Replies

1. 
   Mooney | Aug 17, 2005 07:44am | #1

   Thats a wide spectrum ya ask for .

    

   I look at it as a specialty tool. They are quick out and quick cleaned. They are also very clean around folks and furniture and such. If ya dont load a compressor, ya dont need one. They are not fast but they are faster than an air gun. Their speed sucks behind an airless and their quality sucks behind an air gun spraying expensive enamles and laquers.  Body shops dont use them and thats a clue right there . They wont run and gun on production work , but they are safer around vehicles and such as that that really dont need a different color paint on them. They are very close to as healthy as an airless turned down.

   You can spend anywhere from 100 to 1500 dollars that I remember. You can buy one that runs from a compressor but there are aslo disadvantages to that . The air supplied in a turbine does not collect moisture and is normally drier even when its raining out side. So if you need to shoot somthing on a rainy day, the turbine will get by with it. Then there is single , twin ot tripple turbines screening finer air quality.

   I think on jobs when you need to call on it to perform a function , its darn nice to have it in your arsenal.  However , its not all that alone.

    

   Tim Mooney

    

1. 
   PaulBinCT | Aug 17, 2005 03:12pm | #3

   I think you're off on a couple points Mooney.  Although I'm far from expert, I do own a high end Graco HVLP and not only do many body shops (at least around here) use HVLP, in many areas I understand they're required to reduce pollution.  They are entirely capable of superb finishes (in many cases I understand they are considered superior to high pressure atomization guns). I've gotten literally glasslike finishes from mine. Lastly, the purpose of multistage turbines is more turbine pressure, for spraying heavier materials. 

   PaulB

1. 
   Mooney | Aug 17, 2005 05:19pm | #5

   From what I understand its because of requirements. But hey, we are all proud of different things for different reasons.  Yes , I think its futuristic and the practice is healthier.

   I learned something about the three stage , thank you. The twin I have is filtered better than the single I use. I dont have a pot hvlp but I would imagine a three stage would be needed for that . I plan on purchasing a compressor ran hlvp. They are still very high priced unless youve noticed different.

   Tim

    

1. 
   custombuilt | Aug 17, 2005 05:37pm | #6

   Never used one for carpentry, but I do body work on the side, and in automotive, they're hard to beat.  All the shops in my area use them....and by preference, not regulation.   They use half the amount of paint, and on automotive, i've got awesome finishes.  A lot less overspray to worry about too.  But like anything, you get what you pay for, and getting the bargain gun is just going to cause headaces in the long run.

1. 
   Mooney | Aug 18, 2005 12:42am | #10

   Thanks .

   I guess I havent spent enough money on one , if you compare the finish of a hvlp to a high dollar air gun. I figgure the tips are different and the heads. If you got a gun that would spray super fine auto finishes , it would not touch latex emamel which is one of the advatages of using hvlp on residential. Normally you are into a job inside and need a in-and-out job often in one day. So you shoot 1 hour primers and latex top coats. If you had the time to set up work, an airless puts either of the other two away. So I call an hvlp a specialty gun for these trades. Im glad to hear they had refined the gun for automotive use which I know nothing about other than the shops here dont like them. Which is not supprizing. A good painter/finisher that does a volume amount of work doesnt own automatic finishing tools. Barbaric to say the least. The auto guys may be the same way .

   Tim

    

2. 
   intrepidcat | Aug 17, 2005 10:53pm | #8

   Could be wrong, but the HVLP's that the body shops use are much different than the kind of HVLp's you see marketed for construction or furniture painters.

   You are exactly right about the finish quality of the body shop HVLP guns. Some of those are very expensive and some of the more inexpensive can produce very good finishes.

   A little time spent wet sanding and buffing is extremely valuable,too. Especially when you just hosed down the drive way and painted the car there.

    

    ...............be a bumper................

1. 
   PaulBinCT | Aug 18, 2005 02:12am | #11

   I guess it's (obviously) a function of which units you are comparing.  My Graco is at least a 3 stage (I forget exactly, it's a 1200 Series) and I paid just over a grand as I recall, but it will spray anything from lacquer to epoxy with the right tips.  Great unit...

1. 
   Treetalk | Aug 18, 2005 02:19am | #12

   Ive used the cheap CH($200) to put stain on some old T-111 siding and it worked fine because that stuff is like trying to paint a sponge.Ive also used it to put paint down where i would then brush it out. I think itd be exceptionaly crude for furniture work or where what comes out of the nozzle is the finish texture.The Flexol tip is a good one tho.

2. 
   Adrian | Aug 18, 2005 02:36am | #13

   You have to qualify what you want to do:

   -for house painting (walls), use airless. HVLP is too slow, and won't move enough material.

   -for installed trim, airless or maybe HVLP. Depends if finish or production is the priority.

   -for furniture, cabinets etc.....fine finishes, including cars.....HVLP or air-assisted airless (atomises the material better than airless for a finer finish).

   This is the area I can speak to....I have compressed air/conventional/airspray (old-fashioned high pressure spray guns)......turbine and compressed air HVLP, including HVLP with a pressure pot.....and air-assisted airless. Even have a new medium pressure gun.I have some opinions, and likes and dislikes, but if you're interested in housepainting, it won't apply. I will say I love HVLP guns for my applications, and with everything considered, my choice would be between HVLP and air-assisted airless....although this new medium pressure gun is cool. The only people I run into that don't like HVLP are people that are very used to high pressure guns,and will not adapt.

    Cabinetmaker/college woodworking instructor. Cape Breton, Nova Scotia.

2. 
   Jer | Aug 17, 2005 01:59pm | #2

   If you have a shop of any size and make things even on a semi regular basis, they are wonderful. Forget the compressor cup guns, go HVLP.

3. 
   Sancho | Aug 17, 2005 05:12pm | #4

   check out http://www.homesteadfinishing.com

   and

   http://www.compliantspraysystems.com

   that will answer all your HLVP/LVLP needs and questions

      Buckism: Will show you the the way 
4. 
   djj | Aug 17, 2005 09:27pm | #7

   Fonzie,

   I recently tried two cheap single stage ones, a Wagner (~$100) and a Campbell Hausfeld (~$220) for painting interior trim. Both sucked for that. Even after thin the paint down to the consistency of water and still got tons of spitting. I am sure they would work better for things like thin varnish or stain but for for latex paint the cheapies were terrible.  The paint shop I had do my exterior doors does use high end three stage HVLP sprayers and get great results even with thick materials.

   Regards,

   Dennis

1. 
   Dunwright | Aug 17, 2005 11:38pm | #9

   I have used an airless rig for painting both interior and exterior in vacant rental properties.When a client approached me about painting some "pidgeon hole" type cabinets she had installed, I looked-over the project and went out and bought the CH unit from HDepot for $200.00.The trick to thinning latex paint for spraying is not to thin with water; instead use Flood brand "Floetrol". It's available in paint stores and home centers. It conditions the paint, while making it less viscious. For oil based products, Flood makes Penetrol.I ended-up painting those twenty 14" cubby holes, in a furnished unit, with just minimal blowback. Tarps on the floor and surrounding area though, just in case.I thought I was in trouble when I tried to shoot sanding sealer with it. Once I had changed to the "other" cap/needle set (included) I was good to go with that project.No, it's not as good as the high dollar rigs, but I paid for it with three jobs I would otherwise would probably had passed on.

1. 
   djj | Aug 18, 2005 04:38pm | #16

   Dunwright,

   I did try thinning both with water and floetrol. I still got a crappy finish with SW proclassic waterborne enamel. I even bought the largest tip campbell hausfeld makes. I switched to a cheap graco airless and while I used a lot more paint, the finish was much better.

   Regards,

   Dennis 

    

1. 
   JasonMI | Aug 24, 2005 05:13am | #17

   I'm by no means an expert, but I have a Graco 4500 system; 4-stage turbine with both remote pot and spray gun. Excellant unit, and worth every penny. My 'opinion' (and yes, it's only my opinion), is that HVLP is best used for those projects where you have the time and the space to correctly work on projects; if you're simply looking for less overspray to spray trim or something that's already installed, it's not the tool.

   I've done a lot of finishing over the past two years on cabinets and other items, and a good HVLP sprayer really does provide a superior finish. I take doors to the workshop and spray the SW Waterborne Acrylic and get a flawless finish; no need to thin with my unit. And I redid a Stickley piece that turned out flawless.

   Like other tools; you've got to match what you want to do with the capacity of the tool; just saying HVLP is like saying 'airless sprayer', and as I'm sure you all know, the capacities and abilities of the tool dictate what you SHOULD be spraying with it.

5. 
   stinger | Aug 18, 2005 03:32am | #14

   Your best answers will be had on Jeff Jewitt's finishing forum.  Go here:  http://www.homesteadfinishing.com

   Some of us here at Breaktime have experience with HVLP, but over at Jeff's board, you'll meet all the pros, plus Jeff, and you can see all the posts by folks who have gotten set up with gear sold by Jeff (he sells all the best) and how it is working out for them.

6. 
   maverick | Aug 18, 2005 04:52am | #15

   I have an el-cheapo gravity fed compressor driven gun. Actually I have two, one for water based things like latex primer and paint or water based poly and the other for spirit based paints and finishes. Having the two shortens up clean up time.

   Mine have the Porter-Cable stamp on them and they were around $90 each.

   I like them because there is not much overspray and I can bring them into someones house if I need to tone up a cabinet or do a finish repair, although they will handle any size job in the shop.

   If you go that route throw away the little filter in the bottom of the cup and use cone filters to load the gun. That lets you shoot a thicker viscosity and there is one less thing to clean