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Hardwood Floor – no subfloor

richk1 | Posted in General Discussion on September 9, 2005 04:14am

The lower level of my 75 year old house has T/G pine floors with no subfloor – they’re attached directly to the floor joists. A bunch of them are a little loose and squeek. We want to put down hardwood floors in some of the rooms. What is the best way prep for the new floor?

Screw down the loose flooring and run the new flooring perpendicular over the top?

Put down some 1/4″ ply over the existing flooring then add the new floor?

Tear out the old floor and put down 3/4″ ply as a new subfloor? (probably the best but the old flooring continues under the partition walls and I don’t want my 2 year old falling into the basementwhile I’m working)

Thanks,

Rich Knab

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Replies

  1. User avater
    johnnyd | Sep 09, 2005 06:26pm | #1

    "Screw down the loose flooring and run the new flooring perpendicular over the top?"

    That's what I would do.  Lay some felt or rosin paper before the hardwood.

  2. JohnT8 | Sep 09, 2005 09:39pm | #2

    Just treat the pine T&G as underlayment. 

    jt8

    "Knowing trees, I understand the meaning of patience. Knowing grass, I can appreciate persistence."
    -- Hal Borland  

  3. richk1 | Sep 10, 2005 01:12am | #3

    Thanks for the advice. I was hoping I could treat the existing floor as a subfloor.

    Rich Knab
    People of mediocre ability sometimes achieve outstanding success because they don't know when to quit.

    1. mbdyer | Sep 11, 2005 04:54am | #4

      Depending on when the house was built, the pine T&G was the subfloor and the finish floor wasn't put in except in a few areas.  In my 1930 built home the sub is all long pine T&G finished only in a 16" band around the perimeter of each room the center unfinished for a rug I guess.  The living and dining room however have oak flooring ontop of the pine, executed with a nice wide perimeter band (the dining room is a pentagon).  So I figure they spent the money for the good stuff in the "show" areas.  Screw down loose boards, cover with rosin and then finish floor.  You're just picking up where the builder left off.

    2. Grizzly | Sep 11, 2005 06:07pm | #6

      How thick is the Pine? How flat is it currently. What is your current ceiling height. I would consider all of the above before deciding on how to proceed. 3/4" height makes a big difference in a room so before I would go adding more subfloor and then the hardwood I would consider the above. Let us know what you do.

      Byron

  4. User avater
    RichBeckman | Sep 11, 2005 06:11am | #5

    Is the existing floor really flat?? I mean REALLY flat??

    The manufacturers instructions I've seen for hardwood floors are very specific that the flooring must run perpendicular to the joists.

    Since your existing floor must be running perpendicular, you are going to have to run the new floor parallel with the existing.

    If there is any cupping in the existing, the new floor will be running up and down those slopes.

    The one time I ran into this, I cut the existing flooring back to the walls that ran perpendicular to the joists and back to the last joist before walls that were parallel to the joist and then sistered those joists.

    Then I put down 3/4 ply, 15# felt, and then the flooring.

    Rich Beckman

    Another day, another tool.

    1. mbdyer | Sep 11, 2005 07:02pm | #7

      Is this true for strip sub-floor and ply?  I've seen finish flooring run every which way, usually running for parallelism to a long wall or down a hall.  Is this dependent on how thick the finish flooring is?  Perhaps a thicker wood can be run perp or diagonal?  A good rough sand to the sub seems in order to let the new lay flat of course.  What about parquet? Is a 3/4 sub securely fastened to the joisting enough?

      1. User avater
        RichBeckman | Sep 12, 2005 06:37am | #8

        "Is this true for strip sub-floor and ply?"Well, my experience is limited. But instructions that I have seen said run it perpendicular to the floor.I have been told that if the subfloor gets thick enough, then it doesn't matter, but 3/4" isn't thick enough.I just know what I've been told and that's what I've done.Rich BeckmanAnother day, another tool.

  5. richk1 | Sep 12, 2005 05:07pm | #9

    To answer some of the questions-

    The floor is flat. My guess is that the former owner/house flipper had the floor sanded and finished before selling.

    The pine is 3/4" thick.

    Ceiling height isn't bad - 98" (at the lowest part of the sag in the center of the room, yeah the wife has me fixing that too).

    I'm still torn on what to do- wife wants to just use the existing as subfloor, I'm leaning toward just cutting out as much as possible then laying down 3/4" ply.

    Thanks for all of the ideas,

    Rich Knab

    1. BryanSayer | Sep 12, 2005 07:26pm | #10

      Uh, how about leaving it alone? I had the same thing previously, and nothing wrong with it. You can secure the squeeky boards with some face nailed flooring nails (or even finish nails, but flooring nails grab better). I love the look of yellow pine floors. Some houses built less expensively did not have sub-flooring.

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