Replies

1. 
   DanH | Jun 12, 2006 10:58pm | #1

   Yeah, you can rig the same thing yourself. Yeah, there's an issue with backdrafting, if there isn't a decent air supply source for the furnace & water heater. But if such a small fan could cause problems then you're really already set up for trouble -- a range hood or bathroom fan could already cause problems.

   BTW, if the unit draws a steady 38 watts then it uses 38*24 watt-hours in a day or 0.9KWH per day.

   If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
2. 
   DonNH | Jun 12, 2006 11:25pm | #2

   While the unit itself may only use 38 watts to run, you have to look at what it's actually doing:

   It works by taking air from upstairs that you've conditioned to, let's say 75 degrees and 50% RH, and pulling it into the basement which is at maybe 65 degrees, and by cooling it actually drives the RH up by a bit.  Don't know the numbers, but let's say it takes it up to 60% RH.  That may  be better than you'd get by letting the basement stagnate, so it's good in that regard.

   However, the air coming from upstairs has to be replaced by outside air, so the AC upstairs has to cool and dehumidify that air.  They don't include THAT cost in their calculations.

   Now, if you've got a tight house and need the ventilation, then it isn't so bad, but the best bet would be to install a Heat Recovery Ventilation (HRV) unit, which uses the outgoing cool air to pre-cool (or pre-heat in winter) the outgoing air, thereby recovering at least part of the cost you spent to condition it.

   As you mentioned, there's also the issue of creating negative pressures, which can affect anything requiring venting.  HRV's, I expect, are designed to deal with this.

   Note that I've never actually dealt with any of these systems, but this caught my eye because I once had a discussion with someone who sells the Humidex systems spouting the same 10 cents per day cost info, without understanding the basic physics of the situation

   Don 

1. 
   experienced | Jun 13, 2006 08:02am | #3

   Don:

   I know the inventer of the Humidex. When I lived in New Brunswick, he lived about 20 miles from me. We were both early in the HRV industry about 1980-1.....he with a manufacturer and I as an vendor/installer. The Humidex was invented as a "dehumidifier" for damp summer basements to replace standard units and run at lower costs.

   He had an idea based on the fact that due to cool summer basements (especially if uninsulated) he would see condensation/dampness in the low corners and at the floor/wall intersection. From this he determined that moisture "fell" to the lower levels of the home and basement. Confirming  RH's by psychrometer but by neglecting another variable in RH measurement- temperature- he missed the temp stratification of the basement air from higher temps at the ceilings to lower temps at the floor.  Thus he found higher RH's at the floor, lower RH's at the ceiling.... and this proved his theory....albeit wrongly.

   So he built the humidex protypes to clean up his summer basement moisture. He found that in some "weather", he needed a fan that would exhaust 200 cfm to do the job. From there he popularized the product locally and it took off.

   How does it work .... and not work!!

   It works not by dehumidifying (no compressor, evaporator, etc) but by exhausting the lower, cooler basement air with higher RH's and replacing it with warmer air from upstairs and outside. With enough air exchange the basement would begin to warm up slowly and the average RH would be lowered not by having lower absolute moisture content in the air but by having a warmer basement through free heat, a lower RH and a low fan electric bill.

   It does not work well or at all in very hot humid  weather. You're  now bringing in air at 75-95 deg F and 65-80% RH that just needs to be cooled a few degfrees before it will condense on even a slightly cool surafce. The last two summers in our area have been the most humid of my 13 years in this locale. The Humidexs are not working as in past summers. People go to the storage room, bring out the old dehumidifier, fire it up and set the two systems working against each other!!! The dehumidifier actually dries the basement air by refrigeration while the Humidex sucks it out to be replaced by more humid air for the dehumidifier to dry and be exhausted. IGet the idea???  have had a few calls from frustrated homeowners that have two machines running that never shut off and the Rh is not going down- in one monitored case it had gone up!!!

   The Humidex "dehumidifier" is like the foil faced foams claiming outrageous R values for 1" like 27- more "smoke and mirrors".

   Ture storey: I used to be the provincial energy analyst (wrote the energy regulations) and 1 of 4 public residential energy advisors. As part of the job, we put on public energy conservation seminars around the province. One evening a gent came to ask specifically about why the Humidex was not working in his home.

   His basement was a partial basement with a big piece of the local granite bedrock (not much soil cover in some areas here due to past glaciers) forming one corner of the basement. In addition there was a high water table under his slab about 8 inches down. He put his dehumidifier away, started up the Humidex and nothing happed. Since he was so well connected to the cooling effect of the bedrock + high water table, the temp in the basement would not rise much if at all.

   He called the manufacturer about his situation. They said to heat the basement to boost the temperature so the unit could then maintain it at a high enough level for the system to work. So in July he fires up his basment wood stove for 2 days!! (free firewood from his own lot = cheapest energy form) Neighbours thought he had lost it. After 2 days all was sufficintly warmed so that the system worked for a few days but eventually lost the higher temps leading to basement RH rise. His money was refunded by the vendor and now he still uses the original dehumidifier.

   XPD

1. 
   BillHartmann | Jun 13, 2006 03:44pm | #4

   Good story.http://www.humidexatlantic.com/how_humidex_worksThey never mention step 4.They do show that arrows that imply that air comes in from the outside.But they never mention it. They just talk about the "dryer, warmer, fresher" air that is drawn from the upstairs.And never mention the condition of that outside air or what needs to be done to it to make it dryer and fresher.

3. 
   jmmass | Jan 13, 2020 10:45am | #5

   Bob C
   5.0 out of 5 stars Amazing results from a unit called the Breeze, available online from Breeze Systems International at 1/4 the price of units like Humidex, Wave, and EZ Breathe- I was a non-believer, but am now blinded by the light!
   Verified Purchase
   I was 100% skeptical about this thing having any impact on my musty basement. I thought I was buying snake oil, but was at my wits end when it came to how to deal with the smelly basement on Cape Cod. We had a dehumidifier for years that would remove the moisture from the basement, but we would still get a "wet" spot on the floor at its lowest point and we had a musty smell that had us looking for ways to seal the basement door. When we would open all the windows and the bulkhead, we would get relief, and it would smell okay, but once we closed things up when it got cold or was raining we were back to a smelly basement.
   I installed this where our floor is the lowest and where we often would see condensation on the floor and have it venting out one of the basement windows that I adapted for the purpose with a vent.
   I am absolutely overwhelmed by the difference that this device has wrought - my basement musty odor is "cured" - it smells great down there and here is why - this little thing acts like a chimney of sorts, it pulls up the nasty moist air from the floor and shoots it out the window - and sucks down fresh air from the upper floors - circulating the air into the basement with fresh air, BUT also removing the worst air that is down near the floor.
   I couldn't be more shocked at the results this little device has delivered - amazing. I really thought I was going to be dissapointed as I thought "what on earth can this thing really do" but the answer is in the description - a dehumidifier gets the water out, but you still have the same stinky air in your basement - this thing really does the job and I could not be more pleased. I show everyone who comes into the house. My wife is also amazed - she used to dread going down to do laundry - now, she has no excuse!

4. 
   jlyda | Jan 13, 2020 11:55am | #6

   Is the basement finished? Are there indications of water and moisture entering the building? Is your HVAC system utilizing old ductwork? These things greatly effect the environment of basement and will continue to be a source of the problem.

   My first home was quite old and I found that the main issue for moisture in my basement was just lack of ventilation and insulation issues. My basement would get extremely cold in the summer months when A/c was on. The block walls would get so cold that the warm summer air would condense immediately when hitting the cold block. I installed 2” foam sheets to prevent the condensation issues and installed a heat recovery unit to ventilate fresh air. It worked like a champ. Got rid of the basement smell as well.

5. 
   florida | Jan 13, 2020 01:47pm | #7

   No harm but do you realize you're responding to 20 year old threads? The people in these threads are long gone.

6. 
   jlyda | Jan 13, 2020 02:18pm | #8

   That’s funny. I did not notice the date. Either Fine Homebuilding is desperate for forum discussions or Humidex is bringing it into the conversation for free advertising. Either way, that’s BS. I’m just trying to share some of my experience to help others, while in turn hoping to pick up some knowledge along the way. I will look for date in the future, thanks for pointing it out.

7. 
   jmmass | Jun 22, 2020 07:10am | #9

   Bob C
   5.0 out of 5 stars Amazing results from a unit called the Breeze, available online from Breeze Systems International at 1/4 the price of units like Humidex, Wave, and EZ Breathe- I was a non-believer, but am now blinded by the light! They make crawl space units too. Reduces Radon gas.
   I was 100% skeptical about this thing having any impact on my musty basement. I thought I was buying snake oil, but was at my wits end when it came to how to deal with the smelly basement on Cape Cod. We had a dehumidifier for years that would remove the moisture from the basement, but we would still get a "wet" spot on the floor at its lowest point and we had a musty smell that had us looking for ways to seal the basement door. When we would open all the windows and the bulkhead, we would get relief, and it would smell okay, but once we closed things up when it got cold or was raining we were back to a smelly basement.
   I installed this where our floor is the lowest and where we often would see condensation on the floor and have it venting out one of the basement windows that I adapted for the purpose with a vent.
   I am absolutely overwhelmed by the difference that this device has wrought - my basement musty odor is "cured" - it smells great down there and here is why - this little thing acts like a chimney of sorts, it pulls up the nasty moist air from the floor and shoots it out the window - and sucks down fresh air from the upper floors - circulating the air into the basement with fresh air, BUT also removing the worst air that is down near the floor.
   I couldn't be more shocked at the results this little device has delivered - amazing. I really thought I was going to be disappointed as I thought "what on earth can this thing really do" but the answer is in the description - a dehumidifier gets the water out, but you still have the same stinky air in your basement - this thing really does the job and I could not be more pleased. I show everyone who comes into the house. My wife is also amazed - she used to dread going down to do laundry - now, she has no excuse!

8. 
   jmmass | Feb 11, 2021 08:36pm | #10

   Humidex makes a good product, but you can do so much better with a unit that uses the same principle, is at least the same quality, and sells for much less (nearly half the price), the Breeze DL. We have had one in our basement for almost 10 years. The entry level Breeze (single fan) has been selling on Ebay and Amazon for over 10 years. The Breeze is made of a sturdy plastic, so it doesn't rust or dent. Has no computer parts, which aren't recommended in humid areas, and is backed by a no-questions-asked 5-year warranty and full tech support. It's quiet, takes less space than a Humidex, and can be customized by the seller. It installs by using a simple dryer vent hook up, so it's a DIY project. Also, the Breeze is made by an American company, unlike Humidex. Check it out by searching for Breeze Systems International. You'll be glad you did.

   
1. 
   calvin | Feb 11, 2021 09:02pm | #11

   So JM,
   You’ve been bringing the Breeze up in this thread 3 times in a year. Two replies are or are almost a copy paste of each other.

   Why would this be?

   And damned if there isn’t a similar review on Amazon from 2017. You must have a heck of a memory to use almost the same words in that review. Only, there you were Bob C.

   All is not lost as evidently your wife is still enjoying doing that laundry down in the basement. What’s the matter, your legs fall off?

   I’ll give you credit, as honesty isn’t your strong suit evidently.
   You be selling the Breeze system on eBay along with the Virtual Organist .........
   Don’t leave church without it!