Replies

1. 
   calvin | Nov 19, 2015 05:20pm | #1

   TWF

   I'd end the search by calling Hardie.

   who better to answer?

1. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 20, 2015 12:31am | #3

   Solid Color Stain

   calvin wrote:

   I'd end the search by calling Hardie.

   who better to answer?

   I did email them. As soon as I said "stain", the response was "no stain".  I was reminded of the old days with telephoine operators who were only allowed to choose from 13 responses.

   Also conacted Sherwin-Williams, got this:

   Thank you for contacting Sherwin-Williams online. We appreciate hearing from you.

   HardiePlank has very specific coating recommendations for their products. The recommendation for field applied primer and finish is:

   Satin Finish

   1st Coat: S-W Loxon Concrete & Masonry Primer Sealer, A24W8300

   (8 mils wet, 3.2 mils dry)

   2nd Coat: S-W SuperPaint Exterior Latex Satin, A89 Series

   3rd Coat: S-W SuperPaint Exterior Latex Satin, A89 Series

   (4 mils wet, 1.44 mils dry per coat)

   Early Moisture Resistant Finish

   1st Coat: S-W Loxon Concrete & Masonry Primer, A24W8300

   (8 mils wet, 3.2 mils dry)

   2nd Coat: S-W Resilience Exterior Latex Satin, K43 Series

   3rd Coat: S-W Resilience Exterior Latex Satin, K43 Series

   (4 mils wet, 1.52 mils dry per coat) 

   Deviation from the spec is likely to void any warranty you may have.

1. 
   renosteinke | Nov 20, 2015 08:40am | #5

   Make Your bed, Sleep In It

   Well, looks like you've got the 'official' answers.

   Don't like them? Think you know better? Well, go for it!

   Your plan, your judgement, your responsibility.

   Really now- what do you expect? Sure, it's a shame the way language is twisted by marketing and the way the 'corporate' mentality seems to institutionalize idiocy. We could chat on those topics all day.

   Yet ... what IF someone posted here some lovely advice and you followed it?  Guess what? It's still all on you. It's your call. If there's an issue, it's not the 'fault' of Hardy, the 'fault' of the paint maker, the 'fault' of the guy who said "OK." It's YOUR call amd your responsibility.

   There's certainly no one here who can give an 'expert' response to the use of an unknown product for any particular use. You pay your money, you take your chances. Sherwin-Williams was surprisingly detailed in their response; kudos to them.

   I'll say this much .... after painting some 50-year old never-painted asbestos-cement shingles - a product very comparable to today's modern cement-board products - I'd be amazed if there was anything you could do that wouldn't work. The stuff holds paint like magic.

1. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 20, 2015 09:14am | #6

   Make your bed, sleep in it

   renosteinke wrote:

   Yet ... what IF someone posted here some lovely advice and you followed it?  Guess what? It's still all on you. It's your call. If there's an issue, it's not the 'fault' of Hardy, the 'fault' of the paint maker, the 'fault' of the guy who said "OK." It's YOUR call amd your responsibility.

   Assessing the likely outcome is not the same as avoiding responsibility. It is an attempt to avoid wasting effort.

1. 
   deadnuts | Nov 27, 2015 11:35am | #7

   Staining Hardie a wasted effort

   There are only two categories of finishes: film and penetrating. Stains are penetrating finishes which are used to enhance the beauty of natural grain, add depth or tone, or hide unattractive sections of grain.   IMO, there is nothing advantageous toward using a penetrating finish on fiber cement board, because there is no inherent natural beauty to the product. It's an aesthetically bland slurry of paper pulp and Portland cement. True enough, penetrating finishes can impart a level of protection by impregnating or lightly coating underlying fibers. However, they don't do it very well and certainly not as well as film finishes.

   Thus, Sherwin William’s specific finishing advice should be well taken.

2. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 07:02pm | #8

   Solid cxolor Stain

   "There are only two categories of finishes: film and penetrating. Stains are penetrating finishes"

   I guess I am showing what an amatuer I am. I never thought of solid color acrylic stains as "penetrating". Basically, I thought they were just diluted paint.  I have been using it on my house for 30 years, I like it because it just seems to weather whithout ever requiring scraping. I also like the "finish" better than most paints. I am using a high quality aceylic masonry primer, if that is any good, I don't see why the top coat matters. I think I am just going to wing it with the stain.

2. 
   DanH | Nov 19, 2015 06:56pm | #2

   I would observe that the difference between "solid acrylic stain" and acrylic paint seems to be mostly marketing hype.

1. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 20, 2015 12:37am | #4

   Solid Coilor Stain

   DanH wrote:

   I would observe that the difference between "solid acrylic stain" and acrylic paint seems to be mostly marketing hype.

   That is my impression, but am wondering if the difference is less moisture resistence. Otherwise, I can't understand the problem.

3. 
   renosteinke | Nov 27, 2015 08:28pm | #9

   Words, Words, Words

   What's the difference? Sounds like an idea for a column in Fine Homebuilding..... :D

   Some years ago, I made the mistake of referring to a part of an industrial plant as the "paint booth." Let me tell you, those folks wasted no time correcting me: We don't use paint, we use a coating, they insisted.

   It seems there were all manner of regulatory and tax distinctions made between 'paints' and 'coatings' at the time.

   I would not be surprised to find a similar situation regarding 'paints' and 'stains.'

   All I know is that the 'stain' I put on my concrete porch was as thin as water and as opaque as any paint. It did NOT form the 'film' on top the same way as a 'paint' would do, and did not seem to affect the surface texture. I speculate that the 'stain' will not have the tendency to blister and flake as has paint, but only time will tell. It seems to me that using any "primer' would defeat any advantage a stain might have over a paint.

   Indeed .... do you ever use a primer with any sort of stain?

1. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 08:51pm | #10

   Words, words

   "Indeed .... do you ever use a primer with any sort of stain?"

   Interesting question. My purp[ose here is to seal the siding, I understand that its great enemy is moisture. Largely that the moisture will freeze and damage the siding.

   As I said above, I don't think of solid color acrylic  latex stain as a "stain" in the usual sense. I am not attempting to penetrate the surface in any way. The only practical distinction I know of between "solid color stain" and "paint" is that the paint lasts longer.

1. 
   deadnuts | Nov 27, 2015 10:57pm | #15

   another distinction...

   TWFAUST wrote:

   The only practical distinction I know of between "solid color stain" and "paint" is that the paint lasts longer.

   Actually (becasue of this thread) you now know of another practical distinction: That the siding manufacturer doesn't recommned it and won't warranty their product if used.

2. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 08:52pm | #11

   Words, words

    Intentionally Deleted

3. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 08:54pm | #12

   Words, words

    Intentionally Delted - Fat Fingers

4. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 08:55pm | #13

   Words, words

     Intentionally Delted - Fat Fingers

5. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 27, 2015 08:55pm | #14

   Words, words

     Intentionally Delted - Fat Fingers

4. 
   TWFAUST | Nov 29, 2015 09:48am | #16

   Foe what it is

   "I think whoever you spoke with was quick to rule out anything that has "stain" in the description whether or not it is truly stain in the traditional sense"

   That is exactly what I thought.

   Did you apply a field coat of primer?

   Much of what I have I picked at a "deal" 8 sq. for $75.00. It has the HZ5 green tint from the factory. Being mindful of "painting within 180 days", I have no idea how long it has been sitting around. I a thinking better safe than sorry.

    

5. 
   user-2409187 | Dec 05, 2015 09:22am | #17

   Hardy board siding finish

   I'm coming into this conversation a bit late. My son and I have done many fcboard jobs. We virtually never use factory pre-finished siding. We always prep and shape all our trim boards on site. We think the fake wood appearance is, um, fake; hence we usually special order smooth boards. They are a decent replica of smooth wood siding. 

   We start with factory primed fcb. We install; most often with concealed nails, but sometimes with screws. We caulk and, where there are slight heaves we apply the occasional face screw, lighlty counter sunk. Then we fill exposed fastner hole with sanded tile grout, since this cement based material is similar to fcboard siding. It dries hard, and when lightly sanded (DeWalt Oscillating tool with sander pad), primed and painted it looks just like the (smooth) siding. I often can't locate our repair spots after the paint job is done! We apply 3 coats of Sherwin William Duration paint. True, this paint is not easy to spread, as  it contains an additive that improves adhesion and durability. I gave a client on who's historic house we work in San Antonio, TX an unconditional 15yr warranty on the finish. 15 yrs later, the siding looks as good as new...well...almost. There is tons more I could say about the installaiton of primed fcbsiding. I'll hold off....unless you ask :)

   Stain penetrates. Paint adheres. A faux stain appearance can be accomplished, but I would not recommend it. I will never by the hair on my chinny chin, guarantee a stain job. :)

   Melchior (the other Wise Man...the sometimes-not-so-wise Mann :)

   wwwfroscarpentry.com 

   
1. 
   deadnuts | Dec 05, 2015 09:40am | #18

   pot calling the kettle black

   user-2409187 wrote:

   . We think the fake wood appearance is, um, fake; hence we usually special order smooth boards.

   Interesting to hear you make this statement while posting a photo of yourselves in front of what appears to be, um, a faux stone veneer entryway.

1. 
   user-2409187 | Dec 08, 2015 12:47am | #22

   pot calling the kettle

   D-nuts

   I think you may have peanut butter on your glasses! Interesting that you should base your opinion on a tiny photo! What you see in the pic. is virgin Texas stone, laid before you were born; well before I was born 1950. The photo shows how youth persists through hard manual work! I think it's sand stone,  but I won't swear to it. Now go get your kleenex box! :)

2. 
   TWFAUST | Dec 05, 2015 02:23pm | #19

   Hardy board siding finish

   Thank you for the hint on sanded grout. I had been wondering about what filler to use.

    

   I hope I haven't given anyone the impression that I am looking for a "wood effect". It  is just that I have been using solid color stain for years, and learned to like it.

1. 
   user-2409187 | Dec 08, 2015 01:08am | #23

   Hardy board siding finish

   TW

   Let me make it clear that I do face fastening only occasionally. This may be necessary because one board does not overlap the lower board snuggly. The problem tends to happen with a larger, say 7.25" exposures. I pre drill a hole about 3/4-1" above the bottom of the siding piece. My GRX finish screw will penetrate both boards. I do this so as to avoid the small chance that the brittle siding board cracks. The screw must be lightly countersunk. I prefer to aim for a stud, My butt joints tend to fall between studs. 

   The sanded grout I referred to earlier is mixed to a stiff consistency and applied slightly proud of the siding plane. Try it. Be sure to prime it. There are other filler products that work well too.

   Take a look at this photo. We place scraps around the windows to act as siding spacers. We paint the siding. Then we shape, paint and install our trim boards. A final coat of paint is applied after the installation is completed. Doing it this way allows us to work with different color paints.  In case you are wondering, the homeowner specifically asked us not to replace the windows. We fixed them! 

   
3. 
   TWFAUST | Dec 05, 2015 02:25pm | #20

   Hardy board siding finish

    Deleted - pushed "post" too many times as nothing seemed to be happening.

4. 
   TWFAUST | Dec 05, 2015 02:25pm | #21

   Hardy board siding finish

     Deleted - pushed "post" too many times as nothing seemed to be happening.