Replies

1. 
   WayneL5 | Dec 05, 2004 04:00am | #1

   It depends on the direction of the rafters or trusses.  Will they bear above the header, thus adding roof load to the header?  I don't have my tables handy, but whoever can answer your question will need to know that.

2. 
   gdavis62 | Dec 05, 2004 04:02am | #2

   Cannot tell without roof config and snow loading (if any).  I am in upstate NY and my ground snow load, where I live and build, is 20 psf higher than it is just one county over. 

   Most garage doors are placed on the gable end, in which case you don't need much at all for a header, but hey, you may be doing it the other way, or you have a hipped roof, or whatever.

   A really good guide to header sizing is found at the trusjoist site.  Go there and see what you can learn.

   If TrusJoist tells you a pair of 9-1/2" LVLs are needed, and you are doing sawn lumber, you'll want to move up to 2-2x12s.

3. 
   Piffin | Dec 05, 2004 04:23am | #3

   with what loading on it? Roof only?
   Roof and one floor?
   Roof and two floors?
   What is your local live load requirement for roofs in #/sq ft?

    

    

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1. 
   Saint | Dec 05, 2004 04:59am | #4

   Header will be supporting one floor and roof. Floor joists will be sitting atop header. Unsure what the reloading requirements are in my area.

1. 
   Piffin | Dec 05, 2004 05:19am | #5

   since it is more than just roof, better go with LVLs. The yard that sells them can help you with sizing. 2- 1-3/4" x 11.5" is probably OK, but they will engineer it for free and then you know it is right. 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

1. 
   Saint | Dec 05, 2004 07:51am | #7

   Thank you - Saint

4. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Dec 05, 2004 07:23am | #6

   Outbuilding? Put the two in. If it sags....add a third.

   blue

   Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, all of it is considered bottom of the barrel by Gabe. I am not to be counted amongst the worst of the worst. If you want real framing information...don't listen to me..just ask Gabe!

5. 
   Hubedube | Dec 05, 2004 04:33pm | #8

   For the sake of another $ 15. in stead of only 2-2x12, put in 3 - 2x12.  Then even if your supporting a floor, a roof, and in 80 lb snow load area, you will have no worry.

1. 
   Piffin | Dec 05, 2004 05:29pm | #9

   IF that is enough to handle the load (could be marginal) then he could get it by making the third one the rim joist in the floor system above so that it has no joint in midspan of the door openning. Or he could do the header double and then double the rim joist and hang to it with hangers so the other floor joists have a seat. That way, he has four 2x12 or if the floor is only 2x10 he has two 2x12 and 2- 2x10 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

1. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Dec 05, 2004 08:37pm | #10

   Piffin, in an out building, you usually don't have to get all the headers exactly flush on the inside of a garage door. A lot of guys backjam, which projects wood out another 1.5". Instead of backjamming with small stuff, add the third 2x12 and call it backjam..if it makes him feel better.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, all of it is considered bottom of the barrel by Gabe. I am not to be counted amongst the worst of the worst. If you want real framing information...don't listen to me..just ask Gabe!

1. 
   Piffin | Dec 05, 2004 09:33pm | #11

   so you then have 4.5" of header sitting on 3.5" of jack? 

    

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1. 
   Hubedube | Dec 06, 2004 01:12am | #12

   ...."so you then have 4.5" of header sitting on a 3.5 " jack?

    Why not, you only need 50 % bearing support....  sitting only a 1/2" over is leaving a 66% bearing on the 1.5 thickness. You still got an 1" bearing on the jack with the outside header lengths.

   No problem

2. 
   Piffin | Dec 06, 2004 01:47am | #13

   So you are saying to have a half inch over on each side?
   That makes it hard to put exterior sheathing on flush doesn't it?Letting the full extra inch hang to the insidemeans this third one would just add to the stiffness but wouldn't transfer much laod bearing. Be a darn good idea to have extra jacks under the ends!But that is only IF this assembly will pass his local code requirements. I still lean to the twin LVL 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

3. 
   woodbutch777 | Dec 06, 2004 04:14am | #18

   I agree on the LVL's why mess around with 2x's when the LVL's are stronger and straighter. I have seen alot of garages with undersized door headers and the results prove to me that engineered lumber is the way to go.

    

4. 
   Saint | Dec 15, 2004 05:13am | #19

   Went down the lumber yard to see about sizing the headers. They gave me the number for Boise, the manufacturer of the LVL's. I was on the phone with an engineer for 5 minutes and he had my answer. Two 11 7/8" LVL'. s Seems a little overkill but it is rugged. Thanks to all

                                                                                Saint

    

       

5. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Dec 06, 2004 02:54am | #14

   Yes....until your run another 1x rough sawn on the flat down to the floor which they do anyways when they back jam. They usually back jam with a 2x4...that would work too.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, all of it is considered bottom of the barrel by Gabe. I am not to be counted amongst the worst of the worst. If you want real framing information...don't listen to me..just ask Gabe!

6. 
   gdavis62 | Dec 06, 2004 03:11am | #15

   Back jam.  I like that term.  You must mean the cleating for the door track mounts.

   Jack and I will build that garage tomorrow, and like I always do at garage door openings, we'll spike 2x6s to the inside of the R.O. jambs, another across the top, and at the center, a vertical pair of 2x6s to pick up the door opener spring.

   Now, the key will be to get the whole thing done in the hour and a half you guys said it should take.

   Pictures and a time log to follow.

7. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Dec 06, 2004 03:38am | #17

   Yep Gene...for some reason some builders insist on backjamming the overhead door openings. I think it harkens back to the days when they were required for something that doesn't exist anymore.

   I typically don't back jam unless we absolutely are forced to. The last builder that we had to do it for didn't want to see the raw edge of the drywall when it stopped at the bottom of the door opening....I guess he doesn't know that they make j bead!

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, all of it is considered bottom of the barrel by Gabe. I am not to be counted amongst the worst of the worst. If you want real framing information...don't listen to me..just ask Gabe!

8. 
   Piffin | Dec 06, 2004 03:21am | #16

   NOW I get the whole picture! 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!