Replies

1. 
   jim_evers | Dec 11, 1999 01:57am | #1

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   In an exterior application of T&G the tongues MUST face up so water doesn't collect in a face-up groove. In a dry interior application, the way the boards match at the corners and at the ceiling is visually important. So start at the top. Tongues down. Nail at an angle through the tongue of each new board into a stud behind. Nail guns work great for this. Good luck. jim

2. 
   Mad_Dog | Dec 11, 1999 02:05am | #2

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   I would start low and work upward, all things equal otherwise. However, moulding considerations and various runs room to room may require a different strategy, for example, if you want the courses to stay lined up as you pass from one room area to another, and the ceilings are continuous, you'll start up high and work down. Whatever is more convenient. But working from the bottom up with the tongues up lets gravity help you, not make it harder.

   Lay out all your stock in the rooms where you'll be installing it for several days so the wood can acclimate itself. If the area is not heated, I suggest you heat it. I would prefinish all the boards, shoot through the tongues on a steep enough angle so that the nail is going through some of the board, not just the tongues, and if you want to, you can add a coat of finish after installation, but it should not be necessary if you prepare them well to begin with. You might ask him why he wants you to go to the trouble of finishing a ceiling in place, it sure would add a lot of time to your project.

   MD

3. 
   Guest_ | Dec 11, 1999 08:31am | #3

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   Ms. Berg,

   As this is an interior installation, I don't think it really makes a difference if you start up and go down or vice versa unless, as stated above, you are paneling multiple rooms together.

   Just be sure to measure to the opposite end that you are working towards as you install the paneling so you don't end up with a tapered cut board for the last run. That always looks so unprofessional. You may have to fudge a little here and there to make things end up even.

   Trust me, very few rooms or ceiling are perfectly square and you may find variations in the widths of each board.

   Good luck,

   Ed. Williams

1. 
   Guest_ | Dec 12, 1999 06:26am | #4

   *Ann, The reason I would start at the bottom and work towards the top is your going to have to rip your last pcs. at the point of the ridge where they meet . Its eaisier to run one pc in square and then miter the finishing pc in for a tight joint. also if your ending up with a fairly small pc at the end of your run, you can rip the preceding course or courses smaller and have this happen far from eye level. It also allows you to start with a maximum sized pc down at the wall height which is what you will see the most. I would finish the material on the ground first. not only is iteasier but it lets you see what the finished pc is going to look like before its installed in the middle of 21 or so courses! Good luck, Steve

1. 
   Guest_ | Dec 12, 1999 09:39am | #5

   *Ann The up or down of Your siding is best left to the installer. As to finishing the material before it is up I would finish both sides, this stabilizes the material which is more of an issue in exterior applications then touch up a little after installation. Skip

4. 
   Charlie_R. | Dec 12, 1999 10:50am | #6

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   There is too much agreement on this subject.I say install 1 by 4 strapping perpendicular to rafters then install tongue and groove boards vertically,makes for a good look but a tad more difficult on installation because of having to nail at differing heights with each board.Put a false beam at the top.Do all your finishing first.Now,ready,aim type.
   Charlie

5. 
   Guest_ | Dec 13, 1999 12:35am | #7

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   Well, Charlie, as long as you're going to advocate a new look..... I think a square pattern would also look good. Strapping would be a little different but working your way around the room from the perimeter to the center - no miters, just a square cut butted up perpendicular to the previous board - and cut off the tongue of the previous board end for fit unless you like the extra work of matching grooves in the board ends.

   Here's a visual of another idea, a job we did last year. Hope the photo is as clear as some I've seen posted.

   Ralph

6. 
   Charlie_R. | Dec 13, 1999 05:54am | #8

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   Looks good Ralph.Sheetrock could never get as much attention(unless it was falling).I do think if you're going to expose vaulted ceilings its worth the extra effort and cost to dress them up with wood.

   Charlie

1. 
   Wayne_D._Muck | Jan 07, 2000 12:40am | #9

   *Ann Starting at the top or bottom depends on whether or not you are doing miltiple rooms. If it's a single room...I'd start at the bottom and work up. It's just easier to work that way. At the top, you can either install a full board and rip a miter on the closer, or you can rip a piece of wide stock on two edges to match the pitch of the ceiling and install it flat. This works well if you plan on hanging a fan from the apex of the ceiling. Gives you a flat stable surface to mount the fan on, without using a protruding block. As far as whether or not you should pre-finish. I'd go with the pre-finish everytime. If you try to finish in place, the natural expansion and contraction of the material will expose wood that you can't finish with the paneling in place. We always stain and varish the face, and seal the back. Keep some stain to match on hand and use it to cover cuts and nicks as you install. Blind nail through the tongue with a nail gun works well. Shoot the nail at a steep enough angle to catch some meat of the board and not just the tongue. Use air pressure high enough to sink the nail, or they will interfear with the next course. I've installled many ceilings this way with a senco finish gun with the rubber nose removed. It helps you to accurately align the nail placement. We always use a minimum of a 2" nail to resist withdrawal when the wood makes it's seasonal movements. In my own ceiling, I used a 2 1/2" nail. Cheap insurance. Good Luck.Wayne

1. 
   peter_johnson | Jan 10, 2000 05:18am | #10

   *If eet doesn't work Charlie, weel eet by your vault? Ceiling your fate? Can you say Parquet? Seriously, I'd just add that the final rips will tell the tale so, whichever way you go, measure before you start.Regards, Peter

1. 
   Robert_R._Kane | Jan 10, 2000 08:10am | #11

   *Having installed tens of thousands of lineal feet in just about every application imaginable, I feel I am able to share my advice having been there and done that. My first comment would be that your very capable carpenter is out of his gord if he thinks you should finish the ceiling afterwards, that is crazy. Pre finish! Now, provided your floor is level, you can set your first row of t&g by measuring from the floor to a set point on your t&g or run a string line (level) the length of your row at the bottom edge of the t&g. I somtimes pull a measurment from the peak down at each end of the room to ensure a parralell run to the peak. You can also set up a laser level if you have access to one. I always start from the bottom and go up, where my seams butt I either end match with a bevel or simply bevel (at 45 degrees) the butt ends and then stain them. I should point out that this pronounces the seam because by staining the end grain, the stain takes diferently and stays darker. Instead of trying to hide the seam I make the seam stand out. I blind nail the t&g In the tounge and the install of the above groove covers the nail head, forever hiding it. I like to run lenghts less than ten feet (unless your room is 16 feet or less in length then I run full) this creats a nice mix of grain change ond color mix and also eases the instalation as some material grades ( #2 or poorer) are prone to bowing, cupping , twisting and warping.If you encounter a bowed board, you should have a tool called a bowrench with you, this tool forces the bow out by applying downward preasure near and above the bowed area. I would also recomend checking your truss bottom cords or the underside of your rafters to ensure the members are flush with each other, if not, I would recomend you fur out the recessed ones. From one end of the room to the other, run stringlines perpendicular to your truss cords or rafters, at the bottom, middle, and top and fur down accordingly. This will give your ceiling a flat even plane that looks great. Like Wayne, I use nails which are 2" or better. I finish my installs by picture framing the perimiter with a two inch trim strip and run a 1x10 down the peak.

7. 
   Guest_ | Jan 10, 2000 08:10am | #12

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   We're building a lake cabin. In January, which we're planning to finish off the ceilings in the vaulted living/dining/kitchen area. Most people are telling us to start nailing boards from the top down placing two groove boards at the point so the tongues face downward. Others are telling us to start at the sheetrocked wall edge and work with the tongues facing upward. Is there one way which is better? Also, the very capable carpenter who is going to be installing this is telling us not to varnish the boards first, but we (who will be varnishing the boards after they're on the ceiling) would rather do this first. Any opinions/advice?