FHB Logo Facebook LinkedIn Email Pinterest Twitter X Instagram Tiktok YouTube Plus Icon Close Icon Navigation Search Icon Navigation Search Icon Arrow Down Icon Video Guide Icon Article Guide Icon Modal Close Icon Guide Search Icon Skip to content
Subscribe
Log In
  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Restoration
  • Videos
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House
  • Podcast
Log In

Discussion Forum

Discussion Forum

Installing New Toilet Shut-off Valve

Jgriff | Posted in General Discussion on July 18, 2009 10:15am

Well, it’s not really about plumbing a new shut-off valve, it’s about how to install the wallboard around it in 1 piece after the new valve is installed.

Pulled the old toilet and repaired some rotted flooring underneath. About to lay in some new tile and then re-install the toilet. But, while I’m there doing all this work and installing a new fixture and new tile I figure I may as well install a new shut-off valve under the tank. The old wallboard under and behind the tank had also suffered water damage and had gone soft with mold growing on it – I removed a piece up to about the level of the toilet tank.

The old valve works fine, it’s just that its chrome finish is pitted and discolored with age. Like the old valve, the new valve is an angle valve with a 5″ extension tube and has a bell flange to cover the hole in the wallboard.

The old valve was installed from a “T” in a line that also runs to an upstairs toilet directly above. The water supply was, of course, installed in a wall on which wallboard was installed on both sides. The original wallboard was one large piece with just a small hole cut for the pipe coming out from inside the wall.

I assume that the soldering was done before the wallboard was installed on the opposite side of the wall – which I can no longer do (kitchen cabinet installed on the other side of the wall prevent access to the plumbing connection in the wall).

So, what’s the secret? How do I do this without installing the wallboard in 2 pieces? Or, must I install it in 2 pieces? As far as I can tell, the chromed extension tube doesn’t disconnect from the angle valve.

Anyone have an answer? Thanks in advance. 

Griff
Reply
  • X
  • facebook
  • linkedin
  • pinterest
  • email
  • add to favorites Log in or Sign up to save your favorite articles

Replies

  1. MikeHennessy | Jul 19, 2009 12:03am | #1

    You stub out the pipe, put up the WB, and attach the angle stop after the wallboard is up.

    Mike Hennessy
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Everything fits, until you put glue on it.



    Edited 7/18/2009 5:04 pm ET by MikeHennessy

    1. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 01:23am | #3

      Thanks for the reply.

      If I understand you correctly, you're talking about a 2 step process. (1) Stub out using a chromed extension tube through the wallboard and (2) soldering on an angle valve.

      Yes?

      If so, I'll have to get other parts. The angle valve & extension tube I bought is all one piece.Griff

      1. MikeHennessy | Jul 19, 2009 06:04pm | #12

        Yes -- the stub is one piece and the angle stop is another. If you want a chrome stub, you'll probably have to go with one that's threaded on both ends instead of soldered, which may mean converting the tee to threaded as well. But they do make chrome tubing to cover copper stubs -- you could do that instead, but that may be tough to find.Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.

        1. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 06:14pm | #13

          Thanks. I'm going to go with the integral, factory manufactured valve and chromed tube that's soldered onto the 1/2" copper supply tube.Griff

      2. User avater
        BillHartmann | Jul 21, 2009 05:49pm | #20

        I have never seen one that sticks out enough that it needs any kind of sleeve.I have paint around a number of them. And even down on the floor next to one you don't see much. maybe 1/2-3/4" between the trim plate and back of the compression nut.Around this area compression fit is almost all you see on any house with copper pipe..
        William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe

        1. Jgriff | Jul 21, 2009 08:07pm | #21

          Well, the stub-out here sticks out at least 1" from the wallboard - more actually, since after 1" it then slips into the chromed tube for an unknown distance. The bell flange covers this short piece of copper tubing.

          I'll learn exactly how far once I unsolder the connection and slip the tube and old valve off.

          Right now I'm waiting for people to leave the house so I can shut off the water supply and drain the pipes - no, there is no shut-off valve installed on this supply line.  Pity.Griff

        2. Hackinatit | Jul 21, 2009 08:57pm | #22

          Around this area compression fit is almost all you see on any house with copper pipe.

          One of the many reasons I curse plumbers as a group... they seem to NEVER consider the consequences of using compression to 1/2" pipe.

          I REFUSE to use compression on the pipe stub-out. Soldered 1/2npt male fitting to mount the valve is the only sure-fire way to allow future replacement of the valve.

          My last fight with a compression fitting replacement was a nightmare and I'll never knowingly subject the next person in line to the same horrid affair.A La Carte Government funding... the real democracy.

          1. Shacko | Jul 21, 2009 11:53pm | #23

            ........One of the many reasons I curse plumbers as a group... they seem to NEVER consider the consequences of using compression to 1/2" pipe......

            What consequences are we talking about?

             "If all else fails, read the directions"

          2. MikeHennessy | Jul 22, 2009 02:45pm | #25

            "What consequences are we talking about?"

            If tightened too much, a compression fitting deforms the pipe enough that it's tough to replace the fitting -- especially if the copper is soft or type M. I've had to resort to soldering on the replacement valve's compression ring on more than one occasion 'cause the pipe was "squeezed" too much to seal.

            Still, no big deal - but I prefer to avoid 'em myself. Just a personal preference thing.Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.

          3. DanH | Jul 22, 2009 04:07pm | #26

            I still think the old threaded drop-eared elbows were the way to go. Not using them saves what? Maybe $5 in parts. And then you have to futz with sleeves on the copper, compression fittings, etc.
            As I stood before the gates I realized that I never want to be as certain about anything as were the people who built this place. --Rabbi Sheila Peltz, on her visit to Auschwitz

          4. MikeHennessy | Jul 22, 2009 04:50pm | #27

            Up until about three years ago, I'dve agreed 100%. Then I discovered PEX and will never look back. Now I almost always just use a 90° copper stub off the PEX . ;-)Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.

          5. DanH | Jul 22, 2009 05:02pm | #28

            The Pex is sort of OK if it's soldered through a plate. But too often they're just left dangling -- floppy valve that doesn't sit straight.
            As I stood before the gates I realized that I never want to be as certain about anything as were the people who built this place. --Rabbi Sheila Peltz, on her visit to Auschwitz

          6. MikeHennessy | Jul 22, 2009 05:38pm | #29

            That's why I use the copper ell stubs -- I attach both legs to the stud so it's nice and stiff -- that, or solder through a plate where I can't hit a stud.Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.

          7. DanH | Jul 22, 2009 07:43pm | #30

            The copper ells I see on Pex all the time don't have legs. And maybe one time in five you see them soldered to a plate (and even then often just tack-soldered). Most often they just dangle loose.
            As I stood before the gates I realized that I never want to be as certain about anything as were the people who built this place. --Rabbi Sheila Peltz, on her visit to Auschwitz

          8. MikeHennessy | Jul 22, 2009 08:16pm | #31

            I use Wirsbo stuff and if I need to use a drop ear (like for a shower), I use the ones with three screw ears, like so:

            View Image

            But, for angle stops like at a terlet or under a sink, I use these, and strap both the horizontal and vertical legs to the stud:

            View Image

            Only reason is, I'm lame at getting threaded nipples watertight behind the wall. I've left a slow drip one time too many. ;-(

            And it makes it easy to run the pressure test as a bonus.

            Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.

            PS: I'm with ya on hating dangly stub-outs.

            Edited 7/22/2009 1:17 pm ET by MikeHennessy

        3. Shacko | Jul 22, 2009 12:14am | #24

          Bill: Some old time information for you, used to be that chrome nipples were used on fixture hook-up $$$, then compresion became common with a chrome sleeve$$, then the idea was to eliminate the chrome sleeve and cut the stub out tight to the escutcheon$, the basic idea was to speed up and save money, have a good one.

           

           

           

           "If all else fails, read the directions"

  2. User avater
    Dinosaur | Jul 19, 2009 12:40am | #2

    It depends. If this is an old-type gate valve with an oval-shaped plastic handle, remove the handle. (The extension tube should be removable.) Then use a 1½" hole saw to cut a hole in the gyprock at the appropriate place. The valve body will just fit thru the 1½" hole, and a split escutcheon plate will cover the hole perfectly.

    If it's a mini ball valve, just turn off the main water supply then turn on the ball valve. That way the handle will point along the axis of the valve body and again, it will fit thru a 1½" hole.

    Dinosaur

    How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
    low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
    foolish men call Justice....



    Edited 7/18/2009 5:43 pm ET by Dinosaur

    1. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 01:25am | #4

      As I indicated in my reply to the post above, my angle valve and extension tube are all one piece - they were joined at the factory.

      I'll have to get other parts.

      But, thanks for the reply.Griff

      1. User avater
        Dinosaur | Jul 19, 2009 01:38am | #5

        You shouldn't have any trouble getting a cutoff valve, unless you're coming off galvanised pipes in which case you'll need an adapter and/or a nipple, too. If you're on ½" rigid copper, get  ½ x ⅜ mini ball valves with compression fittings. You can attach those with a pair of Crescent wrenches and some Teflon¯ tape. No sweat.

        Dinosaur

        How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

        1. brucet9 | Jul 19, 2009 03:42am | #6

          Teflon tape for compression fittings?BruceT

          1. User avater
            Dinosaur | Jul 20, 2009 04:56am | #14

            Teflon tape for compression fittings?

            Yep, put a wrap on the threaded part of the valve body for the compression nut.

            Dinosaur

            How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

          2. brucet9 | Jul 20, 2009 06:33pm | #15

            What does that do? The seal is made by the ferrule being squeezed between valve body and pipe. BruceT

          3. User avater
            Dinosaur | Jul 21, 2009 05:25am | #16

            Lubricates the threads and helps avoid corrosion freezing them over time. Especially on toilet hookups; even brass can't take little boys' overspray without getting furry eventually....

            Dinosaur

            How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

          4. brucet9 | Jul 21, 2009 05:43am | #17

            Ah. Now I understand.Maybe that's why in Germany there are signs in restrooms that say, "Bitte, im sitzen pinkeln."BruceT

          5. User avater
            Dinosaur | Jul 21, 2009 05:49am | #18

            Used to have a carp who worked for me occasionally; his Belgian mother never taught him to piss standing up, said something about des maudit hommes qui arrose tout! He still sits down to take a leak.

            Dinosaur

            How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

          6. brucet9 | Jul 21, 2009 06:08am | #19

            As the preacher said, "Let us spray.":)BruceT

        2. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 04:08am | #8

          OK thanks.Griff

  3. brucet9 | Jul 19, 2009 04:06am | #7

    I cannot imagine that there would be a valve with integrated 5" stub-out sweated inside the wall. That is basically a non-repairable valve.

    Look again at your valve and stub out. Is the stub-out soldered to a 1/2" copper pipe tee inside the wall? If so, look for a hexagonal nut on the valve where it joins the stub out. If you loosen that nut, the valve should come off easily. (If you loosen the nut without first turning off the water, it will fly off and drown you.)

    If the chrome stub-out actually was soldered to the angle stop, how much pipe is there outside the drywall? If it extends more than 1 1/2" inch, you could cut off the valve and install a 1/2" compression angle stop.

    BruceT
    1. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 05:30am | #9

      Ah, you're right.  I looked a bit closer - it's amazing what you can learn when you actually look at things -  and actually moved the bell housing from where it was stuck. It was hiding the connection between the chromed tubing and the 1/2" copper stub.

      That joint is outside of the wallboard! I had originally thought the chromed tube went essentially all the way towards the "T" fitting inside the supply pipe in the wall.

      So, once I remove the soldered old chromed tube & valve I can install the wallboard in one piece with only a hole cut out for the stub-out.

      I should then be able to solder on the new chromed extension tube (trimmed to fit) and its integral angle valve.

      Thanks for pointing me in the direction I needed to look to understand how this works. Griff

  4. JTC1 | Jul 19, 2009 04:24pm | #10

    You have found your answer already for your particular valve.

    Just so you know, there are valves which have an integrated chrome pipe stub.  Made by Brasscraft. Straight or 90*, gate valve type or 1/4 turn ball styles are all available. I thought this is what you had until I read the rest of the posts.

    Valve has a chrome tube attached to the valve at the factory.  The ID of the tube matches OD of 1/2" copper pipe.  You cut the factory tube to whatever length you need, clean and flux, slip over the cu pipe stub and solder in place.  All from the exposed side of the DW.

    Removal is a simple "unsoldering" from the exposed side of the DW.

    Jim

     

    Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
    1. Jgriff | Jul 19, 2009 04:58pm | #11

      Got it. Thanks.

      Now I just have to wait for people to leave the house so I can turn the water supply off.Griff

Log in or create an account to post a comment.

Sign up Log in

Become a member and get full access to FineHomebuilding.com

Video Shorts

Categories

  • Business
  • Code Questions
  • Construction Techniques
  • Energy, Heating & Insulation
  • General Discussion
  • Help/Work Wanted
  • Photo Gallery
  • Reader Classified
  • Tools for Home Building

Discussion Forum

Recent Posts and Replies

  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
View More Create Post

Up Next

Video Shorts

Featured Story

FHB Podcast Segment: Repairing an Old Home While Maintaining Its Integrity

Learn about different approaches to making updates and repairs to older homes with historic charm.

Featured Video

How to Install Cable Rail Around Wood-Post Corners

Use these tips to keep cables tight and straight for a professional-looking deck-railing job.

Related Stories

  • Podcast Episode 684: Masonry Heaters, Whole-House Ventilation, and Porch Flooring
  • FHB Podcast Segment: Repairing an Old Home While Maintaining Its Integrity
  • Tools and Gear for the Moms Who Get it Done
  • An Easier Method for Mitered Head Casings

Highlights

Fine Homebuilding All Access
Fine Homebuilding Podcast
Tool Tech
Plus, get an extra 20% off with code GIFT20

"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Fine Homebuilding Magazine

  • Issue 331 - June 2025
    • A More Resilient Roof
    • Tool Test: You Need a Drywall Sander
    • Ducted vs. Ductless Heat Pumps
  • Issue 330 - April/May 2025
    • Deck Details for Durability
    • FAQs on HPWHs
    • 10 Tips for a Long-Lasting Paint Job
  • Issue 329 - Feb/Mar 2025
    • Smart Foundation for a Small Addition
    • A Kominka Comes West
    • Making Small Kitchens Work
  • Issue 328 - Dec/Jan 2024
    • How a Pro Replaces Columns
    • Passive House 3.0
    • Tool Test: Compact Line Lasers
  • Issue 327 - November 2024
    • Repairing Damaged Walls and Ceilings
    • Plumbing Protection
    • Talking Shop

Fine Home Building

Newsletter Sign-up

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox.

  • Green Building Advisor

    Building science and energy efficiency advice, plus special offers, in your inbox.

  • Old House Journal

    Repair, renovation, and restoration tips, plus special offers, in your inbox.

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters

Follow

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X

Membership & Magazine

  • Online Archive
  • Start Free Trial
  • Magazine Subscription
  • Magazine Renewal
  • Gift a Subscription
  • Customer Support
  • Privacy Preferences
  • About
  • Contact
  • Advertise
  • Careers
  • Terms of Use
  • Site Map
  • Do not sell or share my information
  • Privacy Policy
  • Accessibility
  • California Privacy Rights

© 2025 Active Interest Media. All rights reserved.

Fine Homebuilding receives a commission for items purchased through links on this site, including Amazon Associates and other affiliate advertising programs.

  • Home Group
  • Antique Trader
  • Arts & Crafts Homes
  • Bank Note Reporter
  • Cabin Life
  • Cuisine at Home
  • Fine Gardening
  • Fine Woodworking
  • Green Building Advisor
  • Garden Gate
  • Horticulture
  • Keep Craft Alive
  • Log Home Living
  • Military Trader/Vehicles
  • Numismatic News
  • Numismaster
  • Old Cars Weekly
  • Old House Journal
  • Period Homes
  • Popular Woodworking
  • Script
  • ShopNotes
  • Sports Collectors Digest
  • Threads
  • Timber Home Living
  • Traditional Building
  • Woodsmith
  • World Coin News
  • Writer's Digest
Active Interest Media logo
X
X
This is a dialog window which overlays the main content of the page. The modal window is a 'site map' of the most critical areas of the site. Pressing the Escape (ESC) button will close the modal and bring you back to where you were on the page.

Main Menu

  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Video
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Popular Topics

  • Kitchens
  • Business
  • Bedrooms
  • Roofs
  • Architecture and Design
  • Green Building
  • Decks
  • Framing
  • Safety
  • Remodeling
  • Bathrooms
  • Windows
  • Tilework
  • Ceilings
  • HVAC

Magazine

  • Current Issue
  • Past Issues
  • Magazine Index
  • Subscribe
  • Online Archive
  • Author Guidelines

All Access

  • Member Home
  • Start Free Trial
  • Gift Membership

Online Learning

  • Courses
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Podcast

More

  • FHB Ambassadors
  • FHB House
  • Customer Support

Account

  • Log In
  • Join

Newsletter

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Follow

  • X
  • YouTube
  • instagram
  • facebook
  • pinterest
  • Tiktok

Join All Access

Become a member and get instant access to thousands of videos, how-tos, tool reviews, and design features.

Start Your Free Trial

Subscribe

FHB Magazine

Start your subscription today and save up to 81%

Subscribe

Enjoy unlimited access to Fine Homebuilding. Join Now

Already a member? Log in

We hope you’ve enjoyed your free articles. To keep reading, become a member today.

Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine.

Start your FREE trial

Already a member? Log in

Privacy Policy Update

We use cookies, pixels, script and other tracking technologies to analyze and improve our service, to improve and personalize content, and for advertising to you. We also share information about your use of our site with third-party social media, advertising and analytics partners. You can view our Privacy Policy here and our Terms of Use here.

Cookies

Analytics

These cookies help us track site metrics to improve our sites and provide a better user experience.

Advertising/Social Media

These cookies are used to serve advertisements aligned with your interests.

Essential

These cookies are required to provide basic functions like page navigation and access to secure areas of the website.

Delete My Data

Delete all cookies and associated data