Replies

1. 
   calvin | Dec 11, 2003 02:05pm | #1

   gas or electric?

   Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.

   Quittin' Time

1. 
   luckyjeff | Dec 11, 2003 11:13pm | #4

   They are both electric..a 60 gallon and a 40 gallon.  Thanks

1. 
   DavidThomas | Dec 12, 2003 01:59am | #5

   If you had said gas, there'd be all sorts of concerns about adequate combustion air, etc. 

   But electric:  Build a box around it if you want.  My concern is not standby losses - the tank is pretty well insulated and you could simply wrap  an after-market insulation blanket around it.

   My concern is if there is any possibility of the pipes freezing.  Say it gets to 20F/-7C (once a decade event) while you are in Bermuda for a week.  How cold would the unheated garage get?  The cold pipe in or the hot pipe out, fartherest from the HWH would be at greatest risk.  And/or the piping closest to the floor where in-coming cold air will pool.

   David Thomas   Overlooking Cook Inlet in Kenai, Alaska

1. 
   luckyjeff | Dec 12, 2003 06:08am | #6

   I know I should not say never but it doesnt get that cold here on the west coast.  I may be too concerned at the energy that I am using . The cost of the box and insulation would probably be more then the cost of the heat loss.  Does my heating elements in the tank have to work harder ? Thanks

1. 
   DavidThomas | Dec 12, 2003 06:21am | #7

   The "low-hanging fruit" is one of those after-market HWH blankets and insulating the 2 or 3 feet of hot and cold (because hot water expands back out the cold pipe) connections to the HWH. Materials cost: $12. Maybe $16 Canadian :-)

   Yes, never say never. During our Seattle stay, my wife worked 72 hours at the hospital because the new shift (and the next shift and . . . ) "couldn't" get to work. A foot of snowfall. Temps in the 20's. A peer got to her doctoring job by X-C skiing 6 miles on city streets. No insulation on exposed pipes, non-frost-proof hose bibs - had to leave the water dripping.David Thomas   Overlooking Cook Inlet in Kenai, Alaska

2. 
   csnow | Dec 11, 2003 06:57pm | #2

   Putting them in an unheated insulated space is not likely to matter much. 

   Insulation does not produce heat, it only serves to slow the equalization of temperature with the proximal space.

   You would be relying upon 'captured' jacket and piping losses to heat the air in the utility space, thus indirectly providing some heat recovery.  Not much benefit here.  It would be far more efficient to stop jacket and piping losses at the source.  Look into a water heater with a 'superinsulated' jacket, and carefully insulate the pipes.

   I assume it is not likely to freeze in your temperate climate.  Insulating exterior pipes will not eliminate the possibility of freezing.  This is widely misunderstood.

   If you have standard (as opposed to 'power-vented') gas appliances, any benefit would be completely overwhelmed by closet venting requirements.

1. 
   tenpenny | Dec 11, 2003 07:05pm | #3

   Victoria isn't considered cold, but that's just a Maritimer's point of view.

   If you can build an insulated enclosure around the water heater, it will help reduce the losses.  The more insulation the better.  Make sure the heater itself has lots of insulation around it (too late to add any under it, isn't it?), and then build an enclosure with lots of insulation.  Make the enclosure easy to open or remove.  Then, the initial losses from the water heater will warm up the air in the enclosed space; since the rate of heat loss is dependent on the temp differential, it will tend to slow down the losses.

   The joy of keeping the water heater in the house, in a heating climate, is that the heat losses from the water heater go into the house, which you are heating anyway.  So you don't "lose" heat.  (in a heating climate). 

3. 
   NickNukeEm | Dec 12, 2003 06:46am | #8

   LuckeyJeff, you are truely lucky.  Once upon a time in the late 70's, the sub I was on pulled into Bremerton (to take on nuke missles) and we made a port call in Victoria.  Or maybe I traveled north on Liberty call.  Anyway, I gotta tell you, Victoria was one of the most gorgeous spots I have ever seen (and I lived in Hawaii for 8 years, amounst other exotic places.)  Even the rain failed to dampen the beauty of the place.

   Hope it hasn't changed.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!
1. 
   VaGentinMI | Dec 12, 2003 01:56pm | #9

   nick.......ever meet a guy named Parenti? Irish / Italian from VA? We did a few jobs together b4 I moved to MI.

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Dec 12, 2003 04:57pm | #10

   Name doesn't ring a bell, but that means very little these days.  I assume he was on a boat in the 70's?  I was in the USS Patrick Henry (SSBN 599).  Was on it for 5 years, so if he was on the Gold crew from '74-'79, I'd know him.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

1. 
   VaGentinMI | Dec 12, 2003 06:00pm | #11

   Do not know name of boat, he was slated to trsf. to fast attack, & felt the choice wass his family or navy. He decided that family came first. Just know he was a reactor puke, still glows at night.

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Dec 12, 2003 11:42pm | #12

   Hey, I resemble that remark!

   I never met a tool I didn't like!