Does anyone have any “tips” for hanging pre hung doors solo? Is it better to leave the door on the frame and install it all at once or take off the door, install the frame and then adjust for the door? I take the door off, square and plumb the hinge side, nail it in (not all the way), then put the door back on the hinges and adjust the top and latch side shimming until the door sets in good then nail it up. This seems to take me forever to get it just right. Figure there has to be a faster way. Also I would like to use my finish nailer to install some doors but don’t know what size/guage nails to use for the doors (raised panel hollow core/masonite). How long should a door installation such as this take anyway? Thanks for any tips.
Louis
Replies
There's lots of ways to go about it.
Here's the fastest one I know for low budget, economy type jobs.
I lay the unit down on the floor in the room that is on the hinge side of the openning. check that the legs are the right length. In other words, if the floor is off level, I might want to cut one leg of the jamb slightly shorter than another to compensate.
It's laying there with the head towards the openning and I cut and fasten the casing to it while on the floor.
Then I lift it into place and plumb the hinge side, nailing the casing to the wall framing. I follow across the top, keeping the reveal spread equally, and then down the knob side, still being sure to maintain the spread between door and jamb.
Then I open the door and stick some shims into the jamb in the proper locations, at hinges and at knobset and at bottom. I swing the door closed and open to check it all out, and that the stops are hitting equally. I stab a few nails into the jamb at those shim locations. If I am doing a bunch of doors, I precut a pile of 4-1/4" shims to be used all over the place. I can select them from the bucket quicker than playing around with cutting off reularly.
Then I case out the opposite side of the unit.
I only do locksets after all the doors are in - either for the whole job or for the day. It's not hard to do one every half hour once set up.
For good doors, I only get three or four a day with a different method.
Excellence is its own reward!
So many ways. Bet you can get 20 posts with all different themes. Here's a second version. Measure your legs like Piffin said. Depending on the floor, I might allow things just a hair shy so I can compensate with the tip of a shim if I need to lift it a touch.
Make the hinge side dead plumb. You can either stick shims in before the door or while it's there. 6 to one, half dozen the other. Assume while its there. I shim top down, since your legs can hang and if a door ever gets cross legged, the bottom is where you fix it. Force of habit to start at the top. Shim the hinge side plumb, then adjust the height of the latch leg if you're off a hair for the reveal at the top. Shim tight right below the head, then work your way down. I try to keep the reveal thin. On a PH, most of them a quarters width is good. I like to shim above and below the latch. Not as important on interior as exterior, but still something of a habit.
If you do it with the door off, you can cut a block the exact size of the width between the legs and use it to keep things even. Not real practical for a single door, but if you had 20 identical ...
I use a 15ga finish gun. If you have a second guy, I've left the stops off and hid the nails under them (you still get holes in the stops), then one can check for flush on one side while the other shoots the stops in. That's not a timesaver. It does give a little cleaner look for those who notice such things.
How long? Geez. If all you're doing is setting doors in good rough openings, 3-4 an hour. Start adding casing to both sides and you're probably (well, then at least I'm probably) closer to 45-50 minutes to get it all tight and cross pinned. When I bid, I just allow an hour per to hang and case and I don't have to worry about falling behind my schedule.
"The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
Mick, my two cents, I check the hinge side of the framing for plumb, "Oh, out an1/8" at the top for Plumb, I leave the door on, stick two shims on the floor where the jamb legs will rest, keeping in mind type floor covering going in. Lift door in place, with factory nails in doors edge pulled just before going in opening. Sap with your nail gun, or hand nail, hinge side at top and bottom, next to hinges, then Mick, relax, the door is all yours, have some fun with it, for some doors, well they laugh at me. Run an even reveal hinge side, then head, then latch side. Note; before you get to far along, you will need to close the door almost closed, and check the door edge with that of the jamb, depending on the severity of angle osis, a person can usually skew the latch side jamb to run an even revel with door edge. If head jamb needs to come down on latch side, well pull the shim out from under the jamb leg. My good friend, hangs his Doors exactly as Piffin wrote, with the type doors we are discussing here, Jim J.
I have a great tip that depends on how many doors you're going to hang....or if you need another long level.
a while back..I got the Stabila door hanger set....a 7' level and a 32"er.
The 7'er is just a bit shy...so it fits inside the average jamb. I got the one with magnets...most of the time it'll hang off the hinges by itself. I love it.
Helps spot a wavy jamb leg as U hang the door.
For prehungs/split jambs.....I'll usually leave the door hung.
For big french's or real heavy solid doors...I'll hang the jamb first the hinge the doors.
Biggest trick it to check the framing in all planes first...including cross legged......ie...bottom plate in line.
One good tool to have on hand is a sledge and a block to straighten the bottom plates before going any farther.
For french's.....a set of channel locks casn be used to tweak the hinges for that 99.99% perfect reveal....especially since most hinges have so much slop in them you can't make it perfect w/o some help.
Jeff
Buck Construction Pittsburgh,PA
Fine Carpentery.....While U Waite
"Biggest trick it to check the framing in all planes first."
Good point - the things we do automatically without thinking about it. Have you ever found a sheathed wall that is perfectly plumb on both sides? What? Maybe one in twenty?.
Excellence is its own reward!
and that's where the 2x block and sledge can come in handy.
You can smack drywall pretty good before ya bust up the drywall beyond repair.
Most jobs it stays in the van.....on those special few......it's right there next to the trim bucket.
JeffBuck Construction Pittsburgh,PA
Fine Carpentery.....While U Waite
Youre doing it the right way but, it sounds like you're trying to get it shimmed too good. Top and bottom hinges shimmed and leveled first, leave the middle hinge shim out until you get the other two nailed solid. Now that the hinge side is nailed (4 or 5) 15ga or 16 ga 2½ brads into each shim location (only nail into the shims and not above or below them) the doorstop should cover these nails later. Hang the door.
Now that the hinge side is set adjust the top of the door for reveal (gap) with hinges on either side of the head jamb. Pop a nail or two at these locations and once set, move to the bottom of the striker side. Close the door and make sure the jamb runs evenly from top to bottom with the face of the door while you are shimming the reveal. Sometimes this means that your jamb sits inside or outside the drywall finish a quarter inch or so (its okay, flatten the drywall out with your hammer to make room to flex the casing) Once the bottom is nailed in place you need one or two more shims on the striker side. Put the same number of nails into these locations and cut off shims with the saw of your choice. ( I like a dovetail saw ) After all of your doors are swinging, switch to an 18ga nailer for doorstop and casing. Adjust the reveal between the shims with the casing.
You can really speed things up if your casing, ornamental headers, plinth blocks and doorstop are precut. Glue your miters together and also to the wall. Sand your miters flush while the glue is still wet.
The best guy I've seen could hang 12-15 doors this way in an 8 hour shift with no mistakes. My best was 11 with no mistakes but I average about 8. We get paid by the door $45 to $55 cdn. I wouldn't complain if a worker hung 5 or 6 a day as long as there were no mistakes.
Turtleneck
Its not a smile- its a cramp
Edited 4/13/2003 3:26:07 AM ET by Turtleneck
keep plugging at it. You'll be hanging doors with all mthe methods above. Also keep in mind the enviroment and season. You might find yourself installing six panel wood doors in a damp basement. Try to find out about any rugs/ carpet etc. In old houses, swing the door around and check the gap between the bottom of the door and the floor through all the door's travel. What I'm trying to say is that you can screw up someones paint job coming back to trim off something because it expanded, plush carpeting installed etc.
Thanks for all the reponses, The new wood floors have gone down already so I will be setting the doors over the new oak strip flooring, is this ok? Or should have I installed the doors before the floor, I'm thinking after is better.
Yeah,, either way is fine with pros and cons both methods. Don't sweat it. Just cut the legs to the right length..
Excellence is its own reward!
I have read the archives and read installing and hanging doors by Gary Katz and I havent found what the hieght from finish floors the door should be or the range or what kind of floor any ideas?
Thanks for any and all replies
Jim III
In the absence of anything more speciifc from an archy, I like to have the door bottom 3/4" above finished floor for wood and tile floors, a bit closer for carpet, but not much. Carpet thickness can vary quite a bit.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
depends on the heating/cooling system too ...
forced air heat ... where an air exchange from room to room is a good idea ...
usually 3/4 to 1 inch up is "suggested" ... though most customers think 1 inch too high.
Also depends on the room ... I've hung french doors in first floor studys that have brushed the very top of the carpet ... makes for a better kid/sound" barrier.
JeffBuck Construction Pittsburgh,PA
Artistry in Carpentry
Sometimes we'll use an interior threshold for that kind of tight seal fit. Depends whether it will fit the interior styling.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Thanks for the replies I am hanging my first prehung doors the first one took about 4hours that should give you a laugh the the second one an hour and half the third and hour and I doubt i will get much quicker now but i have ten more to go. This is on my own house that I have been building for the last 2 years and 4 months I am a mechanic by trade and I have learned alot by reading on this forum and i sure appreciate the help everybody gives.
I am interested in the indoor thresholds i have sound proofed the masterbedroom and I want to put some sort of seal on the bottom of the door is there one you recommend
Thanks Jim III
As I'am sure that you are doing, you are just plain enjoying this, hanging your own doors. I really hope that you are, you earned it, just by getting to this stage of the game. Throw away the clock, and hang those doors, for the most part, pure candy for me, and should be for you also. Jim J
The sweet part is that they look so good and I am trying to make them fit perfect which is impossible cause the doors arent perfect and for sure my R.O,s are not perfect lol but I am getting very close to perfect I get better each door.
Thanks Jim III
lets also not forget the flooring. If you are going to tile you'll have to adj forthe that.
Darkworksite4:
Gancho agarrador izquierdo americano pasado que la bandera antes de usted sale
I have already tiled and put down the hard floor surfaces already so i could set the doors right on them.
Thanks for the reply, Jim III
I have a question. I am going to be hanging doors soon also. None of the finished floors are down meaning carpet and tile. Should they be down before i hang? Or do i hang then cut the bottom of the door or shim the door up.
In new construction it's usually doors/trimout before any flooring. The door jambs rest on the subfloor. The jambs will come long enough to compensate for your flooring. You just cut the jambs accordingly. Unless you've got something really strange going on, you shouldn't need to the cut the doors themselves.
When I install pre hungs, I usually block underneath the jambs to raise the door up so your flooring of choice can go beneath them.
With my luck, that 1/4" hardiebacker and ceramic tile that I cut the jambs for will get changed to vinyl before I drive the last nail! To each his own I guess.
thank god for gobs of caulk!
why would i have to cut the jambs?
Listen to the guys who are telling you to "scrap-up" beneath the doors I usually go with 3/4 under all,so long as they have any tounge on the bottom to begin with... uniformity matters considerably when observing a whole house... that is about where the exterior pre-hungs are when you look at the top jambs...
Scribe once, cut once!
What do you do if the finished floor height is going to be less than 3/4"? Most pre-hungs I see come with the jambs a good 2" longer than the door so you've got to cut 'em anyway right? Am I missing something? I've just never seen anyone lift them like that during new work.
If at all possible, I've tried to have the fiinished hard floor down before doors and trim. I know this is in a perfect world, but it makes things easier. For carpet, I generally lift the doors with 1/2 inch or so spacer so I can adjust the strike side as necessary.
BTW, I have found the method of removing the door from the hinges before I even set the jambs to work the best for me. I set the hinge side plumb, put the door on the hinges, then nail the strike side according to the door.
I know everyone has their way, but this has worked very well for me.
ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
On new construction doors first.You don't have to race the frames or trim the doors. On renovations floors first because you have to trim the door and the frame almost every time.And you don't want to trim them twice. Plus your floor is easier to install do to less cuts.
One method you want to try out is expending foam insulation.
Install the trim on one side of the door. Tack the door and spray some foam every 12". By the time you install 8-10 doors the foam is dry and you can trim the other side.
Few seams with foam and nails (Just to make sure )before you install the trim on the other side is not a bad idea and is easy and fast.
YCF Dino
same method i use as far as hanging goes. no carpet spacer though, i think the door ends up too high off the carpet (opinion of course), though i've been known to trim the jambs and space them if the carpet deserves it, or even trim the jambs so the door is only 1/2 off the fin floor, because i'm pretty anal about space under doors. other than that, i always set the jambs on the subfloor (unless floor is down, of course), even when i know what's coming next, even if i'm doing it. i undercut the jambs exact later with a scrap of flooring or tile so i don't end up with a gap because somebody changed their mind or the subfloor is out of level.
anybody else stick a shim and nail in the head to level the top on old work but not on new so the header shrinkage doesn't pull the top up? seems like the doors i pull generally have no nails in the top, but i like to use one in remod to keep the head level and plumb sideways in the opening before i nail off the latch side.
Sounds like you and I are cut from the same cloth when it comes to door hanging. That's pretty much my routine to the letter.
I've been thinking about the way you guys cut the jambs later. It makes sense to me, but do you usually cut them, or is it left up to the flooring guys? Most floor crawlers around here would probably turn around and go home if they had just one more step in their work.
Also, what's the tool you generally use to cut the jambs?
ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
I don't cut 'em. I set them on the subfloor and that's that. I've seen both hardwood guys and tile guys cut right around them with their work and I've seen them trim the jambs as well. No real "industry standard" on this one as far as I can tell.
On my own jobs when I need to trim the jambs I use a Japanese pull saw. If you don't own any of those style saws, you've got to get a couple of them. Get a few different sizes, you will love them....guaranteed.
Two things are left out in this chat, in the south, homes from 1920's to present that I consider thoughtfully constructed all have about a solid inch of draft area under the doors for ventilation,and allows for foundation shifting,(understandably not a factor elsewhere)[i get a lot of adjustment work with sale preps that include gypsum crack repairs in old homes]
I have seen a trend here toward tighter floor clearances here ( I think for mum n pop's privacy){ how did any thing happen with those big gaps under our doors?, it's a wonder I was born...}
Scribe once, cut once!
i undercut jambs and casing with a multimaster (great tool all-around, mondo expensive blades if you are in the habit of hitting nails like i am), though i've been thinking of buying the bosch flush cutter to check it out. that special expensive undercut saw leaves a gash in the jamb and casing, so that option was out. yes, it is up to the flooring guys, but that is sometimes me. i would never work with a flooring guy who didn't undercut, unless it's vinyl, then who cares. cutting around jambs and casing, well, it's just hacky, and i've never seen it look as good as sliding the flooring under. i think overall you save time undercutting. used to use the japanese pull saw, but discovered i lost my sense of satori when i had to cut around more than a couple doors. still use it for flush cutting plugs and such.
btw, if anyone has used the bosch undercutting tool and the multimaster, let me know how they compare. thanks.
From everything I hear, your Fein Multimaster blows away the Bosch hands down. As you know, that Fein does alot more than just flush cut. You could own the Bosch and still need a Multimaster, but I don't think you'd ever need the Bosch if you owned the Fein.
I do a lot of old work,and where the cover wood floors a lot here in the south. You know as with all things investigate the individual situation,(it sounded as if this guy was doing old work...) Get the lazer out and find the tops of all of the jambs...
Scribe once, cut once!
New construction the prehung door jambs are set on the sub floor. If you block up, the gap under the door will be too much. Every prehung door I have hung allows 3/4" to 1" for the floor finish.
mike
The reason they are called ROUGH opennings is because they are not perfect, nor intended to be.
We make out own interior thresholds with a tablesaw and power plane in a few minutes each but I seem to remember that you could order them from the lumberyard
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I've gotten in the habit of measuring the diagonals to check for squareness. Even though my first tests are for function and then for looks (reveals) the daigonal test always seem to help with that inevitable problem door. I've found this test really helpful with french doors. Also, if not mentioned yet, if installing in humid weather use a narrow reveal and in dry weather go wider for the inevitable expansion.
MES