come up with? Then let it out like the "Old Man" in the Christmas Story..."You elbow brained, yellow tailed onion licker!
Never had anyone offended yet!
Ironic that I shoud bring this up today of all days. I didn't know my customer came home, I'm working away in the basement tiling the floor, was having a difficult tile at one outside double corner (sort of a zig-zag where a doorway meets an adjoining wall) and I blurted out "G-dammit you mutherf'er!". Then I hear the door open... "Is everything okay?"
Oopsie =)
This customer has known me for years and I don't think she's ever heard my blue collar lingo till today. I apologized but she didn't really care, as long as everything was okay. Also, as long as her 6 year old isn't home. See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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Ted , Gee Ted , will you have to fire yourself now that you your badself used foul words or do you have different standards for potential clients then for your self ?
I have to fire myself along with a huge severance package, maybe a few million in a swiss bank account. Yep, gotta love corporate politics. =)
Okay, back to reality. The issue is about when somebody uses foul language during the first business meeting. So no, can't fire myself just yet. See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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TedW.
I grew up with a dad who was a drill sargent in the Army. Growing up I hardly ever hear him use bad language. Especially when my mom or ladies were around, didn't matter what side of the tracks they came from.
I don't use foul language on or off a job site, and when in charge I don't allow that kind of behavior no matter who it is. That's why when I'm in charge guys like to work for me. I guess if you treat them that way the understand where you stand.
Heard this the other day, Children gravitate to what their parents tolorate.
GaryS.
nailerman... my dad was in the navy from the age of 17 for 31 years... i never heard a single swear word , either vulgarity or profanity , from him
on the other hand , i have a very foul mouth... but usually not in front of strangersMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I have a very foul mouth as well---in the right circumstances.
the "F" word is a EXCELLENT word-and all it's variations----but there is a time and a place for it.
just dropped your cel phone in a 5 gallon bucket of roof adhesive--excellent time for it----just cut your finger on a rusty piece of old chimney flashing-excellent time and place for itfirst business meeting-or any business meeting----bad time and place.
I don't see any connection between a prospective customer using that word in my presence and any intent to cheat me . an over-reaction to someone elses poor grammar---I think tells me more about the "over-reactors" insecurity,defensiveness, and low self-esteem---than it tells me about the person using the "forbidden word"
stephen
I should clarify that it's not a strict rule of mine, that I won't work for them because they said a bad word. It's just that on a scale of who I'm more likely to accept work from, using foul language during a first meeting pushes them closer to the lower end of that scale.
It's the same, as one other poster pointed out, as if they started trying to preach the gospel during the first meeting. It says a lot about the customer and the way they think. If that first meeting is my only means of assessing what sort of working relationship I can expect from that customer, that one word says a lot.
There are plenty of exceptions. For instance, if I know the customer is highly regarded as dependable and has impecable credit rating, that will trump any foul language the customer can dish out. Likewise, if I just have a good feeling about the person and the job being proposed, I'm not going to let a little word get in the way of business.
The F word during the first meeting is a pretty big red flag, but there are also plenty of green flags as well.
Another red flag is when I arrive at the scheduled time, and they just got out of bed, still scratching their #### and waking up, saying "Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot we were meeting today."
Now I have to confess, one of my best customers to this day, directly responsible for over half my current business via his referals, is among the most foul mouthed people I know. And yes, he used the F word several times during our first meeting. But I had a good feeling about him and the work proposed. I could see he had it together and I trusted my gut and went with it.
an over-reaction to someone elses poor grammar---I think tells me more about the "over-reactors" insecurity,defensiveness, and low self-esteem---than it tells me about the person using the "forbidden word"stephen
I don't see how it reflects insecurity, defensiveness or low self-esteem. It's just a matter of weighing the potential for bad experience when working for the person. See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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Ted , You seem to have come full circle in your reasoning , now it is not a strict rule of your's , one could not tell that from the first post.
It's O.K. for them to use foul words if either "they have an impeccable credit rating " or " if you just have a good feeling about them " but " you wouldn't let that one little word get in the way".
It still boils down to the gut instinct you get , the rest of what you say and the stance you took in your original post could be construed as wishy washy .
A person who's personal convictions are so strong would not choose to do business with a foul mouthed person regardless of their credit rating , and you can take that to the bank .
I never said in the original post that it's a strict rule. Just something I was thinking about at the time and decided to post it. There were 2 potential customers who said f*ing this and f*ing that during the first meeting. Since I don't especially need the work, I decided not to do business with them. If things were tight for me and I needed the work, or if I had reason to believe they might be especially good, long term customers, I would have seen it as a warning to procede with caution. Either way, using foul language during a first business meeting is not inductive to a positive working relationship.
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Edited 12/11/2008 10:00 pm by Ted W.
Ted- i think there is a time and a place for it--- if a prospect-on our first meeting--while we are in their living room asked me" you effers aren't gonna leave cigarette buts all over my driveway are you?"---I would view the matter differently than if a customer and I were alone out in his garage as I stacked up materials at the end of the day--------and the neighbors dog has been barking all day and the customer remarks" I really hate that effing dog" time and a place but I don't see any correlation between a prospect using the "F" word on the first meeting--and a nefarious plan to cheat me----any more than red heads would cheat me or left handed people---- no connection-------so it's not so much the use of the word----since i think the word has excellent potential-----it's a persons reaction to it's use I find interesting someone else mentioned something about bible thumpers language--- and THAT is a red flag for me---just because I don't want to hear about it. they are welcome to their believes------ but since I amn not gonna force MINE on them- i want the same courtesy.Very best wishes to you,
stephen
It's a clue as to how courteous and considerate they are. A person can be basically honest but if not reasonably courteous and considerate they can still f--- you.
The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of a mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one. --Wilhelm Stekel
Stephen and All ,
When the clients start in with religious talk perhaps Ted and others feel more comfortable then with the foul talk . I am always respectful of their beliefs but will not participate , and I typically do not feel more comfortable with these folks .
Whether it's poor judgement in words or no class or religious talk , either can make some of us want to pack up and put it in reverse .
I'm a cabinet maker , when I meet with a potential and they are "getting prices " and they have no plan or otherwise are ill prepared to proceed , that weighs more with me then the words they use or the church they go to .
It shows me they are un organized and don't have a clue how things work , these clients can be trouble imo .
To me it still all boils down to our gut instinct and feelings
regards dusty
Sorry, Ted, but I just had to jump in here. I really don't get the cussing thing. I've worked in construction all my life and I've often joked that I speak two languages - Construction and English. But I really don't like to hear the F-word (or other words like that, for that matter). I find that as tradespersons we have such uncomfortable stereotypes attached to us - crude, unkempt, uneducated, base, to be avoided in social situations, for example. No wonder the up and coming generation is so uninterested in the whole "trades thing."
No, I'd rather keep it clean. I have had clients appear to "dumb down" and cuss in front of me. Sorry, that's an insult-extraordaire. It also amazes how some guys can turn it off and on depending if: a woman is nearby, young kids are in close proximity, for example. If you can control it in those situations why not try doing all the time?I once heard a psychologist on the radio deal with a caller who had a problem with cussing around his family. She suggested that every time he uttered the F-word (or equal) that he pay his family $20. He called back a week later and said that after a hundred bucks speeding its way out of his wallet that he had it under control now. Seems like a pretty good way to self-regulate - if you're so inclined.As far as the Brits are concerned and their "creative" use of the F-word - sorry, but two wrongs don't make a right. And the fact that a British celebrity chef has one of the foulest mouths on TV still doesn't make me cringe any less when I hear it. I know many BT guys will disagree with me, but I just don't feel that it's necessary to cuss or to listen passively while prospective customers shoot off their potty mouths. Cheers,
Ken=================================================You live and learn. At any rate, you live.
Besides, when you're cussing all the time it sort of leaves you defenseless when a cussword is really needed.
The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of a mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one. --Wilhelm Stekel
That's the dilution effect!;)I cuss so seldom that when I do, people pay attention.
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I dont remember any customers using foul language during a visit,unless it was someone I knew of course..:) What gets me is when someone makes a public scene with kids, old ladies around etc. This just happened a couple weeks ago at an Ace hardware on a Sat morning sale. Some jackass went ballistic at the cashier because he askedthe guy if he had an Ace rewards card. The jerk used the F'n word several times at loud decibals (with his wife holding their 2 year old child) and yelled F U on his way out the door. There were old ladies, kids etc. in the store, so what is this idiot trying to prove? The funny part is after he left most people just chuckled and went on with their business. I have seen this happen a couple other times in public places and just wonder if these idiots ever get arrested or if they just need a good whop upside the head. Of course, then there would be assault charges, law suits etc.,to deal with.
"I don't use foul language on or off a job site,"Oh come on now - you are with friends - confession is good for the soul - even I have slipped 4-5 times in the last thirty years.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Piffin,
Ok, yes I have. The few times I have everyone around got white faced and ran off for fear of death!
I have to be so angered by something that they know when I get to that point someone is going home or not working for me anymore.
Has happened maybe 5 or 6 times in 12 yrs. As a child I had a very bad anger problem, had to get cousleling for it. Now in my 50's and pretty laid back. Nothing shakes me that much, but when it does God help them.
So among friends, there is my confession.
GaryS.
Fate has a way of reminding me not to be too careless with it.Like a couple years ago, I was trying top fix something on my tablesaw. It was getting frustrating - one of those deals where you have to stand on one leg, stick your tongue out, wiggle your ears just right, and use three hands to get it done....I had my cell phone sitting on top of the TS, two subs were trying to ask me two different Qs at the same time, I was worried about loosing the special screw in the sawdust, and the dang phone rang!My helper saw my predicament and 'helped me' by answering the phone to say please wait a minute.I did not see him holding the phone out to me as I told one sub,
"Just wait a GD minute while I get this F###ing screwed up piece of S### back together again."Turned out that the person calling me was the lady who owned the place with her biweekly call. She'd heard every word loud and clear, and fortunately understood that I wasn't speaking to her
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
But did you loose the screw?
Something like that happened to me but it was my wife on the other end. To this day I still hear about it. That happened 10 yrs. ago. Oh well I can see that premenopause will test my ability to stay calm!!!!!!!!!!!!
GaryS.
In her mind, it happened yesterday. ;-)See my work at TedsCarpentry.comBuy Cheap Tools! BuildersTools.net
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not reading the entire thread.........I'd say...and believe that those kinds of people are trying to be hip and cool.....
that means I avoid them as well as the guy who uses praise the lord lingo.
You gotta do business with real people. These people can, if need be.....talk in complete sentences and make sense.......They understand what making a good first impression is all about.........and save the other stuff for the occassional verbal inflection
On the other hand.......to denegrate the finest word in our vocabulary is a bit over the snobishly inspired top...No?Name one word that has so many various meaning......that can be spoken so easily. That helps quench frustration....and anger.......a word that arouses the deepest passion........and incites the wildest imaginationPeople who raise the pinky finger in disgust........aggravate me far more than the dude/lady using the f word.Some of you guys act like landed gentry for *&^%^ sake.My Blog
i'm with you..
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113821.43 in reply to 113821.42
On the other hand.......to denegrate the finest word in our vocabulary is a bit over the snobishly inspired top...No?
Name one word that has so many various meaning......that can be spoken so easily. That helps quench frustration....and anger.......a word that arouses the deepest passion........and incites the wildest imagination
>>>>
just because someone uses the word "golf" doesn't make them a bad personMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Ya but if they use the "f" word alot while golfing that make them a bad golfer.
You know the one.
"FORE"
Russell
I cannot talk in complete sentences. people tell me all the time
yeah, but you're funny so you get a passMy Blog
"I cannot talk in complete sentences. people tell me all the time"...And that's what unique about you. I go out of my way to read your posts because of their original take on things and the way you arrange or not even use words. It's very refreshing and I'm hoping you stick around.
I couldn't believe it when you were gone.
Foul language on first meeting is a very foolish thing. If an F or a B slips in unobtrusively, I usually let it go, but if it's woven indelibly into the fabric of the conversation, it will have an affect on my decision to do any work for that person.
Bad language can be an indicater of other problems down the road.
The older I get, the more I am drawn to old fashioned politeness & manners.
"f*** the FCC
f*** the FBI
f*** the CIA
I'm living in the motherf****** USA" Steve Earle
WOW!...a Steve Earle reference. The Hardcore Troubadour. The best songwriter in the USA--sorry Bob and Bruce.
Steve Earle is one of my favorites, but I think Conor Oberst might be a better writer. Check out "Cape Canaveral".