NEED FEEDBACK:
Looking to purchase a framing nailer and compressor for myself (1st time owner/builder). Have been told that the electric compressors don’t work well when run off a generator, and invalidates the warranty if something happens to the compressor or nailer when run off a generator. Leaning towards a Porter Cable setup – Coil 350 Frame Nailer and 3 hp 4 gal elec compressor, or Bostitch N80CB. Any thoughts?
A rear addition provides a small-scale example of how to frame efficiently.
"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.
Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.
Start Free Trial NowGet instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.
Start Free Trial Now
Replies
Ben ,I've been told the same thing by my tool rental company. I guess it's the newer compressors that have a problem with the generators. I've got this old Emglo which evidently doesn't have a problem with that.
Fine Homebuilding just did a survey on framing nailers that might be of interest to you. I think it was just last months issue. I myself have always used Senco's and Emglo's.
Good Luck , Dave
You might want to check out the other thread(s) about compressors/nailers. Some good info there. When I was considering the same purchases, I talked to a lot of people, did a lot of reading and like anything else, everyone has a different opinion. Go with quality stuff and save yourself the trouble. With pneumatic nailers, dirt is their mortal enemy so keep 'em clean! I personally like the Porter Cable line of nailers - I have several and love 'em all. I shopped around for prices and did best on Amazon. I've also done well on eBay pricewise but I only buy new ones in the box. If you buy online, consider the shipping costs vs. sales tax & take-it-home now convenience of buying locally.
I haven't heard about compressors having trouble w/ generators. I occasionally use my 25gal. Campbell Hausfeld compressor w/ my 10KW Generac with no trouble. (At least not any yet ;-) I would imagine that one potential problem could be that compressors draw a lot of power (especially during start-up) and that smaller gensets might not be up to the challenge and therefore the compressors are working underpowered. Just an idea... Anyone else want to weigh in on this?
Good Luck!
Ben
I'm "only" a plumber so I don't have any compressors or air nailers but I do have a 4400W Arctic Cat generator and when I have had it on job sites other trades have plugged into it. It will run most compressors the carpenters have had on site but occasionally on a bigger compressor the capacitor start is to much for the gen set and we have to release the pressure in the tank so it will start. I think if you size the genset to the draw on start up of the compressor you shouldn't have any problem.
BIGBEN,
Have you considered a Paslode airless nailer? Their wonderful especially if you don't really need a compressor. Just a thought! Good luck.
I have been eyeballing the Paslode frame nailer. Just don't want to spend the money if those types of nailers are a passing fad, or if they don't have enough power to drive the nails home (say when the fuel cell or battery starts running low). Have you used the compressorless frame nailer on a regular basis?
To be honest, I'm not so familiar w/ the Paslode Cordless nailer, but it seems that those that have them really like them. From what I understand though, they primarily use the clipped head nails which could be a factor if you're building in an area where code requires a full round head nail. Any Palsode users out there? Here's another idea - can you rent one somewhere and try it out?
One consideration - if you go w/ a compressor, you have the flexibility to add trim nailers or other pneumatic tools as well.
BigBen,
Yes, I use the framing and finish nailer regularly. Both are excellent and the framing nailer uses full round not clipped. They won't fire if the fuel cell or battery are low or empty which is a nice feature, in my opinion. When the fuel cell runs out just pop a new one in or the extra battery when that runs low. I can go over a week with one battery (rechargable) and fuel cell. They also have a built in hook to hang on your tool belt. The disadvantage to not having a compressor is not being able to blow off your tools at the end of the day, fill a low tire on the truck, etc., etc. I don't think the Paslode is a fad. Not dragging that hose around or tripping on it when you're on the roof is real nice!! Best of luck to you in your search!! Rich
The paslode is a great SECOND gun. Only a good first gun if you want to spend more time swearing at the thing than actually framing. Way slow compared to a hose.
Kinda makes nailing off sheathing a nice relaxing event.......gotta wait for the gun to catch up with you.
Get a good compressor first.......then all the nice guns that'll work off it....as you move thru construction.
The Paslode PowerMaster Plus would be a good start. Some day I'll add an Impluse to the collection.......gotta get a few more "hosed" guns first...before the toys come. Jeff * Jeff J. Buck/ Buck Construction/ Pittsburgh, PA *
2nd Generation Buck Const, 3rd generation Craftsman
Rich:
I've been told that the Impulse framing nailer uses round heads and clipped heads - true?? Wonder if you have to buy the Paslode brand nails or can use generics?
Hey BIGBEN,
Not sure if you can use clipped nails or not. Yes, their are generic brands to buy for the Paslode but I like their own nails. If you jam it up and something breaks it voids the warranty. Rich
Paslode's can use clipped head or their "RounDrive nails that have a full head.
Bigben,
The reason most compressors wont work off of a generator is that there is a delay between the draw on the gen. and when it revs up to give full power.
When a compressor kicks on it needs all of its rated amps and some more to get the pump moveing against the pressure in the tank.
But the gen. has to get up to speed from an idle, so it takes a second before it is able to deliver the wattage needed by the comp.
I dont know the technical explanation for it but this is not good for either machine.
If your going to listen to a generator any way then buy a gas compressor and get stereo sound!
Hope this helps
Mr T.
Layers
Onions
Have
Layers,
Carpenters
Have
Layers
BigBen, I have the Bostich N80SB and a Paslode 350 Powermaster Plus. Either of them works great. The powermaster is a little lighter, but the Bostich seems to have a touch more power. Really only shows up when shooting into Gluelams and LVL beams. The paslode cordless framer and trimmer are both on my wish list as I think they would be nice for small/quick jobs where I don't want to drag out a compressor and hoses.
TCW Specialists in Custom Remodeling.
I am the owner/builder of my home...currently underway. I am not in the construction business...just doing my own stuff. I bought a Porter Cable 350 Mag framing nailer to build my house. I have had no problems with it. I will say that to me the nailgun is probably the most dangerous tool I ever use...and I will run my Husy 372XP chainsaw all day many days...I have HUGE amounts of respect for the nail gun. I built the entire shell of the build with no electricity...running off of a cheap Generac ($500 5KW model) generator with a Craftsman 20gal compressor.
The day before electricity was finally turned on at my site, I waited a couple of months for NYSEG to get around to getting the easement...the compressor started to give me trouble running off the generator. We were nailing down the shingles (hired that out on my gambrel roof 30'+ in the air) and had to keep fighting with the breakers. At one point I purchased a 30A connector (twist lock NEMA type) for the generator to run the compressor. This worked, but I think I probably shortened the life of the compressor.
In summary, I'd by the PC 350 Mag again...I'd buy an Emglo compressor...not a crappyman...and I'd buy the generator if it is NOT extremely important to you. If you truely require day in/out dependability, i.e. you need it to get paid, or you must have backup power when the line is out, I'd buy something better. For example, my 10HP techumseh is VERY hard to start when she is cold. If I need it to run (never REALLY have) then I have to warm it up with the exhaust from the truck or tractor or something first.
The roofers I had help set my trusses, sheathing, and shingles (and 8 skylights!) did have a Paslode fuel gun. This was WONDERFUL when climbing in the trusses (I watched this from below) but when it came to sheathing, they switched to air. Cheaper to run per nail...and faster and reported earlier.
In the end, the nailer is WONDERFUL for sheathing...a true godsend...but I really enjoyed pounding all those 16D nails into my studs through the plates by hand. Tendonitis and everything...,makes me wonder how you pros do that day in and day out. Personally I couldn't get myself to use the nailer to nail my studs through the plates...this is were my nailgun fear took over. I'd never hold the stud square and aligned and nail through the plate (fear of bounce and double fire) and I never got comfortable holding the stud with a jig or tool. 16D pennies will sink in 3 blows easily once you get the hang of it.
Feel free to ask me anything about my owner/builder experience...I have done just about everything...and always for the first time...and very pleased with the whole experience and the outcome. Pictures to come...
Bruce
BIGBEN,
The PC guns are a pretty good gun for the money. We have 4 of them in our trucks. I am thinking about trying their new coil type framer. It holds more nails and fits into tighter spots. We use coil sheathing nailers for most sheathing work. I prefer the Emglo compressors, but whatever compressor you buy, see if they will let you plug it in and run it first before you buy. You can't believe the difference in noise level between different makes and models. This may not be as big a factor in framing but it's big when you're trimming inside the house. If you are going to run off a generator size accordingly. A 1 1/2 hp compressor will normally run ok for us on a 4000 watt generator but a 2 hp or bigger unit struggles. Go with the best generator you can buy. The Colemans etc that Sam's and Home Depot's carry are basically throw-aways in my book. Our best luck has been with Yamaha's, Honda's, and our latest, Makita. These will run $1300 on up but they are designed for longer runs with auto idle features, low oil shutdowns etc. They start better, run quieter and I think put out more power per stated rating than the cheapies.
The paslodes won't replace the air tools but are a nice compliment to them, or if you don't use a gun that often can be a one gun tool. I like them mainly for the safety aspect. Recently we were installing TJI's on the second floor of a 60,000 sq.ft. motel project, when one of my men tripped carrying an air framer. When he tried to catch himself he managed to nail himself to the top plate through his left hand. I went right out and bought 2 more paslodes and put one in everyone in the airs' hand. With these, they won't nail unless you follow the correct sequence of depressing the nose, pulling the trigger to fire. Plus no hose to trip you up or catch on something when walking above etc. They are a little slow for sheathing, so we don't use them for more than fill-ins on walls.
Bish
I have a PC framing nailer. Most of the time it either double fires or doesn't drive the nail completely. Is it bad or do I need to adjust it? I bought it a couple of months ago.
Steve,
Make sure you have enough air pressure to start with. We run 110 -120 lbs on our framers. If that isn't the problem I would check the drive pin. It should be ok if only a few months old but it may need replacement. Also make sure there isn't anything obstructing advancment of the nails. Good Luck.
Buddy of mine just built a cottage. He bought a generator and a campbell hausfeld compressor. His compressor went after a day. Motor burned up. Anyway it really depends on the size of the generator and the compressor. A compressor draws a lot of power. The problem is if a motor dosen't get the power it needs and still runs it will run inefficiently and eventually burn up. That's why you don't want to plug the compressor into an exstension cord. If you can get a temporary electrical service pulled to the site that would be best. In my area we don't usually get temp power pulled on site. Many builders use chainsaws and a gas powered compressor. I prefer a generator to run power tools and a seperate gas powered compressor. As for guns just bought a Bostich Coil framer. I just love it.
From what I hear while the delay in generator response could be a problem the core of the problem is that people don't use large enough generators. Motors are, largely, constant power devices. What they can't get in voltage they make up in current.
The motor windings are sized to run at a particular current draw. When forced to handle more current they over heat, damage the insulation and fail. This is only made worse by the increased current a motor needs during a start and the start - stop nature of a compressors life.
I have seen a few compressors run on generators for long periods of time by contractors. The compressors were all smaller commercial models and the generators were much heftier than would, on the face of it, seem necessary.