Replies

1. 
   razzman | Feb 26, 2006 09:39pm | #1

   Greetings bpm1,  Welcome to Breaktime.

   This post, in response to your question, will bump the thread through the 'recent discussion' listing again.

   Perhaps it will catch someones attention that can help you with advice.

   Cheers

   'Nemo me impune lacesset'
   No one will provoke me with impunity

2. 
   PeteVa | Feb 26, 2006 11:16pm | #2

   You need to get rid of that turn up or install a self purging water filter. Fuel oil should flow well below 20 degrees if there is no water present.

   Your current setup is a perfect water trap to make sure things gum up.

1. 
   bpm1 | Mar 01, 2006 09:31pm | #3

   That's what I had thought...serves me right for listening to the service guy.

   Do you think I should do both, and if so would I be correct that I need to install this water filter indoors ? Otherwise that'd freeze right up to, or does the water run out so it wouldn't collect and freeze?

   And since my wife is gonna ask who I'm taking advice from...are you a plumber, boiler guy, or just a generally smart dude?

   Thanks, Brian

1. 
   PeteVa | Mar 01, 2006 10:57pm | #4

   You need to be collecting the water at the low point in you supply run. Unless you are getting some real bad oil deliveries the water should be minimal. Most of it should just be from condensation in the tank as it goes through it's full to empty cycle through the seasons.A cartridge filter should work just fine if you keep to a good schedule of making sure a new one is installed just prior to the first freeze. If you have a freeze problem later in the season than perhaps a second filter may be needed midway through the cold season but that would be unusual.Keeping as much oil in the tank as your budget will allow should keep condensation to a minimum. Most oil companies filter the oil into and out of the delivery trucks so water isn't a liability to them.Tell your wife I have a plumbing licence and can also boil water as I have a gas card. I have learned here on BT that I am in no way smart, 98% of the things I've done over the past 40+ years have been all wrong in respect to what I read here so please be open to other sugestions ;-)

1. 
   bpm1 | Mar 02, 2006 06:22pm | #5

   Thanks for the info. It sounds like if I'm gonna take the trouble to install this filter, I may as well just re-route the line. I've figured out another way to go with it that would have no upward turns beween the tank and the boiler. It would involve drilling a small hole in the framing around the basement window next to the boiler, that wouldn't be any kind of violation that you know of,would it?

   And shame on me for doubting her...she never even asked.  Go figure.

3. 
   Porsche998 | Mar 03, 2006 12:24am | #6

   Below about 20 deg., #2 fuel oil starts to "gel".  The diesel fuel which is similar, must be cut with kerosene or other additives to avoid this problem of "frozen" fuel in the winter.  In many locations here in NE, the FO supplier will not supply an out door tank with #2 oil - just for this reason.  When I had a diesel vehicle, had to deal with this gel problem all the time. 

   Either convert to kerosene, move the tank indoors or find an additive that works (and meets your pocket book. 

1. 
   bpm1 | Mar 04, 2006 07:44pm | #7

   i thought the gel temp was a bit lower than that,but don't know for surei know that i do seem to be the only person i know who has this problem and most of the homes in my area have outdoor,above ground tanks. i have tried some additives,but maybe dumping some kero in there when it's gonna be real cold isn't a bad idea

4. 
   Jock | Mar 04, 2006 09:20pm | #8

   First, your tank should be sloped toward the discharge end. That drains any moisture and prevents a water buildup at the other end of the tank with accompaning acides. Make sure the tank is not directly under and eave, as any rain and snow will surely find its way in. The drain end should have a vacuum operated valve installed to prevent flooding the basement in the event of a leak. Put the filter inside the heated space. Around here,(No. Michigan) I haven't seen a problem with #2 oil until the temps are around 5-10F. Have your supplier put in a pint of anti-gel with each delivery. Pick up a bottle of diesel treatment at an auto parts store. If you're using 1/4" type L tubing, go to 3/8" type L, the cross section is more that doubled making cold flow easier. I've been in the fuel business for over 35 years and keep learning new techniques.

1. 
   bpm1 | May 13, 2006 03:59pm | #10

   Well, guess what....I got a new tank. A few weeks ago I raked out the leaves that had blown under the tank, then 3 days later I walked by the tank and noticed a wet spot on the ground underneath that hadn't been there when I was raking.Took a sniff and sure enough it was oil.The bottom of the tank was damp with oil and there was a drip hanging from a blister in the paint.So I bought a new tank and temporarily put it on the cement walk that runs down the side of the house and pumped most of the oil out of the old tank into the new. Then I extended the line to the new tank so I could remove the old.Must've just started leaking because after two shovels full of dirt,there was no trace of oil in the soil. When I put the new tank in it's place,I'll make sure it's pitched correctly (the old one wasn't) and I'm going to re-route the line to eliminate that upward turn.I may even decide to locate the new tank in the basement instead,although my wife will complain about the smell when she's down there doing laundry. :)

1. 
   VtMike | May 14, 2006 12:19pm | #11

   I really doubt that removing the upward angle is going to help.

   If you put the tank inside there shouldn't be any smell at all. A "wet tank" is common, but with some care it will be avoided. Also, putting it inside will eliminate other problems that I mentioned earlier, like cold oil.

   mike 

    

1. 
   bpm1 | May 17, 2006 12:37am | #12

   I'm not sure what you mean by "a wet tank"...could you please explain that term.And I agree: if it's done correctly,there shouldn't be any smell to an indoor tank. But then again if someone put a pea under my mattress,I'd still sleep just fine. Notice who I said would have the problem with smell. :)

1. 
   VtMike | May 17, 2006 02:34am | #13

   "Wet tank" is when you see a wet spot around the pipes but it's not really leaking. Cut the handle of a copper fitting brush, put it in a drill and clean the bungs out really good. 

    

5. 
   VtMike | Mar 13, 2006 03:56am | #9

   Probably picking up some water off the bottom of the tank. I would switch to a two-pipe system with top draw. That's where the supply and return go in through the top of the tank using a duplex bushing. Run the supply line to about 2" off the bottom and the return 2" above that. Don't forget to install the pump by-pass plug! Keep the old valve on the bottom of the tank and cap it so you can drain off condensation from time to time. An enclosure over the tank will help. If the tank hum drives you crazy, install a pair of flex oil lines at the pump. Put the fuel filter at the pump and keep the number of joints in the oil line to a minimum. Cover the oil lines with pipe insulation, especially if the eaves drip on them and build up ice around them.

   Now to another issue. That cold oil will not break up as fine as warm oil will when it passes through the nozzle causing a less clean flame. A nozzle line heater should be installed if you don't already have one.