Replies

1. 
   Guest_ | May 16, 2000 11:38pm | #1

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   Roger - Assuming that you are talking about the section that runs from the valve to the head, that section of pipe drains, through the shower head itself. It won't freeze while you're showering and it doesn't remain with much water in it when you're not. I suggest that you might want to pitch the section above the ceiling to the head a bit to help it drain more quickly.

1. 
   Guest_ | May 17, 2000 12:15pm | #2

   *Roger,You did mean that the copper is next to the drywall and then the insulation on top of the copper didn't you? If so, and you have a good chance that the warm ceiling will keep it from freezing. Best of Luck.

2. 
   Roger_Martini | May 17, 2000 06:02pm | #3

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   Jeff--I thought it would siphon out too, but it turns out that there seems to be enough surface tension in the little shower nozzle holes to prevent this. If I remove the shower head, a rush of water flows out of the pipe. Too late to slope the pipe, sadly.

   calvin--From bottom up, it goes: drywall, pipe, drywall, insulation. I put in a second ceiling rather than have all that cellulose fall on my head while renovating.

3. 
   Guest_ | May 17, 2000 08:13pm | #4

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   Not much insulation for -30*? Is that 30*F below freezing? Or 30* below zero? Must be a fun spot for a shower...Joe H

1. 
   Guest_ | May 17, 2000 09:29pm | #5

   *If you're really concerned, add a diverter and drain to the shower - too late for that too? Heat trace? etc.

4. 
   Roger_Martini | May 17, 2000 09:47pm | #6

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   Good ideas, but the responses so far have emboldened me to stick with my original plan--wait to see if it freezes. If yes, add more R20 and try again. If it still freezes, try one of the ideas posted here (along with some cursing).

   cheers,

5. 
   Guest_ | May 18, 2000 01:05am | #7

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   At least if it bursts, its over a shower :/

6. 
   BillR_ | May 18, 2000 06:10pm | #8

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   You may do nothing (probably just fine), or else add a water hammer arrester (an air cartridge with a rubber diaphragm that separates the water from the air) where the line turns down to the shower head. What causes ruptures is elevated fluid pressure downstream from a blockage, and a good air chamber would allow the line to turn to ice and back to water with no damage to the line.

   For a better explanation than the above go to http://www.ibhs.org/html/publications/Default.htm and open publication #2 on freezing and bursting pipes. IBHS is the Institute for Building Health and Safety, a claims reduction consortium of the insurance industry.

7. 
   Roger_Martini | May 18, 2000 06:10pm | #9

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   I just installed a new shower where the shower head exits from the ceiling over the centre of the bathtub. Now I am nervous whether the 4 feet or so of copper pipe running along the ceiling will freeze in winter or not. The half inch copper pipe runs under R20 fibreglass insulation, about 2" of pre-existing cellulose insulation, 1 1/2 " of fibreboard and 1/2" drywall, and above a new 1/2" drywall ceiling.

   This is in Ottawa, where the tempature can drop to -30 or so in the winter.

   Am I okay, or should I climb into the attic with some more batts of R20?