Replies

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 06, 2003 03:48pm | #1

   No one has ever done this before?  Any insight or help at all?

   Thanks

   I never met a tool I didn't like!
1. 
   BKCBUILDER | Jul 06, 2003 04:34pm | #2

    Okay, I'll bite.  I've done 17 of these in the last month, same apartment complex, all through brick, not siding, so yours will be easier. The window units come a different way, which is to say, they can be ordered with a through the wall sleeve, which is just a box, same dimensions as the OD of the air conditioner. You cut the hole for the box, set it and secure it to the framing, then the air conditioner just slides into the box from the inside. Tilt it slightly to the outside(1/4 " is fine). If I was doing it in aluminum siding, I would locate my studs on the inside, go up against one stud, then transfer my marks to the exterior, use a 4-1/2" angle grinder with a diamond blade(or cut-off wheel) cut the hole precisely, slip in some j-channel from the outside to make it look purdy,  cut drywall, slide the box in, fasten to framing, slide in air unit, slip on interior trim ring, plug in and collect the check. Chillin' like a villian!

      We charged $375 per install, the only materials we had were a steel lintel for each opening(brick) and some clear silicon, and white Quad. We did 4 units a day, 2 guys, 8 hours. Neither of us worked real hard, moving scaffold for the second story units was the only hard part. We have 33 more to do.

1. 
   Piffin | Jul 06, 2003 07:33pm | #4

   That sounds cheap to me, time you insert a header into the wall framing and triming the interior finish to the box. I've never worked with ACs before, but it seems like they are wider than a 14.5" stud space so you have to be cutting structure and dealing with it, right?

   Do these get hardwired or just pug into a recepticle?

   Is the 1/4" slope to let condensate drain out, guide rain away, or both?.

   Excellence is its own reward!

1. 
   BKCBUILDER | Jul 06, 2003 08:12pm | #5

   Actually, the unit size is 25 3/4" wide x 15-5/8 high, so I can cut the bed joints exact, and we stay to the side of one stud, and only have to cut one. I've been putting them just below a picture window, so no need for a header. The 1/4" slope is for condensate and rain run-off. $375 may be to cheap, but I did manage to get them all, and clearing $1000 a day after paying my helper is not terribly bad.

1. 
   nigelUsa | Jul 06, 2003 08:17pm | #6

   Just a note on cutting alu. siding an angle grinder with a thin metal cutting disc works great and next to no "grab" of the material. And you will need safety specs as 'stuff' flies everywhere.

2. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 06, 2003 09:31pm | #11

   Thanks for the caution on eye safety.  I had to see an ophthamologist for the second time in 2 months this past week due to flying debis while using a saw, so eye protection is formost on my mind these days.

   I also thought a thin-kerf blade might do the trick on the Al siding.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

3. 
   ccal | Jul 06, 2003 08:26pm | #7

   Ive got a similar job coming up and am thinking of renting a bucket lift. Any particular reason you didnt do that Kieth? Would it have made the job go faster without the scaffold. Lifts are about 120 per day here.

4. 
   BKCBUILDER | Jul 06, 2003 11:42pm | #13

   The units we are doing are in 6 unit apartments, where the ground floor is actually 4' in the ground, so we do those from the ground, then directly above it is the next which we catch off a 5' scaffold, then stack a 6' on top of it to get the highest unit.  I like cutting off of a 5' x 7' firm platform. I use a Stihl  TS 400 14" with a diamond, and it's nice to be able to hold it firm with my legs apart while standing on some nice firm platform. That, and when I have to hammer out the bricks, I drop the scrap into buckets set right below the "hole to be" on the platform. To me, it would be a pain to do it out of a lift, to many tools, buckets, etc. We own the scaffold, but even to rent it,with bucks, levelers and aluminum walks would be $55 for a month, at 4 per day, a lift run me a grand, and be less desireable.

5. 
   Piffin | Jul 07, 2003 12:45am | #14

   I see. That under window location is good dounding structurally and the volumn discount probably makes it work. One unit and it would be worth a good five bills, time you knock off from another job and set up clean up..

   Excellence is its own reward!

2. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 06, 2003 09:26pm | #9

   Thanks for the info.  Sounds simple enough, though the interior hole will need to be larger so I can frame in a header and new sill.  Her AC units are older ones that do not have sleeves with them, so I figured to make something similar from CDX plywood, flash it to the sheathing, prime it and paint it. 

   All in all, I agree with Piffin, 350 sounds a little cheap.  May have to jack it up a bit.  Thanks for the info.  Been a great help.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

2. 
   IMERC | Jul 06, 2003 04:50pm | #3

   To add to KC's... Get the support kit for the box. Watch the size (demensions) of the unit or you will have to put in a header. I cut alu siding with a cicular saw. Screw down the siding on the waste side of the cut. Helps prevent tear out and chattering. Go slow.

   Don't forget the safty glasses and face shield.

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 06, 2003 09:28pm | #10

   Thanks for the reply.  Already resigned to installing header and new sill.  The lady already has the units, sans sleeves.  So I'll have to improvise.  What is the support kit you mentioned?

   Thanks for the input.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

1. 
   IMERC | Jul 07, 2003 01:03am | #15

   Have a sheet metal shop make up your sleeves. The units need ventilation. Take a look at the slotting on a window units' can, you'll get the idea. Those units will have to be pitched because they will produce a lot of condensate water and they have to drain.

   The brackets are just fancey adjustable triangular brackets that support that heavy a$$ed compressor back to the building. You won't get away surface mounting them on top of the aluminium siding. You'll have to slot the siding for them. Try to hit a stud if at all possible. They can be had anywhere window units are sold. Even HD.

   A reasonable quality negative hook the more the merrier toothed carbide saw blade will slice up the siding in short order.

   Remember safty glasses, face shield and hearing protection is the rule. The schrapnel that the saw throws will be hot. Short sleeves and shorts are not the clothes to wear. Gloves can't hurt either. I wear my welding leathers. Fasten down the siding where ever you can to help prevent chattering and tear outs. J mould the cuts.

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 07, 2003 01:13am | #16

   Thanks for the time and wisdom, will take heed.

   Have a sparkling day.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

2. 
   PhillGiles | Jul 07, 2003 08:53am | #18

   Isn't this a little over-the-top ? These are window units, just make simple, old-fashioned, window frames the appropriate size: put a 2-by block in to simulate the sash and you're done..

   Phill Giles

   The Unionville Woodwright

   Unionville, Ontario

3. 
   IMERC | Jul 07, 2003 04:11pm | #19

   Thru the wall Phil without the original cans.

4. 
   PhillGiles | Jul 07, 2003 04:45pm | #20

   The post says "window units", not "through the wall" units. Window units are complete units with shells, through the wall's are bare. The post specifically asks how to mount the window-style units through a wall. If these were through the wall units you'd just pick up the phone and order a couple of wall-sleeves from the manufacturer. .

   Phill Giles

   The Unionville Woodwright

   Unionville, Ontario

5. 
   IMERC | Jul 07, 2003 05:41pm | #21

   Phil read the posts.

   You ever done one before.

   If you have all the answers take over and tell us how to do it.

6. 
   PhillGiles | Jul 07, 2003 07:55pm | #23

   Of course I've built a new hole to put in a window A/C - sorry if it offends you that someone else has an option on how to do it. .

   Phill Giles

   The Unionville Woodwright

   Unionville, Ontario

7. 
   Piffin | Jul 08, 2003 04:30am | #26

   You were confused about two different questions being discussed in the same thread. That's why he said read the posts.

   IMO.

   Excellence is its own reward!

8. 
   IMERC | Jul 08, 2003 06:55am | #28

   Thanks.... May he'll fall back and punt.

   Also I don't think he ever worked on an old modular.

   Glad Nick didn't ask any questions regarding old time modular construction or the lack of...  LOL

9. 
   Piffin | Jul 08, 2003 07:00am | #29

   Well, this was all timely for me. I just went out and bought the first AC we've ever owned - two of them in fat.

   The instruction book had for window or for through wall.

   I decided easily that I wasn't going to cut through my log wall for a tin box..

   Excellence is its own reward!

10. 
    IMERC | Jul 08, 2003 07:07am | #30

    I know. Done up to 3 ton "window" in the wall installatios.

11. 
    NormKerr | Jul 07, 2003 07:52pm | #22

    thru the wall AC units are built quite differently, inside, so that they vent all their heat correctly, only thru the back and not on the sides.

    They cost more too.

    I am concerned that putting window units thru the wall may not work out real well, in the long run, if the heat is not vented completely by the sleeve (call backs are a b*tch).

    You MAY want to make this a part of the condition of you accepting the job - that she will take responsibility for the durability for her units. It makes sense to try though, because new thru-the-wall units are pretty pricey, in my experience, and she already owns the window units.

    Just make sure to mimic all the original ventilation area in your custom sleeve.

    Norm "BTDT" Kerr

12. 
    IMERC | Jul 07, 2003 08:21pm | #24

    Okay

2. 
   jimmyk | Jul 06, 2003 08:34pm | #8

   Laser cut the hole!

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 06, 2003 09:33pm | #12

   Sounds good to me.  Got one I could borrow?

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

1. 
   jimmyk | Jul 07, 2003 04:28am | #17

   Heh...if only it was that easy.

3. 
   BossHog | Jul 07, 2003 10:03pm | #25

   My only (argueably) intelligent thought is to say think about putting the unit higher up in the wall.

   If they're down near the floor, like in a motel, they're always in the way. Put 'em up higher and it makes the floor space more available.

   It's also easier to adjust the controls if they're about at eye level and ya don't have to bend over.

   I hate intolerance.

1. 
   NickNukeEm | Jul 08, 2003 04:53am | #27

   Thanks for the thought.  I hear you, but this is for a little old lady that stands five foot even standing straight up, which she can rarely achieve.  Probably put it about 4-5 feet off the floor.

   I never met a tool I didn't like!

4. 
   IMERC | Jul 09, 2003 03:29am | #31

   Okay, I give, yes what?