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Hardwood flooring meets stair landing

| Posted in General Discussion on February 19, 1999 06:26am

*
A year ago I replaced ugly carpet in a small second-floor bedroom of my 90-year-old colonial with 2-1/4 oak strip flooring. Under the carpet and masonite, the original subfloor (2×8 I guess, not T&G) was beyond saving: severely worn, choked with nailheads, and bowed (between one wall and another, about 12 feet, it dipped more than 1.5 inches. So I added 3/4 plywood over the whole floor, shimming where necessary with long strips of scribed-and-cut 2×4’s to make everything come out even. Now I want to continue the hardwood into the small carpeted common area outside the bedroom, where the subfloor is also in terrible shape.
I could use plywood over the subfloor again. That would bring everything level with the new bedroom floor.
But what about the top of the stairs? With 1.5 inches of new flooring, that last step would be a doozy. The look and proportion of the staircase would be ruined.

Was I stupid or what? How do I extricate myself?

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Replies

  1. Guest_ | Jan 30, 1999 03:14am | #1

    *
    You must know there is no easy way out of your situation. So lets see what you may be thinking... Sell the problem to somone else...drop down at the bedroom doorway...slope the hall floor...build new set of stairs (this time make sure you are happy with the other end of the stairs floor elevation first so we don't get that post next year.) You can handle this, if not sell the tools...Good luck.

  2. Lawrence_Downes | Jan 30, 1999 04:20am | #2

    *
    thanks for your reply! the only other thing i can think of, short of replacing the stairs, is covering the old treads with new ones, thus increasing the height of each step, with a bit of overhang, then hiding the bullnose end of the old tread with cove molding (?). the stairs are carpeted, and from the creaking I can imagine that the wood underneath is not pristine.
    Of course, that does sound like possibly more trouble than it's worth.

  3. Guest_ | Jan 30, 1999 04:49am | #3

    *
    I didn't mention your idea as I'm not fond of carpet on stairs joining wood upper level floors. It can be done nicely but I've seen some pretty scarey jobs too. As you know strange stair transitions and uneven rises are major trip zones. If your carpet on the stairs needs replacing anyway, then you should have no problem splitting up the pesky inches diference and burying it somewhere in your rework without alot of cost or time involved. I would also use glue and screws at the same time to fix up stairs, lesson squeaks etc. Enjoy.

    Jack

  4. daniel | Jan 30, 1999 05:11am | #4

    *
    Tough, tough, tough situation. Since you seem to want to keep regular stair spacing (extremely important in my book for safety), dropping the floor at the BR threshold seems like the best solution. One way to do this is tearout the existing subfloor of the common landing area, screw and glue ledger boards to the sides of the floor joists, and drop in new subfloor strips - which end up coplanar to the tops of the joists. Now the new flooring you add will end up being the same elevation as the original subfloor. Hope you have a lot of spare time for this project...good luck.

  5. Guest_ | Jan 30, 1999 12:34pm | #5

    *
    Lawrence, I'd go with Daniel's suggestion... if all is well with the stairs otherwise. Not an uncommon idea either. What's the size of the common area? If large enough, you may step-down a three by three area directly above the top step, (like a landing) and do the remaining area at full height.

  6. StevenH_ | Feb 04, 1999 08:06am | #6

    *
    We had the same problem and did what George recommends. The stairs were already installed and had uniform rise and run, but did not allow for the new 3/4" wood floor on top of the old (a last minute change in the plans). With the inspector's permission, we put a three by three foot "landing" at the top of the stairs, and installed step-down oak trim mitered to the three sides. The step-down trim changes the 3/4" thickness down to about 1/8. We painted the landing at the top of the stairs a durable white. It works fine, and even looks like a safety feature.

    1. Lawrence_Downes | Feb 06, 1999 06:06am | #7

      *Thank you for the tips. The step-down sounds ingenious. I had been baffled, now I'm getting optimistic again. I'm grateful.

  7. Guest_ | Feb 07, 1999 10:27pm | #8

    *
    StevenH, doesn't this "fix" simply re-create the trip hazard in another spot?

    I'm sometimes skeptical about inspector's fixes. Once, I informed an inspector at the city hall about my neighbor's "health and safety" violation regarding their alternate fire escape: the rear rear entrance had two risers, one 8". the next 11"!

    The next morning, the builder, inspector, and the head building inspector were out on the drive scratching their heads. Finally they sorted out the problem, and the builder had his crews make the needed repairs.

    The result: Two equal rises of 9.5"!

    Go figure!

    blue, framin in MI

    Remember, "There are 3 kinds of people: those who can count & those who can't."

    1. Guest_ | Feb 07, 1999 10:44pm | #9

      *Lawrence, I'd probably opt to leave the carpet and leave the small change in the doorway. The significant difference in materials automatically causes the senses to make small adjustments in the step over. Additionally, thresholds of one type or another work well too.I do know of a few builders who carpet the center area of their oak staircases quite effectively. Don't discount this option too quickly because there might be a relatively easy fix there.Basic stair codes requires that differences in risers must not exceed 3/16 on any flight. That means that you will not be able to accomodate that 1.5" no matter how many ways you try to figure it. There will be some fudging, which will compromise the safety of the staircase. Don't do it!You might be able to laminate the treads, carpet, and then refloor your foyer too! You seem to like reflooring, so give that a thought. Of course, you'll have to re-build the basement stairs...Sigh! Where will it all end?Blue, a stair framin' maniac from MIRemember, "Liars can figure, but figures don't lie!"

      1. Guest_ | Feb 08, 1999 05:55am | #10

        *I always heard that as "liars figure and figure lie!"

  8. Niles_ | Feb 08, 1999 09:17pm | #11

    *
    I own a 100+ year old Victorian Home, which I am restoring and remodeling. I am in the process of replacing hardwood floors, old floors beyond repairs. On part of the home I have stripped out all old hardwood floors. The old subfloor is 3/4" (well more like 7/8") pine boards of different widths The gaps between boards are 1/4" to 3/4". I renailed all boards and all so screwed boards down with Teflon deck screws. I was trying to get rid of squeaks in floor. I have two problems to solve yet. 1. The boards are not perfect; the floor is not perfectly flat surface varies 1/16th to and 1/8th . 2. I am now concerned with nailing new floor (the new hardwood floor) into joist, with all the screws and nails used in old subfloor I am afraid I will hit these nails and screws while nailing new floor.
    The original floor was nailed over this subfloor, why can't I do the same?
    Does the nailing of hardwood floors need to be into the joist or can you just nail into the boards?
    I thought of installing another layer of subflooring, but when I get to foyer we have the problems of the stairs, tread height is off. Replacing old subfloor is a real pain walls sit on top of it. I thought of replacing center part of room with new subfloor, this would take a lot of shimming since new subfloor would be ¾" and meeting old at 7/8ths+. Also thought of shimming right over old subfloor with 30# felt, which would be like a puzzle.
    Just how even does subfloor need to be for installation of hardwood floor over it?
    I welcome any suggestions. Help! Niles

    1. StevenH_ | Feb 16, 1999 06:17am | #12

      *Hi Blue-eyed Devil and all,I was pondering your question about the safety of the second floor "landing" I built with the step-down edges, and went back upstairs to test it out: It still feels safe, and lots safer than an uneven rise. The different color and texture help. My toes glide up or down the bevel, and I'm far enough away from the stairway that stumbling wouldn't pitch me down the stairs. After 14 months no problems for me, Lady GC, or the two bare-footed small ones. Course now that I know it might be a hazzard...!

  9. Lawrence_Downes | Feb 19, 1999 06:26am | #13

    *
    A year ago I replaced ugly carpet in a small second-floor bedroom of my 90-year-old colonial with 2-1/4 oak strip flooring. Under the carpet and masonite, the original subfloor (2x8 I guess, not T&G) was beyond saving: severely worn, choked with nailheads, and bowed (between one wall and another, about 12 feet, it dipped more than 1.5 inches. So I added 3/4 plywood over the whole floor, shimming where necessary with long strips of scribed-and-cut 2x4's to make everything come out even. Now I want to continue the hardwood into the small carpeted common area outside the bedroom, where the subfloor is also in terrible shape.
    I could use plywood over the subfloor again. That would bring everything level with the new bedroom floor.
    But what about the top of the stairs? With 1.5 inches of new flooring, that last step would be a doozy. The look and proportion of the staircase would be ruined.

    Was I stupid or what? How do I extricate myself?

  10. Guest_ | Feb 19, 1999 06:26am | #14

    *
    The 3/4" difference is probably not going to be much of a trip hazard in the middle of a floor. Your change in color helps to advertise the change.

    The floor changes height in the house that I currently reside in. The ceramic tile was installed over a mud base, and is about 3/4" higher than the carpeting that it abuts. I trimmed the change with a 2 1/4" oak tear drop casing. It looks nice. The naturally sloped moulding provides a subtle transition. We too have never had a trip problem. I think that highlighting the change helps a ton.

    Glad everything worked out for you. Don't believe in jinxii!

    Blue

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