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Glazing Putty and Laminated Glass

Michael4653 | Posted in Construction Techniques on October 29, 2008 11:45am

Does anyone know of a suitable glazing putty product that can be used with laminated glass?  It is my understanding that traditional linseed oil-based glazing putty will attack the adhesive that binds the glass and inter layer.

Thanks,

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  1. User avater
    Sphere | Oct 30, 2008 01:16am | #1

    I think you mean insulated glass. In which case a urethane or poly urethane is the standard. Silicone is also a NO-NO, with insulglass.

    Laminated glass is similar to safty glass ( think windshields) and is unaffected by putty, but is most often ( in auto glass installs) urethaned as well.

    Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

    Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations

     

    They kill Prophets, for Profits.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_oEx4-Mc4

     

    1. Michael4653 | Oct 30, 2008 01:41am | #2

      I don't mean insulated glass, although I think it is the same issue.  The application is for safety glazing for wood doors and fixed side lights single glazed in the traditional manner in a rabbetted rail and stile frame and painted.  I am not familiar with products used for glazing automotive windshields, but the putty would need to be painted.

      I am in the process of writing specs for restoration and repair work for deteriorated wood doors and windows for an historic building and need a product name that I can specify.  I have found one product from Bostik of New Zealand, but nothing on this side of the Atlantic (or Pacific.)

      see the following link, particularly the last paragraph: http://www.bostik.co.nz/kwikpaint/kwikaint%20page2.htm

      Thanks for your reply. 

      1. User avater
        Sphere | Oct 30, 2008 02:04am | #3

        Well, I'd say it is Tempered saftey glass, in which case putty is fine.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

        Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations

         

        They kill Prophets, for Profits.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_oEx4-Mc4

         

      2. User avater
        Sphere | Oct 30, 2008 02:06am | #4

        BTW, I couldn't get the link to work yet.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

        Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations

         

        They kill Prophets, for Profits.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_oEx4-Mc4

         

        1. Michael4653 | Oct 30, 2008 02:15am | #5

          I may go ahead and use tempered glass, but my preference would be for laminated glass because when laminated glass breaks it remains in place and continues to secure the building until it is replaced.

          If you Google "Kwikpaint Glazing Putty" you will get the product that I found by Bostik New Zealand.  I just now sent an email to Bostik New Zealand and Bostik United States about the availability of product or a similar product in the United States.  We'll see what they say.

          Thanks,

          Michael 

          Edited 10/29/2008 7:16 pm ET by Michael4653

          1. sledgehammer | Oct 30, 2008 03:00am | #6

            If security is the concern putty and points isn't really going to keep busted laminated safety in place.

          2. Clewless1 | Oct 30, 2008 04:38pm | #12

            Why not? Assuming impact is only enough to break glass and not obliterate the window ... which in any case nothing will really hold the glass in place. Tempered glass shatters and falls out ... safety glass will break and stay in place (agian assuming a large object isn't actually going through the window. For example a baseball hitting safety/laminated may break it, but if not penetrating, it will remain in place.

          3. User avater
            Sphere | Oct 30, 2008 03:40am | #7

            I quit using putty a while ago, I have since adopted using Azek glass stops, caulked and pinned in place. No drying time, no shrinkage cracks, no mess, paintable, and reuseable.

            Works for me.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

            Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations

             

            They kill Prophets, for Profits.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_oEx4-Mc4

             

          4. fingers | Oct 31, 2008 12:47am | #14

            Are they (Azek glass stops)  something Azek makes and markets or do you make them yourself. 

            (reading your posts for these last several years makes me think they are something you custom make. yes?)

          5. User avater
            Sphere | Oct 31, 2008 01:23am | #15

            Yeppers, I rip 3/4" stock to 5/8ths wide, tilt the bandsaw table to approx 30 degrees, and rip triangles that ate 5/8th by 1/4" -0''. These vary from sash to sash and door to door, some sash I am making have 1 5/16" thick rails and stiles and muntins, and some doors are 1 3/4" thick. The size of the glass rabbet and the thickness of glass also affect the stop dimensions.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

            Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations

             

            They kill Prophets, for Profits.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_oEx4-Mc4

             

    2. Clewless1 | Oct 30, 2008 04:31pm | #11

      I've used silicone w/ insulated/double glazed units many times w/ no problems. Maybe the silicone isn't compatible w/ the butyl sealant ... but then again, I've never had a need or detail that didn't have the silicone contact only the glass. Not sure if I ever saw a situation where the edge sealant would ever have to contact e.g. glazing compound or any sealant around the edge.

  2. User avater
    Jeff_Clarke | Oct 30, 2008 04:15am | #8

    Call John Stahl and ask him about compatibility, but I think that this:  http://www.advancedrepair.com/glazing/glazing.htm is your product.

    View Image

    I don't see lammi glass in the FAQs - http://www.advancedrepair.com/glazing/faq_glaze_ease.htm

    Jeff



    Edited 10/29/2008 9:17 pm ET by Jeff_Clarke

    1. KenHill3 | Oct 30, 2008 07:58am | #9

      I have installed A LOT of insulated and single layer glass with acrylic-based caulk, nearly identical to the way John Stahl shows (I just used my bent glazier's knife instead of the special one Mr. Stahl shows). Also, in lieu of acetic-cure silicone, which as Sphere points out is a no-no with IGU's, you can use neutral-cure silicone (recommended by my IGU supplier).

      1. User avater
        Jeff_Clarke | Oct 30, 2008 08:15am | #10

        And the product isn't caulk.

         

        Jeff

    2. Michael4653 | Oct 30, 2008 05:43pm | #13

      Jeff,

      Thanks,

      I just called Advanced Repair Technologies and confirmed that Glaze Ease 601 is suitable for laminated glass.

      I haven't gotten a response back from Bostik yet.

      Michael

      1. User avater
        Jeff_Clarke | Nov 02, 2008 09:35am | #17

        I don't know what your application is but one of the disadvantages of using silicone is that if you ever break the glass it may be hell to remove the silicone.

        Jeff

  3. oberon476 | Nov 01, 2008 01:11am | #16

    As Kenhill commented, neutral cure silicones are fine to use with laminated glass.  Urethanes work fine as well. 

    Also as Kenhill pointed out, avoid acetic acid cure silicones because they can affect the PVB interlayer.

    I have never heard anything about linseed oil affecting PVB.  Although since laminated glass is typically used in impact or safety applications, it is typically siliconed in place for residential applications for the additional strength versus glazing putty.

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