I have been asked to install chair rail in a kitchen that has metal wall studs. The rail will be stained vs painted so finished looks are important. How should I proceed? Should I install the rail with construction adhesive or should I drill small holes through the chair rail into the metal studs and then install with nails. The rail also has to be installed over wallpaper….Thanks
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Replies
Billm,
I have had success with self tapping trim head drywall screws. Predrill the molding and then zip them into the studs. If the studs are light gauge, regular trim heads will work. Once filled, the screw heads leave the same size mark as a finish nail.
Matt
Bill, layout top of chair rail first. I snap a line with talcum powder instead of chalk, you could use a slight amount of blue if the line can't be seen.Cut , fit chair rail, find studs. make sure you add a screw to the studs below chalk line. Spot adhesive about 16" centers (a nickel size dab ) will do. Nail with a 15 gauge nail into studs. The only time I had a problem with this method was when studs bent, hence the add screw deal.
The talcum can be brushed off with a soft brush and vacummed if needed.
Mike
You can buy white chalk at some stores. Easier than talcum powder. You also might save some strange looks at the store when you start buying talcum powder by the dozen...
Jon Blakemore
Bill: Had a similar situation once with a very particular customer. He want no nail or screw holes to show or at least be very inconspicuous. Was concerned too about the nails holding in the metal studs.
I rabbeted the back of the chair rail in the meaty part about 1/2" deep x 3/4" wide. Then ripped some strips to match the rabbet profile. I attached the strips to the metal studs with screws, pilot hole first. The attached the rail to the strips with Titebond glue and used a pinner in a few places into the strips. Worked pretty well and the pin brad holes couldn't be seen unless you looked for them real close.
This might be a little over the top but thought I'd pass it along.
We do commercial finish out work in Dallas and often I'm brought in to do the millwork. Some small store front leases in malls, like Verizon, and Sleep Comfort, have prefinished millwork (baseboards, crownmolding, T&G random length flooring installed on walls. In these situations we use 2-1/2" finish nails, toe nailing them threw the 5/8" drywall and into the metal studs also putting adhesive on material to be nailed (not the T&G material on it just adhesive in field and nails and adhesive on borders and trim,) and we have never had a problem or callback when using this technique. The work product looks great and a gorilla could not yank it off of the wall.
In some situations we switch techniques. We've done ~ half dozen 24 HOUR FITNESS leases. In these the custumer needs chair rails (they call them leg rails,) for the custumers to stretch their legs on. Specs call for 2" x 10" A -grade ash over 5/8" drywall and 20 gauge studs. For this we drill and countersink the ash, then use ~ 3-1/2 drywall screws, and adhesive. Then we fill countersink holes with Minwax two part system wood filler. Let the wood filler set ~ 20-30 minutes and lightly sand with 180 to 200 grit sandpaper. When the painters then stain out the ash it looks great, the areas where the screws were counter sunk are esentially invisible to the naked eye and the rails are super sturdy.
So, we have been using finish nails and adhesive for prefinished light duty work, and screws and adhesive for heavier use material.
Both have worked great.
Just go ahead and get after it! No need in wishing you good luck, because a half-trained monkey could do this correctly. ( I know, I know-- just when you say something like this, is when you get bit real hard, but this is just another wall system and if you can install chair rail on wood studs, you can handle it on metal studs.
You never did say why a homowner has metal studs in this area of the house. Why?
Cork in Dallas.
P.S. About to move to Chicago. Got an opening with a union contractor and family is up there so here I go.
Hey cork:
Where about in Chicago?
Lived and worked here forever.Mostly residential nowdays.
Saw an add in Carpenter Mag. for hardened trim gun nails,16ga.
Was either Paslode or Senco.For 25ga steel studs.Most likely cost an arm and two legs.
Welcome to The Windy City!
I'm leaving in under a week. I'll be driving my new van (Ford E-250 cargo van) I got for storing my work tools, and pulling a trailer. When I get to Chicago I'll store my stuff for a month and get a furnished apartment while I look for a house to rent for me and my cat. Looking to find a small house in the Westmont, Oakbrook Terrace area, seeing as how this seems central to the Megopolis area, and I lived there for a few years about a decade ago. While looking to get a short term lease apartment I'll be staying in Lake Barrington with my brother and his family. He's got a big house so no problem there.
The union contractor I've got an opening with is Schwendener Construction. They are a large commercial G.C. doing work allover the Chicago area. Their field manager says he'll give me a shot on their finish out crew. This is a bit scary because I've been with the same commercial finish out contractor, Matrix Interior Const. Inc. as a forman here in Dallas for just shy of seven years, and now I'm heading into the "unknown". Fortunatly the men I've worked for and with these last years are darn good and real professionals. They run ~ 150 men in the field, and have trained me well. When it comes to interior finish work and carpentry I can "rock and roll", no brag-just fact. And the man who is a general partner and heads the operations division (my boss), says I've always got a home at Matrix if things don't work out in Chicago.
Anyway, the short answer is I'm headed to Lake Barrington, staying with Dave (my middle brother), for a few days while I check out a permanent place to stay.
Any info or advice on steady carpenter work in the Windy City would be appreciated. I don't expect these people to give me the boot, (like I said I'm good,) but you know how great big companys are. They can lay off large sections of their crew without batting an eyelash and I'll be the new guy. And as you've been working here "forever" you've got to have a good feel for the market. Anyway, this is just a thought for as you know any good tradsman had better keep a few aces up his sleeve just in case, because you never know how things will turn out. But if you've still got your tools, your skills, and reputation, as long as you have a few contacts, you'll never go hungry. So I guess that's what I'm looking for contacts.
Oh yeah, the nails! These were Senko. I know this for sure because I just finished turning them in to my boss. I don't know what a case cost but my boss (a real tight-wad, but ten different types of talented,) said " ALLRIGHT, I LIKE GETTING THESE BABIES BACK CAUSE THEY COST A BUNCH".
Cork Moving to the Windy City
Know the name Schwendener.Large outfit doing high end work downtown.
Going to be quite an adventure.
Worked in the South Loop in 2001 for most or the year building townhomes.500k and up.Lots of $$$$ moving back into the City.Shouldn't have much trouble finding work around and in Chicago.
Even if Schwendener doesn't pan out,lots of BIG homes going up like weeds out in Barrington and around Oak Brook.Geese...50 miles in all directions(except east)building is very strong.
At least you have the family here to help with the adjustment,that's a big plus.
Whish you all the luck!
Keep in touch Via the board
scottyb
P.S. are you transfering into a Local here?