Here’s your chance to weigh in with suggestions for evaluating hole saws.
In my shop I have nearly every brand and type of hole saw known to humankind – carbon steel, bimetal, carbide tipped (multi and few toothed), diamond and carbide grit rimmed. Plus I have a few sets of self-feeding hole drills (typically used by electricians, plumbers and other hole hogging trades).
I’m determined to figure out if there are in fact appreciable differences between different brands with regard to cut speed, usability after cutting through errant nails, plug popping and whatever else seems worthy noting.
I’ll also sort out the mandrel / arbor issues with the two pin threaded, two pin snap collared, and quick release versions.
What qualities do you want to know about hole saws?
What features mean the most to you (plug popping, smooth cut, speed, ability to cut steel w/out damage)????
What brands have you used that suck (and why)?
What brands have you used that were great (and why)?
We may try something new with this review. Rather than giving the all the ins and outs of every brand, we may just profile the top few performers and a few runners up in the magazine relegating the rest to an online blog post. That way regular FHB readers don’t have to slog through dense pages of dribble to see what hole saws are best. And for those tool hounds who do look for the finer points of parsing up tool qualities, they can find it on the FHB website.
Thanks
Mike
Replies
I posted something here and now it is gone. Where did it go?
You posted your reply in my Editors Corner post; it's still there. I posted my original message 2X (Editors Corner and Tools) figuring many BT'ers would miss one or the other. You obviously make the rounds.Sorry, I didn't mean to confuse you.MG
Having information in two places will be more confusing.
:)
it's actually in 3 places - see if you can find the one you're missing ;)
Sounds like a challenge :)
Real world test. Drill through double 2x of 80 year old fir and then new spruce full of huge knots.
Also, minimum size of drill needed.
I've been using any brand of bimetal bits. Lenox is my current favorite though I'm not especially partial. If I recall correctly the De Walt holsaws cut 1 3/4" rather than the standard 1 1/2" and I find the extra the depth useful if trying to cut through 2x material. I think this is the only characteristic besides bimetal that I would look for to choose one brand over another.
I have a few carbide and don't give them any special consideration.
I prefer to use the milwaukee mandrel that screws on and then the two pins screw in with a separate collar. I or a helper occasionally forget to spin the two pins in and the holsaw gets screwed on super tight. This is frustrating. A plumbers strap wrench and a socket wrench on the shank works to loosen it but it is a bother.
I also have the two pin snap in place mandrels also and I find that the collar that slides the pins gets knocked up out of the holsaw occasionally creating the same problem described above. Given the ease of knocking the pins out I would say this is my second choice and the screw on with no pins is my last choice that I would never buy.
I bought a Lenox mandrel that has long pins to eject the plug and rarely use it as it's additional length is sometimes a bother.
I am curious if anyone else sharpens their holesaws. I can do a mediocre job of sharpening a trashed holesaw on the bench grinder in a minute or two. I won't say it is as good as new but it puts it back in service and saves a trip to the lumberyard for a new one to finish the day.
I get the angles close but the big problem is getting each tooth the same height. Sharpening is still a big improvement over dull even if it can't match new performance.
I definitely want a holsaw that can cut steel, whether it is the all too frequent nail or making a hole in an electric panel.
I also run into problems with breaking pilot bits on large holsaws. It would be interesting to know what characteristics replacement pilot bits should have.
Karl
I definitely want a holsaw that can cut steel, whether it is the all too frequent nail or making a hole in an electric panel.
Small holes for 1/2" or 3/4" fittings would be best made with a step bit over a holesaw.
Bigger holes are a toss up between a punch set and a holesaw. The punch set makes nicer holes, but takes more time. If I had to make lots of holes in panels, I would look at an annular cutter.
Holes in wood with nails? Carbide tipped holesaw.
I sharpen mine with an angle grinder and thin (1/16) cut off wheel. I don't pay TOO much attn to leveling or more correctly said 'jointing" the teeth, but after a few sharpenings the set is too far gone anyway. That is the hard part.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"If Brains was lard, you couldn't grease much of a pan"Jed Clampitt
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I primarily use hole saws for door hardware, not concerned about cutting steel, but clean entry holes are essential as well as longevity. Longevity is the most important to me.
I have used dewalt and ridgid brands in the past with mediocre results.
Seems like a small thing but getting a screwdriver into some of the holesaws to remove stubborn cutouts is impossible.
A question for you, in your recent article about deck boards, I think I noticed you were using Simpson Quik drive fasteners, were you using the screws with Quik Guard coating on them? Is that coating sufficient for ACQ rated wood? I bought the Quik Drive system last year and have been using their stainless screws but I have clients asking for screw heads that don't stand out.
Actually did this last week by chance.
Emergency dry-up of a guys basement from flooding, had 3/4" ply as walls on 2x framing for their "finished" basement. Don't ask why. But needed to blow 2" holes in each stud bay to get some air flowing.
Started with the two blu-mauls we picked up on the way over. Right of the bat these have never been a top notch brand hole saw regardless of size, type or mandrel. 1st 2 plugs stuck in each and too hot to handle. Went to truck and grabbed every 2" saw I had figuring as the plugs get stuck switch em' and rotate them as they cool and can un-plug.
Next 2 picks in hand where left overs, brand new, from a job that required clean centred boars in 2" thick armored plate steel.
on that job I found the two pin Morse titanium cobalt grit, a $60-$80 2" hole saw, saw only, no bit and not a set for that price, that was intenteded for steel was worthless. I got 1/2" in one plate before it was burned up.
Following forman and I decided we'd use the Morse carbide tip regular bi-metal 2" at closer to $40 and as they burned up no big deal. I did get 1 1/2 to 2 full bored holes in the plates before starting to snap teeth on those so they held in there.
Back to last weeks job, knowing the above on armored steel I figured that on the 3/4" ply, "watch this baby" and pulled out one of the unused Morse bi-metals. They'll bite and grab so quick and hard I ended up bending a pilot bit. Not a big deal since I was more impressed by it's bad arse-ness ability, just zipped that ply like nothing. It seemed the winner after a few holes until I got a stuck plug and switched.
Next was a 2 pin and I don't know the brand, there isn't any stamp on it other than bi-metal HSS but it's orange and I swear I picked it up with a lockset install kit from the depot. This one didn't rip like the Morse but was productive, and fairly quick, but most of all I finished the job with this one because it never got a stuck plug. Don't know the difference or why but all plugs just fell out.
So;
Blu-maul
####, fixed or 2 pin, cut speed, cleanness, plug ejection, only good for wasting monney.
Supper high end Morse titanium cobalt grit $60-$80 one bit, very smooth hole but didn't last on hardened steel as intended, so not sure of it's use as it's listed for stainless steel and armor.
Morse carbide tipped 2 pin bi-metal $40 cuts like a mo - fo and means business, will make a quick and hard run on 4" or more of hardened steel and if you can hold on to it I used them with over half it's teeth gone to finish some of the steel holes. On wood, no prob. but you may get plugs stuck.
Unknown orange one, nice cut, nothing to complain about but stays plug free is it's plus and cheap.
I saw the other day that Milwaukee has a new designed hole saw. Didn't take a real look at it, but I think it had just a few teeth and something special about the teeth. Was a little more money than whatever else was sitting on the shelf.
Anyone had any experience with this new Milwaukee?
Live by the sword, die by the sword....choose your sword wisely.
I wonder if you mean these:
http://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-49-56-9085-10-Piece-Big-Hawg/dp/B0013WCSZ4/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1241317545&sr=8-1
My plumber showed me his new set a few days ago. We didn't have anything to drill a hole in, so I didn't get to try them, but they look really good. 3 big carbide teeth, and the pilot drill is a 3/8" spade bit.
Yes, those are the ones! Thats not that bad of a price for the set.
Live by the sword, die by the sword....choose your sword wisely.
Plumber got 'em for ~$120 from Ferguson. They give him great deals on tools.
Maybe you could find a way of measuring how much force is applied between the handle, the hand and the immovable object when the bit jams, but the big old Hole Hawg keeps turning.
Neat topic -Here is my question . What is the best holesaw for Melamine cabinets ?(commercial office fit-outs)
I find that the bi-metal saws burn up prematurely. Thanks and I look forward to the article.
When I'm using a hole saw, there are two key questions that interest me:
1) How fast will it drill?
2) How likely is it that the saw will bind (usually when I'm rocking it to get it to drill faster) and knock me off the ladder while simultaneously twisting my arm off at the elbow? ;-)
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Everything fits, until you put glue on it.
Mike,
For drilling wood, the big issues for me are safety, i.e.- not grabbing and locking up, and swarf clearance. Lots of saws are sold with too little set for wood, so you have to peck and peck to clear the swarf and keep things cool. Besides, insufficient set tends to cause stuck plugs, too.
Edge life matters, too, and Lenox holesaws are great for this, just like all their other bimetal blades. The set is not enough, so they need too much pecking to keep cutting in wood. This may be a compromise so that the same saw can cut both steel and wood. Steel wants less set than wood.
For your test, drilling in real-world situations through various materials, including out-of-position drilling, would be most informative. Ease of plug removal is huge, especially with wet wood.
Bill
2-pin snap collared mandrel hands down for me!!!
Un-threading a HS that has been tightened with a 1/2" hole-hog is not my idea of productivity. Never tried the "ejecting" models, but I can disassemble and clean the plug out of a properly assembled snap-collar mandrel in less than half a minute.
I'd love to see some finer toothed saws regularly available. Big teeth grab too easily and throw my narrow #### off ladders and such.
The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
Three aspects are important to me with hole saws - how well they cut, how long they last, and how easy is it to get the plug out. Worst are any of the old fashioned bi-metal hole saws in terms of all three aspects. If it takes me 3 minutes to cut the hole and 3 minutes to get the plug out with a $8 bi-metal hole saw compared to 15 seconds to cut a hole with a modern design that costs $40 and have the plug just fall out to the ground, which tool is the better value? Well if I am only cutting one hole for myself the bi-metal makes more sense but if I am cutting dozens or hundreds of holes than a conventional hole saw is the worst possible choice.
The Milwaukee Hawg hole cutters really were the first of the new designs to provide solid performance but are restricted to cutting wood. The new "multipurpose" hole cutters, like the ones from Bosch, Blue Boar, and Starrett, will cut a wider range of construction materials and outlast dozens of bi-metal hole saws.
I was at a recent job where the electrician needed to cut 6-1/4" holes in a fiber cement soffit and managed to barely cut 3 holes with a bi-metal hole saw but came back the next day with a Blue Boar TCT hole cutter and flew through the rest of the job. I have seen electricians and plumbers show up to a large job with a hole case of hole cutters and they hoped that would be enough.
I recently used the multipurpose Blue Boar hole cutters from Hole Pro that they sent me to evaluate on a project where I used them to cut fiber cement board, stucco, Wonderboard, sheetrock, plaster, wood, OSB, and MDF. Clean holes were cut in seconds and the plugs were easy to remove so I could start the next hole. The also have a 2-1/4" cutting depth which like the Bosch multipurpose with their 2-1/8" cutting depth is very handy. Even so called "deep" hole saws max out at 1-5/8" which is often not enough when having to cut from one side only.
Easy plug removal depends on the tooth rake, inner and outer tooth set, and the number and width and depth of the gullets. Bi-metal hole saws don't even have gullets. Really deep gullets can cause the side walls to "cave-in" which I know is technically not quite the best way to describe it but hopefully you get the idea. Thicker side walls and thicker base plates add weight but they also allow for better gullet shapes and depth which can be seen on both the Milwaukee Hawg high speed steel hole cutters and the Blue Boar Universal tungsten carbide tipped hole cutters.
There is a convenience factor for me in knowing that when I arrive with my little case of hole cutters that I am set no matter what I need to drill at a job and that I will be able to finish the job. I suspect that my drills will last longer as they do not need to be pushed through the wood as with a bi-metal bit which has to be easier on the bearings.
Hole cutting efficiency needs to be measured in another way that is important to consider. I have seen quite a few people hurt by improper use of a Milwaukee Big Hawg 15 lb. drill and sometimes the job just did not allow for a perfect setup, like drilling through framing members while up on a ladder. Even the Big Hawg is rated for a maximum hole saw size of 4-5/8" with wood. My DeWalt 600RPM 1/2" cord drill is rated for a maximum hole saw size of 3-1/2" in wood, and my lithium-ion cordless drills are all rated for hole saws under 2" in diameter when boring into wood.
With the Milwaukee Hawg and Hole Pro's Blue Boar 6-1/4" hole cutters I can bore through wood using even my 18v cordless drills. I can also cut a lot more holes on a single battery charge.
But my favorite hole making tool by far is a Hole Pro X-230 hole cutter that can cut any size hole from 1-7/8" up to 9" in diameter. I have cut 8" holes in 3/4" plywood with a 18v cordless drill using this tool. The reason hole saws are not made larger than 6-1/4" is that no drill will drive them and if a drill was made that could drive them few people could or would want to use them. And once you get past 4" hole diameters the sizing tends to go in 1/4" increments and past 5" it is 1/2" increments.
With the X-203 I can make the exact size hole I need, whether 8-1/4" for spiral duct runs or 4-5/8" for ABS vents, or even 8-1/8" for some Liton CFL recessed light cans.
I even use it now for patching holes from cable runs. I cut plugs from scrap using the Hole Pro that are 3" in diameter and make the holes the same size and patch as I go. The plugs are of the same fireproof material and the edges are so tight I am tempted to just paint without a layer of mud. I do the same when making plumbing repairs as it is a lot faster than cutting out the sheetrock from stud to stud and patching the large opening afterwords.
It may not apply to "fine homebuilding" but a buddy who is a mechanical contractor in Montana has been working on a big job on a base that involves 200-300 10" holes through TGI in each building. They cost a couple of the Hole Pro adjustable hole cutters and they have been able to use just one $17 pair of tungsten blades to complete each building. I cannot think of any other tool that would do this kind of job day after day and cut that large a hole in TGI with a hand drill (Makita 3/8" right angle corded drill) and also be so cheap to keep running.
gotta link to that, I'm lazy.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"If Brains was lard, you couldn't grease much of a pan"Jed Clampitt
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I never heard of Hole Pro. They have full line of every type of hole saw. Thanks for your comments. The article is already done at this point so unfortunately we can't include the brand but I will pass it along. Mike